Post Draft OL Discussion

[equivocation]

We had a very good offense with Olivea as the weakest link.

[sonorajim]

unfortunately, think you're gonna have to add a touchdown to that.... <27, and agree....

most everybody thought we would be all world w/both Bosa 'n James healthy, and.... we weren't,

27 was last year, actually . The DL / LBs stunk and DB depth was inadequate when starters missed 20 T games. I admit that surprised me.
The returning players know the scheme and several good to elite adds are familiar with Staley's D.
So you think Kahlil Mack, JC Jackson, Austin Johnson, Sebastion Joseph-Day, Morgan Fox, Troy Reeder and Kyle Van Noy plus draft picks won't make a difference?

[wu-dai clan]

There’s a reason that Salyer dropped. I don’t see an RT in him. Only an IOL. But we’ll see in training camp who emerges in the battles with Mack and Bosa.

And that reason is medical. Salyer may be our best choice at ORT. There's a fat chance we see it though. I get a Trey Smith vibe. A man can dream.

[wu-dai clan]

Thanks for the vines to the Popper and Nguyen articles, X. These are great resources. $12/year right now to join The Athletic. Recommended. Set up a lemonade stand if you have to. Shit, I'll gift you a subscription you tight ass chumps.

[dmac_bolt]

And after prioritizing the interior, Brees still generally had OTs that Rivers could only dream about.

Lol, this “NO only cared about IOL” theory is a bit over played. they’ve had NFL quality tackles most of the time. having good guards is not a reason to have a shit tackle. 5 good players is better than 4 is better than 3 is better than 2.

TT saying interior OL is more important may be true, may be a sudden revelation because he sure never devoted much to IOL before, or may simply be him pointing at the area he made the improvement and saying “i did that on purpose”. I am glad he upgraded Scho and don’t know what others saw in him. IDGAF about PFFT ratings, I’z got two eyeballs and I know what I saw. Also think Feiler at LG was grossly over-rated. He’s not completely horrible but he was miles from pro bowl caliber. He looke a bit average imo.

[dmac_bolt]

Salyer/solid >> mediocre/bad

I’m going to wait to see him take a snap against a professional DE before I crown that 6th rounder as a great OT.

[Ghost of Quacksaw]

I’m going to wait to see him take a snap against a professional DE before I crown that 6th rounder as a great OT.

No kidding! Where are these kool aid guzzlers coming from?!?

[Xenos]

Lol, this “NO only cared about IOL” theory is a bit over played. they’ve had NFL quality tackles most of the time. having good guards is not a reason to have a shit tackle. 5 good players is better than 4 is better than 3 is better than 2.

TT saying interior OL is more important may be true, may be a sudden revelation because he sure never devoted much to IOL before, or may simply be him pointing at the area he made the improvement and saying “i did that on purpose”. I am glad he upgraded Scho and don’t know what others saw in him. IDGAF about PFFT ratings, I’z got two eyeballs and I know what I saw. Also think Feiler at LG was grossly over-rated. He’s not completely horrible but he was miles from pro bowl caliber. He looke a bit average imo.

NO was mostly known for their IOL before 2013. They actually won the SB in 2009 with no names at both OT positions but strong pro bowlers at the IOL positions.

Also it’s not just Telesco saying a strong IOL is more important. Staley also believes as much.

[Boltinloudguy]

the worry is less about a singular position, and more about.... are we going to put our best five (or six) OL out there ??

as mentioned before, think Zion is the best LG on the roster, and that Salyer may be the best RT on the roster, and which leaves Feiler @RG.

also don't think the neither of Storm nor Pips are in the pick six for our Oline.... I'll take Salyer against Mack in practice over any of the others.

I think if they move the players around, the best bet would be Slater-Salyer-Linsley-Johnson-Feiler. I would keep Salyer on the left side with Slater and Johnson with Feiler.

But who’s knows, maybe they still bring in a RT to compete. It’s still early and they have money. Daryl Williams will be pretty cheap to bring in and compete at RT.

[Steve]

The IOL vs OT thing is up in the air. For every example of a team that prioritizes one over the other, there are examples of both working or not working. And from our own experience last year, while Norton may have been the bigger weak spot, the OG pass protection was not exactly rock solid. Personally, I think the days of "getting by" with a substandard player at any position is over. It takes good players across the board and RG was a need. You don't pass on a guy you think is going to be a great player at a position of need because he plays the wrong position, unless there is a better option there at another position of need (RT), and there wasn't.

Personally, I think if one of the top OT had still been there, we would have taken the OT. This year, they were gone, but we still had an OG we really, really liked, so that made the decision. We had 2 spots to fill, At some point, we needed an OG and an OT. We have 2 young OT who are still developing and entering their 3rd and 4th years respectively, and OL tends to develop in about their 3rd or 4th year (on average). Both were players who improved significantly over the course of last season, and if they do start to fail again, we do have a fallback in Feiler, provided Salyer can adjust to the NFL game quickly.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-investigating-learning-curves-from-college-football-to-the-nfl

From the article:
"We continue our analysis with the trenches and start with the offensive line. There are two notable observations here:

1.) Offensive linemen struggle during their rookie season much more than other positions and, maybe even more interestingly, offensive linemen don't reach their full potential before Year 3 or even Year 4.

2.) Offensive tackles, in particular, seem to constantly develop throughout their rookie contract, as the recent example of D.J. Humphries illustrates. Humphries turned into a solid pass protector in his fourth year and earned himself an extension. While one should still exercise caution when observing a sudden breakout for an offensive lineman in Year 4, our findings yield an encouraging result and should increase our confidence in such performances being sustainable.

This means that one shouldn't give up on struggling offensive linemen too early, especially if they came into the league with a high draft stock. There is usually still plenty of hope that they could develop into the player they were supposed to be when drafted. Especially for tackles, who command higher salaries on the free market, this could mean that exercising the fifth-year option after three years could be valuable even if the player hasn't fulfilled the high expectation of a first-round pick.

Naturally, this advice only holds if the option doesn't become fully guaranteed the moment it's exercised, a change proposed with the new CBA. On the flip side, if a team is impatient and releases an offensive lineman after two years of disappointing results, a buy-low opportunity presents itself for 31 other teams. However, the grace period shouldn't last forever, as we've found that the potential peaks in Year 4. We've also found that, on average, there is no further significant development to be expected from Year 5 on."

There are no guarantees when building a roster. The history of the draft and FA tells us that every method is a crapshoot.

The vast majority of this year's FA signings WILL be busts. The Chargers have done what can be done to minimize that risk, but there is still a risk. The majority of draft picks WILL be busts. The safest way of building a franchise is to trade for players but not many good players are available that way, so it is kinda tough to build a franchise via trades (and the other teams in the division tend to not be very helpful).

As far as the Manyweather thing. He has a great track record of success with his clients. Again, no one is perfect, and I am sure if you look, you will find guys who didn't turn into better players after they worked with him. Most of his clients did get better and some of them improved dramatically. Yes, he has a bussiness to run, so he is hyping his client, that is part of his job. However, if he hypes a guy like Pipkin and then Pipkins fails, especially after the hype, Manyweather looks like an ass, and his endorsements won't mean shit going forward. That is not good for his Manyweather bussiness either. But the NFL personnel disclaimer still applies, there are no crystal balls, and you don't know who is going to be successful or not.

Hopefully, the Chargers are getting tapes from Pipkins workouts, or are even sending scouts and coaches to watch some of them. If I was TT I would ask to do so.

[dmac_bolt]

I 100% agree with Staley and Tom that drafting an elite OG >>> a mediocre OT. They made the right choice imo absolutely.

I hope Mannyweather is right and the Pipper pops this year.

[Steve]

I think if they move the players around, the best bet would be Slater-Salyer-Linsley-Johnson-Feiler. I would keep Salyer on the left side with Slater and Johnson with Feiler.

But who’s knows, maybe they still bring in a RT to compete. It’s still early and they have money. Daryl Williams will be pretty cheap to bring in and compete at RT.

If Williams was willing to just sign for almost nothing, he would have done it by now. He got cut because of his contract, so he is either waiting for the ideal fit, or is trying to get as much money as possible out of it, or probably a bit of both.

Again, I think the Feiler thing is that they want to force defenses to sell out to stop the run to the left side, but by adding Johnson, open up the runs to the middle and right. IF they have to, they know they can move him in a pinch, but I think they wait to see all their other options play out before they resort to it.