Sports Fixes?

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  • DragonIce
    Registered Charger Fan
    • Mar 2021
    • 584
    • Arizona
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    #85
    Originally posted by Critty View Post
    I don't think they fix games to who wins or loses. But point shaving may be happening.
    The refs has subjective power to rule over any play. And can impact the score purposely to try to get the spread covered or not.
    Some truth to that point. They don't need to swing games, necessarily. But last Sunday, if we score a TD at the end (where two strange calls occurred) it changes not only the outcome but the spread winner.

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    • Boltjolt
      Dont let the PBs fool ya
      • Jun 2013
      • 26263
      • Henderson, NV
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      #86
      As soon as i see verbal and/or writen admitance of proof that these games are fixed is the day i stop watching the NFL. What would be the point or watching cheating going on? Its a sport with pasionate fans and fixing these games would be a rotton, lowdown thing to do and give false hope to fans.

      Id be OUT!

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      • DragonIce
        Registered Charger Fan
        • Mar 2021
        • 584
        • Arizona
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        #87
        Originally posted by Boltjolt View Post
        As soon as i see verbal and/or writen admitance of proof that these games are fixed is the day i stop watching the NFL. What would be the point or watching cheating going on? Its a sport with pasionate fans and fixing these games would be a rotton, lowdown thing to do and give false hope to fans.

        Id be OUT!
        I hear you! I don't think you'll ever see hard proof, so feel free to continue enjoying the game.

        With my sensibility it is harder to be a fan...and I've quit or kinda-quit on the sport a few times. But I enjoy a beautiful Herbert pass or Allen ankle-breaking route whether or not the NFL owners are up to shenanigans...or not. I focus on the great players, the great plays, the beauty of the sport and Powder Blue.

        I enjoy my money too much to donate it to the gambling folks and their partners, so I don't put money down. That's me, anyway. Not trying to suggest how other people live.
        Last edited by DragonIce; 09-23-2021, 06:45 PM.

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        • Hadl2Alworth
          Registered Charger Fan
          • Oct 2017
          • 1364
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          #88
          Originally posted by DragonIce View Post

          I assume you've watched the Godfather scenes where the mob bosses meet together. Not everyone gets an equal vote. And there is pressure on all parties to do whatever necessary to maximize profit for all the families.

          I'd like to think some owners resisted the nfl's now integrated relationship with gambling on NFL outcomes. Those voices, if they existed, got out-muscled.

          Imagine a craps table where the house can fix the spin of the dice anytime they choose. Yeah, that's the NFL. Are we to trust billionaires who have every imaginable tool to tweak game outcomes and rake in billions extra--are we to trust them to "do the right thing"?
          I think the major difference between the mob and NFL owners is that one group achieves status primarily through making money and that's it. And there's intimidation, breaking laws, and major violence involved (killing) in that pursuit. That group of course is the mob. NFL owners achieve status both through making money and owning a football team (especially a winning football team). I think you're under-rating the potential status gained by winning football games for owners. At least the allure of it. And status equals ego.

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          • DragonIce
            Registered Charger Fan
            • Mar 2021
            • 584
            • Arizona
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            #89
            Originally posted by Hadl2Alworth View Post
            I think the major difference between the mob and NFL owners is that one group achieves status primarily through making money and that's it. And there's intimidation, breaking laws, and major violence involved (killing) in that pursuit. That group of course is the mob. NFL owners achieve status both through making money and owning a football team (especially a winning football team). I think you're under-rating the potential status gained by winning football games for owners. At least the allure of it. And status equals ego.
            Maybe so. Is my notion a little factual, quite factual, or baloney? I'll never be able to absolutely prove it, and even in my mind I frame it as a likelihood, not a certainty.

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            • Critty
              Dominate the Day.
              • Mar 2019
              • 5407
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              #90
              Originally posted by Boltgang74 View Post

              They fixed the game for the cowgirls to win last week.Its right there in our faces guys.I still say organize a "blue flu" on a certain sunday and make these owners realize we aren't the blubberin idiots they think we are.
              If they did get involved on purpose.
              I don't think they cared who won.
              This would all be about the spread and attempt to ensure it stayed in line with the bet to be won.
              The Chargers TD covers the spread.
              A Chargers win by 3, 2 or 1 is okay. A Dallas win is okay.

              The thing is, Chargers did move illegally pre snap. It was ticky tac but it wasn't a phantom call. It happened. They should NOT give the refs a chance to get involved. Play cleaner football. And then we will really be able to tell if the refs getting involved by calling phantom calls at end of game to cover the spread.

              If they really wanted to ensure the Dallas win, they could have called a hold on the FG attempt and back them up after the made FG. And then call another hold if needed and move them out of FG range. Why allow the tie at that point. If their kicker misses it goes to OT. And Chargers can still win the game.

              Again I don't think they are trying to make Chargers lose a game. If it happens, it would be about the spread, not the win or loss.

              Who has it better than us?

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              • Critty
                Dominate the Day.
                • Mar 2019
                • 5407
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                #91
                Originally posted by Boltjolt View Post
                As soon as i see verbal and/or writen admitance of proof that these games are fixed is the day i stop watching the NFL. What would be the point or watching cheating going on? Its a sport with pasionate fans and fixing these games would be a rotton, lowdown thing to do and give false hope to fans.

                Id be OUT!
                In NBA when point shaving happened. They only found out because one bookie figure it out because he knew them from school back in the day. And that bookie just started cheating too and then others followed the scheme and it became obvious as so much money was following certain games.
                So if it's happening at all in the NFL. It's not the league or the owners, as I don't believe they would want that scandal and it's just doesn't make sense, they make so.much more money on TV contracts that winning money by betting isn't really worth it for them. But an individual ref, what do they make? Just like in NBA. Refs have the whistle and can easily shave points late in games. I would be shocked if a ref hasn't already done this. I wouldn't be surprised if one day a ref was arrested for shaving points. Just like individuals in other companies can do unethical things to line their pockets when they have enough power to cheat.
                Who has it better than us?

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                • Critty
                  Dominate the Day.
                  • Mar 2019
                  • 5407
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                  #92
                  If individuals want to play detective, then who was the crew for the Chargers Cowboys game. Who threw the flag for illegal shift, who threw the flag for a sack. Follow the games they ref and see if they throw flags late and it impacts the spread. If you can start to spot a pattern...like when ref A is on the crew, he throws 4th quarter flags on the favorite and the underdog almost always covers the spread
                  Who has it better than us?

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                  • chargeroo
                    Fan since 1961
                    • Jan 2019
                    • 4715
                    • Oregon
                    • Retired Manager/Pastor
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                    #93
                    Originally posted by Boltjolt View Post
                    As soon as i see verbal and/or writen admitance of proof that these games are fixed is the day i stop watching the NFL. What would be the point or watching cheating going on? Its a sport with pasionate fans and fixing these games would be a rotton, lowdown thing to do and give false hope to fans.

                    Id be OUT!
                    I'm with you. Knowing even one game was fixed would be the end of the NFL for me. That's exactly why I don't believe the NFL would ever condone cheating. That would amount to killing the goose that lays the golden egg.
                    THE YEAR OF THE FLIP!

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                    • Nunc Coepi
                      Registered Charger Fan
                      • Dec 2020
                      • 51
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                      #94
                      From 2008 to 2019 I watched every Charger game. I never saw the team benefit from a questionable call or non-call-- except once. It was in the 2018 game against Pittsburgh. Rivers threw an incredible touchdown pass which could have been negated. One of the linemen moved before the snap, but he wasn't held accountable. The touchdown stayed on the board.

                      Other teams benefit from the referees pretty routinely. They are almost always the same teams--- Pittsburgh, the Packers, the Cowboys, the Giants and whatever team Tom Brady is playing for. When Peyton Manning was playing, his team also got favored status. Does anybody remember that game in, like, 2014 when Eric Weddle intercepted a Manning pass in the end zone at the end of the first half? The referees wiped it out with a phantom holding call. Peyton got a second chance at the end zone and he Broncos got a touchdown that they wouldn't otherwise have had.

                      Why do tings like this happen?

                      Those teams represent a big market for the NFL. There are a lot of football fans who want to see those teams win, and the NFL gives consumers what they want.In the case of Tom Brady and Peyton Manning, they were and are good, but they have benefitted from a media that fawns over them. They have a fan base bigger than most teams.

                      The NFL will always favor the teams that bring crowds and money. The Chargers are not one of those teams

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                      • equivocation
                        Registered Charger Fan
                        • Apr 2021
                        • 2600
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                        #95
                        Stars have always benefited from favorable calls, regardless of sport or era.

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                        • Nunc Coepi
                          Registered Charger Fan
                          • Dec 2020
                          • 51
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                          #96
                          It's hard to judge how good Tom Brady and Manning have been. They did not have to play according to the same rules as others. Here's a question to think about. Would the referees ever allow Tom Brady to throw a game-losing interception in the playoffs?

                          No way. It undermines the myth in which so many want to believe. People who aren't even fans of football will watch a game because Tom Brady is playing. Look at the last Super Bowl. Brady threw an interception. It took a touchdown off the board. It happened in the 2nd quarter. But the referees wiped it out with a phantom holding call. Why? That's not what people want to see. People pay to see Brady show that he is still their hero.

                          Rivers has been something like the opposite of Brady and Manning. He rarely gets good press. In markets outside of San Diego, he is not a hero. He is a villain, and as a result, he didn't get the kind of help those other qbs got. He had to go uphill his whole career, every game.

                          I don't think the NFL is fixed in the sense that referees have to be told who should win. They don't have to be told. They know what their bosses need for more money, and they deliver it.

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