The front 7

[Steve]

I think some people have forgotten last year.
In a 12-4 season.
J. Brown had 9 starts. Is he deserve a chance to be in ?
D. Perryman started 8 games. Is he so fragile?
K. Emanuel started 7 games including 2 at MLB. Is he the best #5 or 6 LB in that league ?

I don't know what "start" means anymore (or for the last 20 years for that matter)?

Emmanuel plays OTTO/SAM LB in the regular 43 personnel and in the 6 man DL goalline/short-yardage package. He is not a regular player. He is a role player. He plays in run downs. When teams play their 11 personnel (3WR) , he is the first guy off the field. ANyone who replaces him is going to be used in EXACTLY the same way.

The argument always gets made that Emmanuel is such a liability in pass coverage. The is a lot of truth in that, except I still say it is not a huge issue. First, teams play their 3 WR packages against us 76% of the time. The field is too short for many of the other downs for him to get beaten too badly in coverage . So, yes he is a bit of a liability, but that is a gut reaction more than anything. Teams are not going after him that much, because he is simply not one the field that much.

To me, the OTTO/SAM LB spot is simply about another edge defender. Nwosu is going to start (probably), so use a backup OTTO as another place to stash another OLB/DE tweener. We don't have a true LEO rush LB/DE, so adding at least 1 (or even 2) via the draft, cheap FA or UDFA is not a bad idea. Add them in bulk, especially since big guys who can run are always useful as ST and short-yardage role players. Use them as extra TE/FB types to block and catch TD if the other team forgets to cover them. Their day job is to learn to play on the edge and rush the QB.

Emmanuel is not a very good pass rusher, which is my big knock against him. I like the depth he adds, and maybe they will bring him back. If we are going to keep an extra LB to play ST, I would rather it be him than Dzubnar. Dzubnar is just a ST who sucks when he plays D, and commits a lot of PF on ST, so the fact that he makes some tackles is boarderline production in the plus/minus viewpoint. Emmanuel as another backup ST ace type would be fine.

Brown may not deserve much chance based on starts, but he was playing pretty well last year before he got hurt. He played well as a rookie to, but then the year after struggled to pick up Gus Bradley D. He is in the final year of his rookie deal, so he is too cheap to let go. He deserves a chance to earn playing time. But none of our LB deserves to be given ANY playing time. He has to improve, but he got a lot better last year. He also has to get healthy. He is too cheap and productive to not give him another chance. You are going to have a hard time getting a faster LB.

Perryman - similar to Brown, but he too is on a 1 year deal with an option for a 2nd. Same for Thomas Davis.

White is the 4th choice at LB, so he fills out the roster pretty well. If we are going to purge the roster for injury prone guys, he is not going to be long for the team, given his already being hurt, and his family history.

We can add another LB via the draft. It just depends on who we get. Normally, teams only keep a starter and a backup at each spot.

OTTO - Nwosu/
Mike - Perryman/Davis
Will - Brown/White
plus Emmanuel in place of Dzubnar(?).

The only spot that seems like it needs help is OTTO, particularly since we don't have a true LEO backup either.

[wu-dai clan]

I don't know what "start" means anymore (or for the last 20 years for that matter)?

Emmanuel plays OTTO/SAM LB in the regular 43 personnel and in the 6 man DL goalline/short-yardage package. He is not a regular player. He is a role player. He plays in run downs. When teams play their 11 personnel (3WR) , he is the first guy off the field. ANyone who replaces him is going to be used in EXACTLY the same way.

The argument always gets made that Emmanuel is such a liability in pass coverage. The is a lot of truth in that, except I still say it is not a huge issue. First, teams play their 3 WR packages against us 76% of the time. The field is too short for many of the other downs for him to get beaten too badly in coverage . So, yes he is a bit of a liability, but that is a gut reaction more than anything. Teams are not going after him that much, because he is simply not one the field that much.

To me, the OTTO/SAM LB spot is simply about another edge defender. Nwosu is going to start (probably), so use a backup OTTO as another place to stash another OLB/DE tweener. We don't have a true LEO rush LB/DE, so adding at least 1 (or even 2) via the draft, cheap FA or UDFA is not a bad idea. Add them in bulk, especially since big guys who can run are always useful as ST and short-yardage role players. Use them as extra TE/FB types to block and catch TD if the other team forgets to cover them. Their day job is to learn to play on the edge and rush the QB.

Emmanuel is not a very good pass rusher, which is my big knock against him. I like the depth he adds, and maybe they will bring him back. If we are going to keep an extra LB to play ST, I would rather it be him than Dzubnar. Dzubnar is just a ST who sucks when he plays D, and commits a lot of PF on ST, so the fact that he makes some tackles is boarderline production in the plus/minus viewpoint. Emmanuel as another backup ST ace type would be fine.

Brown may not deserve much chance based on starts, but he was playing pretty well last year before he got hurt. He played well as a rookie to, but then the year after struggled to pick up Gus Bradley D. He is in the final year of his rookie deal, so he is too cheap to let go. He deserves a chance to earn playing time. But none of our LB deserves to be given ANY playing time. He has to improve, but he got a lot better last year. He also has to get healthy. He is too cheap and productive to not give him another chance. You are going to have a hard time getting a faster LB.

Perryman - similar to Brown, but he too is on a 1 year deal with an option for a 2nd. Same for Thomas Davis.

White is the 4th choice at LB, so he fills out the roster pretty well. If we are going to purge the roster for injury prone guys, he is not going to be long for the team, given his already being hurt, and his family history.

We can add another LB via the draft. It just depends on who we get. Normally, teams only keep a starter and a backup at each spot.

OTTO - Nwosu/
Mike - Perryman/Davis
Will - Brown/White
plus Emmanuel in place of Dzubnar(?).

The only spot that seems like it needs help is OTTO, particularly since we don't have a true LEO backup either.

My select candidates for this role are Te'von Coney round 4 or Maxx Crosby round 6.

[Steve]

Coney has some good traits, but his feet worry me. His first step could be better, but all the rest of them after the first he looks more and more awkward. He has been used exclusively at ILB, and that is not usually a position where people have footwork issues.

Crosby is the type of player, although I think he would end up just being a backup LEO. Maybe not the best example, but he is the type of player I think if you can get them on the roster, might develop and let us bring players on in waves to keep pass rushers fresh.

[Maniaque 6]

What do you think of that ?
The OTTO is stupid, don't worry about it

I don't know about you, but I'm over the whole "LEO", "OTTO" and "LOTTO" nonsense. They're just buzzwords that over complicate things. The Jaguars want one of their linebackers to be more of a hybrid 3-4 outside linebacker than a traditional linebacker. It's going to be on the field probably about 40 percent, if not less, of the time because that is the linebacker that is going to come off on coverage downs. They will be used sometimes as stand up pass rushers in situations where they team is selling out to get to the quarterback and so on.

[beachcomber]

Jamie Collins is a SAMOTTO, and personally think he could play alongside our WIL of choice when we go 4-2-5/nickel ??

and Nick Perry/Aaron Lynch are primarily 3-4 OLBs.... could either one of them handle pass coverage responsibilities @SAM ??

[blueman]

The issue with downplaying Emanuel's liabilities is that when forced into a starting role, those liabilities can be deadly. Will that be true for any backup LB we bring in to replace him? Dunno, but I am fine with finding out.

[Steve]

Jamie Collins is a SAMOTTO, and personally think he could play alongside our WIL of choice when we go 4-2-5/nickel ??

and Nick Perry/Aaron Lynch are primarily 3-4 OLBs.... could either one of them handle pass coverage responsibilities @SAM ??

Collins has always been weak when it comes to being physical and redirecting a TE. Not as good at setting the edge and playing the outside run as some SAM OLB.

However, he makes up for it by being a decent pass rusher, and having pretty good read and react skills. He also runs pretty well and gets good drops in coverage. kinda a solid at everything type of LB, even though he doesn't really excel at anything.

Perry is probably not going to handle the coverage responsibilities too well. He has almost exclusively been used as a pass rusher. Lynch has always been better in space, than using his hands and rushing the passer. He has had some trouble with his weight getting too high and not being able to run like he should.

[beachcomber]

Nwosu has always been weak when it comes to being physical and redirecting a TE. Not as good at setting the edge and playing the outside run as some SAM OLB.

However, he makes up for it by being a decent pass rusher, and having pretty good read and react skills. He also runs pretty well and gets good drops in coverage. kinda a solid at everything type of LB, even though he doesn't really excel at anything.

hopefully we can substitute in the above name and be ok heading into next season, and.... what do we do for a backup/reinforcement @SAMIKE ??

(Josh Allen would be nice

[Topcat]

I don't know what "start" means anymore (or for the last 20 years for that matter)?

Emmanuel plays OTTO/SAM LB in the regular 43 personnel and in the 6 man DL goalline/short-yardage package. He is not a regular player. He is a role player. He plays in run downs. When teams play their 11 personnel (3WR) , he is the first guy off the field. ANyone who replaces him is going to be used in EXACTLY the same way.

The argument always gets made that Emmanuel is such a liability in pass coverage. The is a lot of truth in that, except I still say it is not a huge issue. First, teams play their 3 WR packages against us 76% of the time. The field is too short for many of the other downs for him to get beaten too badly in coverage . So, yes he is a bit of a liability, but that is a gut reaction more than anything. Teams are not going after him that much, because he is simply not one the field that much.

To me, the OTTO/SAM LB spot is simply about another edge defender. Nwosu is going to start (probably), so use a backup OTTO as another place to stash another OLB/DE tweener. We don't have a true LEO rush LB/DE, so adding at least 1 (or even 2) via the draft, cheap FA or UDFA is not a bad idea. Add them in bulk, especially since big guys who can run are always useful as ST and short-yardage role players. Use them as extra TE/FB types to block and catch TD if the other team forgets to cover them. Their day job is to learn to play on the edge and rush the QB.

Emmanuel is not a very good pass rusher, which is my big knock against him. I like the depth he adds, and maybe they will bring him back. If we are going to keep an extra LB to play ST, I would rather it be him than Dzubnar. Dzubnar is just a ST who sucks when he plays D, and commits a lot of PF on ST, so the fact that he makes some tackles is boarderline production in the plus/minus viewpoint. Emmanuel as another backup ST ace type would be fine.

Brown may not deserve much chance based on starts, but he was playing pretty well last year before he got hurt. He played well as a rookie to, but then the year after struggled to pick up Gus Bradley D. He is in the final year of his rookie deal, so he is too cheap to let go. He deserves a chance to earn playing time. But none of our LB deserves to be given ANY playing time. He has to improve, but he got a lot better last year. He also has to get healthy. He is too cheap and productive to not give him another chance. You are going to have a hard time getting a faster LB.

Perryman - similar to Brown, but he too is on a 1 year deal with an option for a 2nd. Same for Thomas Davis.

White is the 4th choice at LB, so he fills out the roster pretty well. If we are going to purge the roster for injury prone guys, he is not going to be long for the team, given his already being hurt, and his family history.

We can add another LB via the draft. It just depends on who we get. Normally, teams only keep a starter and a backup at each spot.

OTTO - Nwosu/
Mike - Perryman/Davis
Will - Brown/White
plus Emmanuel in place of Dzubnar(?).

The only spot that seems like it needs help is OTTO, particularly since we don't have a true LEO backup either.

Good analysis, Steve. I guess one problem I have with Emmanuel is when they have him in on "run downs," but the opposing O passes. And here is where Emmanuel is a liability in coverage. How about if we sign via draft or FA, a SAM LB who can not only set the edge, but COVER?

[blueman]

Even on run downs, unless the play is directly at him, Emanuel is a liability. Hope we do not bring him back, I would rather watch a new guy fail at backup LB than him.

[Lone Bolt]

The issue with downplaying Emanuel's liabilities is that when forced into a starting role, those liabilities can be deadly. Will that be true for any backup LB we bring in to replace him? Dunno, but I am fine with finding out.

Backups have liabilities...thats why they are backups. On all those losing teams last year? A lot of their starters have liabilities....nevermind backups...

Honestly, some of you guys want us to have all pros, 2 deep at every position...just doesn't work that way. K. Emmanuel may be a liability in coverage, but he is not against the run, and he can play DE, Otto, Mike, and special teams. To me, that's quality depth. Emmanuel is starting on half or more of the teams in this league...and anybody who is an improvement on him is likely looking for a starting gig somewhere...not a backup role. So who are you gonna replace him with?

Now...if you come across a talent in the draft to develop, someone with a higher projected ceiling than Emmanuel...and maybe even Nwosu? Then, you might have to make a little room, and in that scenario, I could understand letting Kyle go...and that may be why we haven't signed him back yet...we are staying flexible. But I'd welcome him back in a heartbeat.

[Lone Bolt]

Good analysis, Steve. I guess one problem I have with Emmanuel is when they have him in on "run downs," but the opposing O passes. And here is where Emmanuel is a liability in coverage. How about if we sign via draft or FA, a SAM LB who can not only set the edge, but COVER?

Actually just saw that....Steve makes even better points than me...honestly, Kyle has outplayed his draft position for us...you think there would be a little more love and tolerance for the guy...a very solid dude, solid(if not spectacular) player, and I appreciated his contributions to the team these past few years.