Future With Lynn?

[BoltUp InLA]

Yes. That is exactly what I'm doing.

Are you watching the games?!!!!??!!

They have lost keystone players all year, part of year , and in 2nd half of games.

Allen played 12 snaps vs Saints. 2 catches 29 yards and a TD.
Didn't play rest of game, back spasms.

Bosa missed most of 2nd half vs Denver with concussion. He hasn't played a single snap since.

Hayward got hurt and wasn't on field late in 4th quarter.

I could go on and on...... Ekeler.....Harris... Starters who were part of first half leads but didn't finish the game.

Lynn won't use it as an excuse, but I will use it as a reason the team has struggled at times to finish games.

Very good argument! I didn’t realize the amount of KEY players injured / loss during KEY stretches of those games. I think it is more than just plausible that those injuries played a role in those losses on a not so deep and depleted roster already. I agree that the Chargers coaching staff could have done some things differently, but that can be said for every coaching staff in the league. Every team outside the Steelers have laid goose eggs during this season.

I can’t say it enough times that this coaching staff has been so critical in the overseeing and development of the Chargers next franchise QB. Some posters might argue that Lynn should be fired because he did not start the rookie QB from the start, but it was most posters who didn’t believe he would be this good and most did not like the pick at all.

We do not know how much better Tyrod would have played this year in this revamped offense due to the rib injury he sustained early on in that first game.. There was talk from the Chargers camp that Tyrod may very well have surprised!

There is plenty more growth to be had by Herbert still of which I am fully confident he will achieve. I am of the belief that it’s Herbert’s development that is so critical now and the last thing the Chargers should do is pull the rug from underneath him, at least this early on his career.

[dmac_bolt]

You took out context and details.
And completely missed my point.
No wonder you think I'm delusional.

The devil is in the details. The point about Payton was having a great hall of fame QB Brees in his prime and a very very healthy and talented team that year.

The point about Reid was about how long it took to finally get to the top of the mountain. And again with his greatest QB he ever had in Mahomes to finally do it.

And Belichek about how long it took before he started winning games. And again it didn't happen until he got the Goat of QBs. And by the way that Bill Belichick was also the defacto GM of that Browns team that was the current Ravens organization. The director of player personnel under Belichek was the one of the all time great player evaluator Ozzie Newsome. They had Magini and Shawrtz on the staff. Get out of here with those Art Modell Browns were this horrible organization. The new 1999 expansion Browns were horrible. That old Browns left for more money in Baltimore just like Spanos to LA.

I'm comparing details of resumes. To show Lynn is being asked to measure up to others without the same time and leeway to get it done. Basically he is being held to a higher standard than these Superbowl winning HCs were when they started coaching. Based on the Lynn standard Belichek should have never ever got another job after his Browns job failed to produce results. You think the Spanos know how to build a championship team. How many GMs and HCs before they get to top of mountain.

Reid was winning game before Mahomes with Alex The Game Manager Smith. Still losing in the playoffs as he did his entire career pre-Patrick

He was the Marty Schott of the East until Patrick. Which is a lot fucking better than AL. He’s built solid winning organizations twice, thats two more times than AL. Marty did it 3 times and got fired from each. Go figure ...

[Critty]

looking over the Dolphins depth chart, not sure eye saw much if any massive talent advantage over the Chargers same.... save for one ??

Brian Flores

I like Brian Flores a lot.
Chargers out scored them 21-15 over final 3 quarters.
It was the tough start down 14 in 1st quarter that was enough for Miami to get it done. That 1st drive Ballage missing his block on 3rd down for a 3 and out and Long butterfinger the ball on punt block.. And then Meeks jumping offside on Miami FG. So.....they Chargers flipped their problem from not being able to go finish to not being able to start. Just kidding. Its football. Coaches coach players play. What I will say is Ballage and Meeks would be on practice squad if starters were healthy. Again Lynn won't make excuses. He will just keep getting them ready and keep pointing out they have the responsibility to execute their assignments to play great football. Im the one the is making the excuse that he is having to play too many back ups and try to get starter production from them.
Dolphins have been a healthier team. 4 of 5 o-line starting all 9. Kicker has been better. Secondary is bit better. Their Returner Grant is one of fastest players in the entire league. Compare him to Desmond and Hill. He is a more explosive punt returner by far.
But you know if Grant was on Chargers he would muff those punts or if their kicker was on Chargers he would have already missed 5 FG like Badgely.... including a game winner vs Saints because Stewart would be coaching him. LOL.

[Boltjolt]

I like Brian Flores a lot.
Chargers out scored them 21-15 over final 3 quarters.
It was the tough start down 14 in 1st quarter that was enough for Miami to get it done. That 1st drive Ballage missing his block on 3rd down for a 3 and out and Long butterfinger the ball on punt block.. And then Meeks jumping offside on Miami FG. So.....they Chargers flipped their problem from not being able to go finish to not being able to start. Just kidding. Its football. Coaches coach players play. What I will say is Ballage and Meeks would be on practice squad if starters were healthy. Again Lynn won't make excuses. He will just keep getting them ready and keep pointing out they have the responsibility to execute their assignments to play great football. Im the one the is making the excuse that he is having to play too many back ups and try to get starter production from them.
Dolphins have been a healthier team. 4 of 5 o-line starting all 9. Kicker has been better. Secondary is bit better. Their Returner Grant is one of fastest players in the entire league. Compare him to Desmond and Hill. He is a more explosive punt returner by far.
But you know if Grant was on Chargers he would muff those punts or if their kicker was on Chargers he would have already missed 5 FG like Badgely.... including a game winner vs Saints because Stewart would be coaching him. LOL.

The Dolphins had injured starters too bro. You keep talking about injuries and there is something to that but cmon man, the Dolphins RB Ahmed who chewed us up would be on their PS if not for injuries as well. Grant just recently the last couple is playing because of injuries.

Kyle Van Noy left the game against us
DT- Christian Wilkins didnt play
WR-Preston Williams didnt play
RB- Miles Gaskin didnt play
NT- Davon Godshaux didnt play
WR- Allen Hurns didnt play
RB -Jordon Howard didnt play
WR- Albert Wilson didnt play

And most of all....FitzMagic didnt play. Tua was mediocre.

[powderblueboy]

Yes. That is exactly what I'm doing.

Are you watching the games?!!!!??!!

They have lost keystone players all year, part of year , and in 2nd half of games.

Allen played 12 snaps vs Saints. 2 catches 29 yards and a TD.
Didn't play rest of game, back spasms.

Bosa missed most of 2nd half vs Denver with concussion. He hasn't played a single snap since.

Hayward got hurt and wasn't on field late in 4th quarter.

I could go on and on...... Ekeler.....Harris... Starters who were part of first half leads but didn't finish the game.

Lynn won't use it as an excuse, but I will use it as a reason the team has struggled at times to finish games.

Off of memory, Carolina was missing their best offensive and defensive player the entire game; Denver was missing their best defensive player...there were of course other injuries these teams sustained. Which team had their starting corner go out in the 4rth, and yet we failed to attack the replacement?

You pretend as if the other team is always at full strength.
Wasn't it awful Jacksonville that this team had 2 weeks to prepare for, and yet it took a gift special teams fumble to secure the win?

Win some damn games.

[powderblueboy]

Badgely
Facyson
Kelley
Ballage
Meeks
:coffee:

You are blaming these players for the 2 - 7 record? Seriously? Two of them are running backs....this head coach can't even coach them up? What use does he then serve?

Just a couple of questions to ponder.

[21&500]

Critty
Of all the games to make your point, Miami just isn’t the one. Respectfully.
I wish so much Flores was our coach.

[Critty]

The Dolphins had injured starters too bro. You keep talking about injuries and there is something to that but cmon man, the Dolphins RB Ahmed who chewed us up would be on their PS if not for injuries as well. Grant just recently the last couple is playing because of injuries.

Kyle Van Noy left the game against us
DT- Christian Wilkins didnt play
WR-Preston Williams didnt play
RB- Miles Gaskin didnt play
NT- Davon Godshaux didnt play
WR- Allen Hurns didnt play
RB -Jordon Howard didnt play
WR- Albert Wilson didnt play

And most of all....FitzMagic didnt play. Tua was mediocre.

Good point.
Miami O-line has bit been healthier. And that helps any QB or RB. Aren't you big time critical of Chargers ability to build a consistent o-line over the years. Thought the game was pretty even besides the 1st quarter Charger mistakes giving them 10 extra points. And think those 2 dropped interceptions would have been impactful if they made those plays. I also thought Miami had more speed at RB and Returners. Nice list of players they are missing. But I don't see anyone as impactful as Bosa or James. And of course Dolphins play a more aggressive style of defense.

Speaking of aggressive defense. The Jamal Wall, Merriman, Philips defense was very aggressive under Wade Philips. But the defense stop being so productive once they no longer had those players. Merriman had a 17 sacks season in 2006 and he only played 12 games. Wow. I seemed to remember as the talent went away with injury, suspension or retirement. The defense production fell off and eventually there was decision to switch to 4-3 defense because they didnq't have the talent to play the 3-4 very well anymore. Well that means the front office failed to keep the cupboard stock with the type of talent the suits their system.

I wouldn't mind changing to a Steelers defensive scheme.
Think this Chargers roster have some players that can play that style. And then build upon it and draft linebackers every year.

I think if Derwin James is on the field. Bradley has him being more aggressive. He is a playmaker. Don't see many plays being made right now.

Anyways whatever scheme....you need healthy playmakers and great depth at keystone positions otherwise you end up struggling at times. Even the best defenses in league right now give up about 20pts a game on avg. Nobody is shutting anybody down on a regular basis in the NFL.

[Guest]

Okay, so you want to evaluate Lynn in a vacuum without taking into account the rest of the organization? How would that even work? He wasn’t given a fresh new team and GM to work with that had no baggage to deal with. I’m sure you remember the move from San Diego to LA. There’s nothing “illogical” about looking at the whole picture.

focusing only on Lynn (and his coaches) you would have to be able to view an alternate reality to say with absolute certainty that his record would be anything other than what it is. Obviously injuries play a part and you can make the logical assumption that if they never had an injury, they would have a better record, but his record is what it is, he’s the coach of a 2 and 7 football team. he has the same issues that every other NFL head coach has and right now.

I brought up his coaching staff because, in my opinion, this is where he fails the most. Failing over and over again to help or replace these coaches that are underachieving is completely BECAUSE OF him and does reflect on him as a head coach. I’m not going to call out play calling because that can just as well be an execution issue, the other teams get paid to play as well. His clock management has been called out by quite a few people. My opinion of Lynn is that he’s an average NFL coach, nothing spectacular, but certainly not the worst one out there.

I am not evaluating Lynn in a vacuum. I am identifying things for which Lynn is unquestionably responsible. There is no mystery here at all.

Lynn is responsible for not starting Herbert on day 1. And worse than that, absent Taylor's punctured lung incident, there is no evidence that Lynn would have started Herbert at all this season. Herbert is the future of the franchise and from day 1 was 10 times better than Taylor. There is no way that a head coach should be permitted to make mistakes of that magnitude with the player that has been chosen to be the future of the franchise.

Under Lynn, we would have continued with that piece of crap offense we showed against the Bengals and not the great offense that has emerged even in the face of Lynn's horrible game plans and in game decisions. That reality alone is more than enough for me to fire Lynn.

But if you want in game tactical errors, there is no shortage of those.

Tampa Bay--When you are at your own 6 yard line with 47 seconds left in the half and the other team cannot prevent you from kneeling on the ball to end the first half, you end the half. Instead, we decide to go into Joe Pisarcik mode. Only Anthony Lynn does that. The expected points of that starting field position are negative. Yes, the players failed to execute, but more importantly, they never should have been placed in that position.

Jacksonville--And to prove that "you can't fix stupid", after having failed to kneel from his own 6 yard line, Lynn decided to go full turtle instead of taking the free Hail Mary from his own 40 against Jacksonville at the end of the first half of that game, kneeling instead. So, you are going to run plays from the 6 yard line, but kneel at the 40 yard line. Okay....

Las Vegas--The misuse of timeouts by Lynn likely cost the team the game against Las Vegas. First, Lynn failed to call timeout to get Herbert back into the game on the critical 4th quarter potentially game tying 2 point conversion.

Then, Lynn failed to call timeout on the final possession, waiting for a booth review to happen. Naturally, an immediate timeout call would have given the booth any time it might have needed to initiate any booth review and would have kept an additional 20+ seconds on the clock.

This failure cost the team two plays on the final goal to go series. The team likely would have won the game but for Lynn's strategic mistakes. I certainly would have liked our chances with Herbert having two more chances to throw the game winning TD pass (or one more chance and a tying FG attempt had Lynn called the earlier timeout and Herbert had converted the 2 point conversion).

Good NFL head coaches simply do not make these kinds of obvious in game tactical errors.

But the real, deeply rooted disease that is Anthony Lynn manifests itself as follows:

New Orleans--With a 20-3 lead and 2:30 left in the first half, the team had the ball at its own 18 yard line. New Orleans had multiple timeouts left. Unlike the case with 47 seconds left, this is a case in which the lead could be extended and in which there is enough time remaining for the Saints to do something if they get the ball back quickly. So, the best strategy here is to try to extend the lead, but also, and at a minimum, be sure that the remaining time is used.

And here is where Lynn does not get it. The best way to burn the clock is not by blindly running the ball because that will likely lead to a punt after New Orleans expends timeouts with very little time coming off of the clock. Instead, the focus should be on getting first downs. What is the best way for the team to get first downs? Well, how was the team getting most of its yardage? Herbert had already thrown for 3 TD passes in the first half and was carving the Saints up, so the answer was obvious. The team needed to use the passing attack at least to control the ball, but also possibly to score.

But with Lynn's approach, we ran twice, got -2 yards and were put in third and long, a known passing situation, which the Saints were able to defend.

Denver--And this game is further proof that Lynn does not get it. On three possessions in a row in which we had the ball late in Denver territory, we went run heavy, and were quickly forced into third and long known passing situations. The result was an INT and two FGs instead of possibly up to 3 TDs. Lynn seems to equate running the ball with killing the clock, but that only works if the team is getting first downs by running the ball. If the team does not run effectively, but does pass effectively, then the team actually ends up burning less clock because it is killing drives instead of extending them with additional first downs. And the team is potentially losing out on points. Further, the failed early down running plays put the passing game in the worst position possible, a known passing situation, which makes the passing game less effective also.

Miami--This game is conclusive proof that Lynn does not get it. Evidently not recognizing his huge role in costing the team the New Orleans and Denver games with his turtle conservative approach, Lynn decided it would be appropriate to spend almost the entire game going run heavy on early downs, repeatedly putting the team in known passing situations and setting up Miami for its best results.

Since the game, Lynn has been utterly oblivious to the impact of his iditoic coaching. Cameron Buford even gently pointed it out to Lynn in the postgame press conference when he noted that Lynn's strategy took the ball out of the hands of the team's most explosive offensive player (Herbert), and Lynn still didn't get it. How any NFL head coach could fail to understand that is mind boggling.

Instead, Lynn has focused on how Miami is a good team that outplayed his team. Miami may be a fine team, but there is absolutely no appreciation of the fact that his stupid game plan put the game on a silver platter for the Dolphins to take. You know what might have been fun to watch? A game in which the explosive Los Angeles Charger passing attack took on a solid Miami team. We put our best foot forward and they put their best foot forward. I could live with that result from a coaching standpoint, but not with our laying down to get trampled heavy turtle anemic rushing attack offensive recipe to lose game plan.

And all of the above obvious failings of Lynn, examples that are far from being exhaustive and that have nothing to do with the players, the GM or ownership, are in addition to the record setting blown leads, the complete inability to win a game against a divisional opponent in the past two years (0-9 and counting), and the inability to win in one score games (3-16 since the beginning of the 2019 season with all 3 wins being the result of key opponent errors).

There really is a strong case to be made for the firing of Anthony Lynn.

[Critty]

Critty
Of all the games to make your point, Miami just isn’t the one. Respectfully.
I wish so much Flores was our coach.

Tua tossed the rock for potential interceptions that would have been big time momentum plays. Ballage had issues with his assignments on the 1st series. Long butterfinger. Meeks jumped offside. Chargers outscore them 21-15 after losing the 1st quarter 14-0.

They were not out coached. They were out played.

Coaches coach players play.

If Chargers catch those interceptions, that likely does it and they beat Flores Dolphins. Just like Badgely make a kick vs Saints and it's a win. Williams or Parhnam make a catch and it's a win. Facyson knock the ball down on 4th down and it's a win. Pitch play to Ekeler works and it's a win. 5 plays made. 5 wins.

And in my opinion if those 5 plays were made, they are 7-2. All of you wanting Lynn fired should still want him fired because the coaching and game preparation and adjustments are all the same. The results changed when a few game winning plays were made by players on the field. Yet somehow if those 5 plays were made, I think most of you would put down the pitchforks.

When they have a chance to make impactful game changing plays and don't make the play.....then You end up on the short end of things. As soon as I see them no longer in position to make plays to win games. As soon as I see them pointing fingers at each other and giving up on Lynn. Then I'll pick up my pitchfork too.

[beachcomber]

roster plus or minus from last year ??

QB * we got rid of Philip "the Problem" Rivers for Tyrod "the Solution" Taylor, and then took it up another notch w/Kid Herbie.... GAIN in talent from last season/game one, no ??
RB * addition by subtraction w/the loss of MG3, we were 1-3 w/Ekeler in the lineup, new rook that had good first game and then what happened ?? JJ has been back for 6 games.... LOSS
WR * Keenan on pace w/last season, MW a notch below, Guyton/Tyron a plus over last year's blocking WR Andre Patton, minimal love from the rooks.... N/C
TE * Henry ahead of last year, Virgil is out, Parham picking up his pass catch production but not blocking contribution.... LOSS
OT * Campen has Tevi ahead of last season, Pips 'bout the same, Bulaga mostly unavailable after nada from Okung last season.... GAIN in talent contribution
OG * Lamp a solid so far, Turner mostly like Bulaga and some uneven play otherwise which wasn't unlike last season.... GAIN
OC * Qberry was decent/serviceable by most accounts, albeit Campen has Feeney playing pretty well, again by most accounts.... GAIN in talent

NT * Mebane was past expiration, and Linval has played way more snaps than most peoples imagined.... GAIN in talent
3T * when available JJ seems to be making a diff, Tillery has moved outside some, and Broughton is still MIA.... N/C
DE * Bosa has fallen off from last season due to nagging injuries and haven't heard much from Rochell, albeit Tillery has regained his Notre Dame form in getting pressures.... LOSS
LEO * Mel has been a shell of himself and Nwosu surprisingly hasn't seen the turf much.... LOSS
SAM * yawn.... N/C
MIKE * Denzel has made plays but is on the pine more oft than not, Murray was the first round trade up solution, albeit is still developing and Tranq went down.... GAIN
WIL * Kenneth has seen time here, Vigil was brought in as well.... GAIN
CB * statistically Hayward is having an up year, Mike D. has a pick six, Harris went down, King went out, and we haven't heard Campbell's name mentioned much which is prolly a good thing.... N/C
S * we still have an elite S back there and the near rook phenom to be, minus the dissenting Teamer who is MIA, w/Derwin missing most of last season, and the team 1-4 w/him back.... N/C

coaching * we've had Stitch for the full season/offseason, added Pep, and.... ?? still treading water.... N/C

so overall, think Telesco has made several changes that Lynn had been campaigning for, and.... N/C
and yeah we've had injuries and some changeup/over in talent, and.... basically we're what we were last year, if that.
Philip wasn't the problem, losing Whiz didn't seem to change much, 'specially looking at that first game in Cincy, has Murray been a difference maker, did losing Desmond help ??
who was the driving force behind drafting Herbert, who wanted Campen here, and who caved and decided we best bring in a NT for once in a very long while ??

looking things over would like to see Denzel starting @MIKE and see some Nwosu on D.
on O, still don't understand the Feeney to center, as would prefer him @RG and to put Qberry (or Groy) back in @the OC.
my biggest disappointment/confusion regarding the O is the lack of progress/development from Joshua Kelly and KJ Hill, both of whom eye thought were going to make contributions this season.
how much of that is (a lack of) talent, and how much is on coaching ?? they both had their chances, albeit have they been well handled/coached up ??

Lynn got alot of what he wanted.... no mas Felipe Rios, good bye Ken, Murray for Perryman, Harris for King, and he was able to retain his Asst. HC
personnel wise do think that the Bulaga (injury) situation is not wholly unexpected and coulda been hedged against, albeit Pips had been coming on by most accounts.
was not aware of any injury concerns w/Trai Turner ??
personally think we woulda been competitive w/Tyrod, but not world beaters.
Lynn was not successful holding back Justin, but not sure he hasn't held back some of the development of other rooks ??
as really think Kelly and Hill are much better than they've shown, and wondering why Nasir has been slow to develop ??
back to the injury bug, do think that MW, Bosa and Mel are all injury concerns and need to be accounted for as such, albeit Austin and Virgil had no such previous concerns that am aware of ??
Denzel, Justin Jones, Lamp, Henry, Keenan, Justin Jackson and the Nas have all held up relatively well.... durability needs to be a major factor in the eval process ??

John Spanos hired AL, and had a hand in bringing in Telesco.... he's gonna have to make the call.
personally think Telesco does what is asked of him, and unless you want a more maverick/free thinking GM, then hard to put too much on him.
AL is responsible for the vibe/energetic of the team/building, and not sure he has succeeded in that of late, 'specially w/the departures of King, Phil and the Whiz, and the retention of George ??

[beachcomber]

it goes both ways.... the Miami center gifted us 10 points.... how would we have been without those ??