POLL: Does Lombardi's Playcalling Stink?

[Critty]

Topcat
Guest
What coverages did the Steelers play in the game?
And how often were they in those coverages?
How often did they rotate into cover 2 man, 2 deep zone and single high robber? And what deep passes would you throw against those rotated coverages?

If you're going call out the OC, you have to have clear answers to the above questions. Otherwise you are ill prepared to be making any play call suggestions.

Don't give me the stop running up the middle, and stop the short passes and go deep and mix it up take. That not a play call suggestions to execute vs specific rotating coverages.

What are your better play calls vs those specific looks the Steelers showed where you would score more than 41pts the Chargers scored. What exactly are your calls, when and why?!!

[Critty]

Chargers have had 7 games of 40plus scored in regular season since 2013 when Telesco was hired.

2 of those have recently happened under Staley/Lombardi in just 10 games. For an avg of One 40 burger every 5 games.

Meaning..... 5/128 40 burgers during the rest of Telesco tenure. That is 1 in 25 games. Every 2 year we might get a 40 burger as fans.

It's just really hard for me to be down on Lombardi when the team has two 40 burgers in 10 games and has went from 18th in scoring to 11th from last year to this.

Seems like the voters want perfection. I want improvement.
And the record is better, the scoring is better, the kicker is better with Hopkins.

By all accounts everything is better this year on the offense and yet Chargers fans made a poll that the OC stinks.

:banghead:

[Guest]

I find it hard to believe that the QB coach for Drew Brees who was part of an offense that was a top 5 scoring offense doesn't understand the game better than you and the Chargers fans in the poll.

The Chargers offense have already went from 18th last year to 11th this year. And are scoring more points per game this season. They are only 4pt less per game than the league leader team which is lead by the Goat QB, and Bucs are a team that has better weapons and depth and better O-line which you claimed 15 QBs could have won superbowl with because they were so talented.

The Chargers being 4 point less than your juggernaut team just 10 games into this season for the new OC is massive fail to you. Really?

There are no facts to back your claim they would be scoring more if they threw more deep passes. It very likely would lead to more loses as Herbert holding the ball will lead to more interceptions, sacks and fumbles.

Only 10 games and you have fully concluded Lombardi is a bad play caller even though so many stats point to improved play by offense.

There nothing arrogant about telling flat earthers that they are mistaken and need to learn more about science. Or football fans that they are mistaken and need to learn more about football.

Chainy, you are clearly an incorrigible Chargers fan.
:beer:

I have said Lombardi's play calling sucks. We already know that he has a history of that with Detroit, which led to his firing after just 23 games as OC.

Our offense was very near to 18th in scoring heading into last Sunday's game. You are citing a temporary increase caused by an outlier. It is likely that we will see one or more outliers in the other direction as the season progresses.

We kicked ass throwing deep passes last year and scored 8 TDs and a FG on the the drives that featured 45+ yard passing plays. The only one we did not score on was Johnson's Hail Mary reception against BUF where our coaches had a mental meltdown. Keep in mind that we did not start going to the deep game until week 4 last year.

You keep wanting to rely on last week's temporary bump in our scoring. Absent Lombardi changing, I do not think we are staying at 26 PPG. That is my hunch anyway. So the difference between what I think we really are with Lombardi with Staley going for it on 4th downs and 30 PPG is probably more than 5 points per game or 85+ points over an entre season, which is pretty important.

Lombardi's game plans are better than Lynn's in that the pass to run ratio is higher and there are not as many stupid early down running plays. But his play calling in the passing game is worse than Steichen's was. Steichen definitely had a better feel for calling passing plays. So the two different areas of shortcoming by each OC kind of offset each other, which is why there is so little difference between what Lombardi has accomplished and what Steichen accomplished.

Your analogy is misplaced and not even worth a detailed response.

[Critty]

I have said Lombardi's play calling sucks. We already know that he has a history of that with Detroit, which led to his firing after just 23 games as OC.

Our offense was very near to 18th in scoring heading into last Sunday's game. You are citing a temporary increase caused by an outlier. It is likely that we will see one or more outliers in the other direction as the season progresses.

We kicked ass throwing deep passes last year and scored 8 TDs and a FG on the the drives that featured 45+ yard passing plays. The only one we did not score on was Johnson's Hail Mary reception against BUF where our coaches had a mental meltdown. Keep in mind that we did not start going to the deep game until week 4 last year.

You keep wanting to rely on last week's temporary bump in our scoring. Absent Lombardi changing, I do not think we are staying at 26 PPG. That is my hunch anyway. So the difference between what I think we really are with Lombardi with Staley going for it on 4th downs and 30 PPG is probably more than 5 points per game or 85+ points over an entre season, which is pretty important.

Lombardi's game plans are better than Lynn's in that the pass to run ratio is higher and there are not as many stupid early down running plays. But his play calling in the passing game is worse than Steichen's was. Steichen definitely had a better feel for calling passing plays. So the two different areas of shortcoming by each OC kind of offset each other, which is why there is so little difference between what Lombardi has accomplished and what Steichen accomplished.

Your analogy is misplaced and not even worth a detailed response.

It's a 10 game sample size. He was part of top offenses, he had to be paying attention and involved in what HC Payton and OC Carmichael were doing with the Saints offense.

They have two 40 burgers which I see as positive, but if you chose to could use to eliminate them as the two outliers and the other 8 games are the Lombardi offense. And then also those 4th downs and you could really bury Lombardi with your opinion of him if you cherry picked the stats that way.

[Guest]

Chargers have had 7 games of 40plus scored in regular season since 2013 when Telesco was hired.

2 of those have recently happened under Staley/Lombardi in just 10 games. For an avg of One 40 burger every 5 games.

Meaning..... 5/128 40 burgers during the rest of Telesco tenure. That is 1 in 25 games. Every 2 year we might get a 40 burger as fans.

It's just really hard for me to be down on Lombardi when the team has two 40 burgers in 10 games and has went from 18th in scoring to 11th from last year to this.

Seems like the voters want perfection. I want improvement.
And the record is better, the scoring is better, the kicker is better with Hopkins.

By all accounts everything is better this year on the offense and yet Chargers fans made a poll that the OC stinks.

:banghead:

We can all see that the offense is underachieving. Nobody is talking about perfection. Our long passes last year led to 8 TDs and a FG on 10 45+ yard completions. That is a way better success rate than the average drive. So let's get those regularly to go with some of what Lombardi is doing. My belief is that doing that will open up the underneath more for what Lombardi wants to do.

The 40 burgers are outliers. Our next best output is 30 even, a huge drop off. All but 4 of our games are between 20 and 30. That is what we are with some degree of regularity.

One of the 40 burgers was directly due to Staley, not due to Lombardi. Even with Staley forcing the issue on 4th downs, this offense is not on pace to match the 2018 team's offensive output.

And I think this offensive unit is more talented than that team's offensive unit.

With Staley's decisions helping to put wind in the offense's sails and a very talented unit, I am expecting more than a middle of the pack PPG stat, which is what we had going into last Sunday's game. The talent is there for this unit to be in the top 5 at least in scoring.

[Guest]

It's a 10 game sample size. He was part of top offenses, he had to be paying attention and involved in what HC Payton and OC Carmichael were doing with the Saints offense.

They have two 40 burgers which I see as positive, but if you chose to could use to eliminate them as the two outliers and the other 8 games are the Lombardi offense. And then also those 4th downs and you could really bury Lombardi with your opinion of him if you cherry picked the stats that way.

I understand that the tweaking of the stats does not help Lombardi, but if you are comparing offenses in terms of OC results, then I think it is not really fair to give Lombardi credit for what Staley made happen.

I think the biggest cherry pick is your waiting until we put up a 41 point output, which is a clear outlier and then discussing PPG. If Lombardi's track record is any indication, that number is more likely to shrink than increase and I think we all know that. I think Lombardi has to change to hold 12th overall, though we do have some weaker opponents still to face in terms of points allowed (Giants, Texans, Raiders), which could help some.

Also, I am not here to suggest that Lombardi does not understand football. I am here to say that he is not a very good play caller. Those are two entirely different things.

[Critty]

I understand that the tweaking of the stats does not help Lombardi, but if you are comparing offenses in terms of OC results, then I think it is not really fair to give Lombardi credit for what Staley made happen.

I think the biggest cherry pick is your waiting until we put up a 41 point output, which is a clear outlier and then discussing PPG. If Lombardi's track record is any indication, that number is more likely to shrink than increase and I think we all know that. I think Lombardi has to change to hold 12th overall, though we do have some weaker opponents still to face in terms of points allowed (Giants, Texans, Raiders), which could help some.

Also, I am not here to suggest that Lombardi does not understand football. I am here to say that he is not a very good play caller. Those are two entirely different things.

The calls are the same type of calls Payton/Carmichael made with the Saints that had top scoring offenses. He was the QB coach so many of those seasons.
Way too soon to rush to judgement and use a brief stint 8 seasons ago to make a final determination.

Last year's deep shot were game planned. They don't do the run and play action attack as much now. They have that in there but, they do more horizontal stuff as an extension of run game and those stats get added into the pass stat for air yards but it just waters down the importance of the stat as the.intent of the call is to get the ball out in space to a playmaker. And I think it's a good idea to use playmakers short and find yac and first downs, use clock, score and allow the defense to rest. Why just run and go deep. There are a lot of other things that can be done to stress the defenses.

Comparing last year scheme.and deep pass and air yards vs this year offense doesn't account for the intent of the scheme. This new offense style has produced top offenses many times before. And I don't think a brief stint with the Lions is much to talk about considering what have the Lions ever done with any coaching staff.

[powderblueboy]

I read a lot of good things and a lot of bad things about Lombardi from folks here.

Five losses this year, five games were Lombardi's offense ran into a wall....this is very concerning.
You simply can not give your D zero chances to win in half the games.

You can argue about this stat & that stat: being the main contributor in all five losses tells me more.
The central fact is that again, a top rated D coordinator smokes him.

[Guest]

That will just about do it for the Lombardi is bringing the offense along nonsense. Now back to under 25 points per game. Zero deep throws--again.

Maybe Lombardi will learn that is is difficult to be perfect on 5,000 short play drives against good defenses.

[richpjr]

Herbert was running for his life and getting nailed and you guys want him hold the ball even longer to go deep?

I swear at times I am watching a different game than some of you guys are.

[Boltjolt]

I read a lot of good things and a lot of bad things about Lombardi from folks here.

Five losses this year, five games were Lombardi's offense ran into a wall....this is very concerning.
You simply can not give your D zero chances to win in half the games.

You can argue about this stat & that stat: being the main contributor in all five losses tells me more.
The central fact is that again, a top rated D coordinator smokes him.

Did you watch the game?

The OL stunk and had three starters now missing. OL depth is the weakest on the team and Herbert was always flushed from the pocket and was our leading rusher today with a big 36 yards.

He had no time to throw short passes let alone any long ones. Not to mention he had 2 INTs and 3 other possible INTs dropped

But granted Lombardi could of called some rollouts.

[Bolt4Knob]

Herbert was running for his life and getting nailed and you guys want him hold the ball even longer to go deep?

I swear at times I am watching a different game than some of you guys are.

Chargers lost this game at the line of scrimmage against Denver.

I didn't think Lombo called a bad game. Denver made some plays on defense. The one call and I get its only one call - was down 14 zip, Kelley ran for five on first down to the 26; than the next play, Ekeler went wide and lost 2 before Kelemete whiffed and Herbert took the sack, Hopkins whiffed. It seemed if you run on 2nd down, against Denver, keep it between the tackles - defense can move laterally

But today, not on Lombo's play calling - it was on pass and run blocking.
Defense also not very good