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How Is Herbert This Good This Fast?

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  • How Is Herbert This Good This Fast?

    I posted a couple long posts about Justin Herbert right after the draft, giving the Oregon fan's perspective on why he had a chance to be really good and why the experts who doubted him were getting it wrong. So I was certainly among those who expected him to be a good NFL starting quarterback, but even so, his play so far this season has blown me away. I thought he could be this guy, but never would have thought he'd look BETTER in the NFL than he did against top college competition this quickly. In my previous posts, I referenced two of the three key things that I see as answering how he is playing this well, this fast, but I also wanted to add one more.

    1. His situation at Oregon was by far the worst of the top three quarterbacks. The conservative coaching, simplistic passing scheme and poor receiver play made him look much more inconsistent and less dominant than he really was.

    2. He has actually significantly improved his footwork and mechanics since he left Oregon with legit quarterback coaching. He never did the QB camp circuit or had a personal quarterback coach or any of the extra coaching that top groomed quarterbacks all over the country routinely have these days. Working with quarterback coach John Beck during the pre-draft and offseason, followed by intense tutelage from Pep Hamilton once he was with the Chargers has made a huge difference. The reason this intensive work has made such a dramatic difference in Herbert's consistent accuracy (largely due to footwork and cleaning up mechanics) is that he'd never had that sort of coaching before and he therefore had a chance at some rapid and explosive growth.

    3. Until this year, he had never devoted all of his considerable talent and intellect toward football. This is not to say that he wasn't dedicated before. As I mentioned in a previous post, he was the guy organizing summer workouts and was the unquestioned offensive leader of those Oregon teams his last two seasons, but he also was extremely committed to success in the classroom. You don't get a 4.0 in Biology without putting in the hours and the energy. That's at least 20+ hours a week devoted to intense mental work outside of football. Even going back to high school, Herbert was a three sport athlete, shining as an elite pitcher in baseball and a key player on his high school hoops squad. He has spent his life being well rounded and being successful at nearly every challenge he has taken on. Focusing those diverse talents on one goal, becoming the best NFL quarterback he can be, is clearly paying dividends and has helped him accelerate his learning curve beyond what almost anyone thought was possible (particularly with this low rep offseason).

    There are probably other factors beyond these that help answer this question, but the great thing about the things above is that they point to a player with plenty of growth still in front of him. I can't wait to see this team start stringing together some W's after the bye.

  • #2
    Good post !
    Forrest Lamp is not a bust.

    Comment


    • #3
      Because he scored a 39 on the Wonderlic test. Burrow scored a 34 meaning we got the smarter guy.

      Comment


      • #4
        wonderlic...didnt Marino score something astonishingly low? but so did that idiot QB from tennessee (vince young?).

        Comment


        • #5
          I'm glad you made this thread because I have something to say.

          Chargers fans please stop whining about Lynn for a moment. Be giddy about what this team landed in Herbert so soon after moving on from a HOF QB who had a HOF. Since 2004, Brees' first Pro Bowl year, our team has been piloted by a top 10 QB in the league, and we have grown accustomed to 3,000+ yard and 25+ TD pass seasons from our QB. I don't know how many of you remember the quarterback wilderness this franchise was in from the mid-80s, when Fouts retired, until Humphries, then from Humphries to Brees' sudden breakout in 2004. There was a revolving door at QB during those purgatory years, then there was the disaster of Ryan Leaf. It didn't seem like the Chargers were ever going to get the QB position right. Those years were awful. Then Brees, who was wretched in 2003 and looking like another failure, suddenly turned his career around in 2004 and became an elite QB, then Rivers took over - that covered a period of 15 years with two HOF QBs piloting our team. When the Chargers decided to move on from Rivers, I was concerned this team might go through another decade of QB wilderness. Yes they had that high draft pick to use on a top prospect, but that is no guarantee, look at how many times these top prospects are busts. But, here we are, five games after Rivers played his last game as a Charger, and this team has a replacement for him who is even better, and is doing things no rookie QB has ever done. No QB wilderness for years, the future is here and now with Herbert. Take a moment to be giddy about that. You know who is giddy about it - Keenan Allen. He has to be overjoyed to have this 22 year old phenom throwing him the rock. I am sure he didn't know what to expect when Rivers moved on. Suddenly he has a prodigy whose talent may exceed Mahomes' as his QB. Be giddy Chargers fans. Herbert is an extreme dose of good fortune that doesn't come around very often for a franchise. Now it's up to the Spanos family to create an environment of quality coaching and player personnel to make the most of this jewe; that dropped into their laps.

          Thanks to the OP for the great insight and background into Herbert. It is really interesting and a great post. My mother and her siblings grew up in Eugene during the Depression, so I feel that connection to Eugene. My uncle who attended the University of Oregon before WWII remained a lifelong Ducks fan even though he live most of his long life in the SF Bay Area. I shared that with him, and of course there is Dan Fouts, my favorite Charger of all time, who established the Ducks-Chargers QB connection. I couldn't be more happy to have Herbert come from Oregon.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Scoregon View Post
            I posted a couple long posts about Justin Herbert right after the draft, giving the Oregon fan's perspective on why he had a chance to be really good and why the experts who doubted him were getting it wrong. So I was certainly among those who expected him to be a good NFL starting quarterback, but even so, his play so far this season has blown me away. I thought he could be this guy, but never would have thought he'd look BETTER in the NFL than he did against top college competition this quickly. In my previous posts, I referenced two of the three key things that I see as answering how he is playing this well, this fast, but I also wanted to add one more.

            1. His situation at Oregon was by far the worst of the top three quarterbacks. The conservative coaching, simplistic passing scheme and poor receiver play made him look much more inconsistent and less dominant than he really was.

            2. He has actually significantly improved his footwork and mechanics since he left Oregon with legit quarterback coaching. He never did the QB camp circuit or had a personal quarterback coach or any of the extra coaching that top groomed quarterbacks all over the country routinely have these days. Working with quarterback coach John Beck during the pre-draft and offseason, followed by intense tutelage from Pep Hamilton once he was with the Chargers has made a huge difference. The reason this intensive work has made such a dramatic difference in Herbert's consistent accuracy (largely due to footwork and cleaning up mechanics) is that he'd never had that sort of coaching before and he therefore had a chance at some rapid and explosive growth.

            3. Until this year, he had never devoted all of his considerable talent and intellect toward football. This is not to say that he wasn't dedicated before. As I mentioned in a previous post, he was the guy organizing summer workouts and was the unquestioned offensive leader of those Oregon teams his last two seasons, but he also was extremely committed to success in the classroom. You don't get a 4.0 in Biology without putting in the hours and the energy. That's at least 20+ hours a week devoted to intense mental work outside of football. Even going back to high school, Herbert was a three sport athlete, shining as an elite pitcher in baseball and a key player on his high school hoops squad. He has spent his life being well rounded and being successful at nearly every challenge he has taken on. Focusing those diverse talents on one goal, becoming the best NFL quarterback he can be, is clearly paying dividends and has helped him accelerate his learning curve beyond what almost anyone thought was possible (particularly with this low rep offseason).

            There are probably other factors beyond these that help answer this question, but the great thing about the things above is that they point to a player with plenty of growth still in front of him. I can't wait to see this team start stringing together some W's after the bye.
            Quality analysis without much bias.
            I appreciate the content and football acumen.
            Some posters rant and rave about poor coaching but without even the consideration to giving kudos to our staff for Herbert’s development and stellar performance through 4 games.
            Good stuff! Keep posting intelligent football takes, we need more of it here @ TPB!
            2020 ADOPT-A-BOLT CHOICES

            Kenneth “K9” Murray (LB) #56

            Joe Reed (WR-KR) #12

            Comment


            • #7
              I grew up in Eugene, and in the '70s my dad has season tickets to the Ducks. I remember watching Fouts play, live at Autzen stadium, back before he blew his knee out, he was actually a mobile QB. I remember him taking a QB sneak 30 yards up the middle for a TD. (Nostalgia)

              Back to the topic at hand.

              I too am surprised at how quickly Herbert has gotten so good.
              He was SO inconsistent in college, SO INCONSISTENT.
              And now he looks as good as any QB in the league, after 4 starts, with no pre season games and limited 1st team snaps pre season.

              There are many posts on this forum critical of the coaches.

              I think we need to give some SERIOUS praise to the QB coach, for getting Herbert SO MUCH BETTER, SO FAST.

              Comment


              • #8
                Well said Velo. I AM giddy and Justin is really the main reason I am watching games this season. That first game, although a win, felt like a team stuck in mud and the opponent was just in thicker mud. Now it feels like they're in a ferrari on a straightaway (at times). Justin has more of the physical skills than any of the top QB picks...now it's just can he meld the physical with the mental. I'd like to know what Fouts thinks of Justin.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Velo View Post
                  I'm glad you made this thread because I have something to say.

                  Chargers fans please stop whining about Lynn for a moment. Be giddy about what this team landed in Herbert so soon after moving on from a HOF QB who had a HOF. Since 2004, Brees' first Pro Bowl year, our team has been piloted by a top 10 QB in the league, and we have grown accustomed to 3,000+ yard and 25+ TD pass seasons from our QB. I don't know how many of you remember the quarterback wilderness this franchise was in from the mid-80s, when Fouts retired, until Humphries, then from Humphries to Brees' sudden breakout in 2004. There was a revolving door at QB during those purgatory years, then there was the disaster of Ryan Leaf. It didn't seem like the Chargers were ever going to get the QB position right. Those years were awful. Then Brees, who was wretched in 2003 and looking like another failure, suddenly turned his career around in 2004 and became an elite QB, then Rivers took over - that covered a period of 15 years with two HOF QBs piloting our team. When the Chargers decided to move on from Rivers, I was concerned this team might go through another decade of QB wilderness. Yes they had that high draft pick to use on a top prospect, but that is no guarantee, look at how many times these top prospects are busts. But, here we are, five games after Rivers played his last game as a Charger, and this team has a replacement for him who is even better, and is doing things no rookie QB has ever done. No QB wilderness for years, the future is here and now with Herbert. Take a moment to be giddy about that. You know who is giddy about it - Keenan Allen. He has to be overjoyed to have this 22 year old phenom throwing him the rock. I am sure he didn't know what to expect when Rivers moved on. Suddenly he has a prodigy whose talent may exceed Mahomes' as his QB. Be giddy Chargers fans. Herbert is an extreme dose of good fortune that doesn't come around very often for a franchise. Now it's up to the Spanos family to create an environment of quality coaching and player personnel to make the most of this jewe; that dropped into their laps.

                  Thanks to the OP for the great insight and background into Herbert. It is really interesting and a great post. My mother and her siblings grew up in Eugene during the Depression, so I feel that connection to Eugene. My uncle who attended the University of Oregon before WWII remained a lifelong Ducks fan even though he live most of his long life in the SF Bay Area. I shared that with him, and of course there is Dan Fouts, my favorite Charger of all time, who established the Ducks-Chargers QB connection. I couldn't be more happy to have Herbert come from Oregon.
                  I agree. So glad Herbert is better than anyone expected him to be.... and still getting better.... Lynn is not perfect but he is learning and the team does play hard for him. If we replace a coach, we need a better DC.....
                  some will say its no big deal to lose to future HOF QB's like Brees, Brady, and likely mahomes who are playing on overall better teams..... BUT we also got beat by CAR and should have lost to CIN......our defense simply cannot stop anyone from scoring when they need to and are forced to throw the ball downfield......

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    There is only three guys that make jaw dropping throws Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson, Patrick Mahomes and our guy Justified at #6 Justin Herbert. Dude Herbert is in rarefied air just 4 games in I have seen him make throws like our rival Patrick Mahome throwing fallling back with arm strength and accuracy, and on the run rolling out with accuracy. The thing that blows me away is his poise you realize how much duress he is under and he moves up or slightly to the left or right with presssure and still makes the throws. Herbert gets sack he just gets up goes on to the next play, man he is doing shit you don't see from a rookie. I haven't seen him with happy feet, and again back to our crappy line he is getting sacked, but not like Joe Burrow who's Oline sucks also, but I say ours suck even more just that presence Herbert has to just get the ball away or step out of danger.

                    Herbert for ROY and I approve this message!!!!!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I’ve been hesitant to say it here out of fear of jinxing him but yeah, Herbert looks astonishingly good. Excellent post. I was wondering too how someone could look better in the NFL than he did in college, which he does.

                      I will admit I was dead wrong about him, based on the things I saw and heard about him in college I did not think he would be good, let alone this good, this fast. Thought that his flaws would accentuate in the NFL, but the opposite is true, his best skills translate great into the pro game.

                      Having said that, I should apologize to Herbert and his body parts as the only likely scenario as a Charger now is a career ending injury.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Where all the peeps that wanted Simmons before Herbert and got pissed off when we picked him. I vote Pep Hamiliton is a big part of his success, hes probably the only thing the Chargers have done right.

                        Comment

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