2023 Official Charger Draft - Post Draft Discussion (Daily Links In OP)

[jamrock]

Yes, we have hardly any idea whether JC comes back as the CB we paid (over-paid) for.
Bryce Callahan has had quite a year. He came cheap. He wanted to prove he could put together a good year and stay health... he did.
He'll command $10+ million as a FA. Our cap can't cover that.
Our cap probably needs to shed Vato's 9.4 million (7.4 million savings).

We need CB(s). Taylor and Leonard are completely unproven.

The JC Jackson signing was a huge mistake by Staley and TT whether he gets healthy or not. In the games he played, he was more often than not lost and an obviously poor fit for Staley’s scheme. He might have been a great lockdown corner playing press but that’s not how we used him. He was so bad we had to bench him! Imagine that.

[sonorajim]

We have a pretty good TE in Gerald Everett. IMO, we need a TE to back him up in case of injury. Hayden Hurst and Austin Hooper are both FA's at year's end. There are a lot of other FA TE's too.

Geisecki, Shultz, Engram, Tonyan, Irv Smith, Moreau. I'd see what the market brings. If we could get Akins, Hurst, Hooper, or Moreau for 3-5 million... we wouldn't have to spend any draft capital on that position. Plus, we already have targets (albeit injured this year)... KA, MW, Palmer, EKE, Everett.

Everett is OK, not what I'd call good. He'd make a good backup.

[Boltnut]

The JC Jackson signing was a huge mistake by Staley and TT whether he gets healthy or not. In the games he played, he was more often than not lost and an obviously poor fit for Staley’s scheme. He might have been a great lockdown corner playing press but that’s not how we used him. He was so bad we had to bench him! Imagine that.

Thus far, it doesn't look good. Hopefully he'll come back. Hopefully they'll use him correctly.

Another guy they're not using correctly (IMO) is K9. In college, he was a guy that attacked the LOS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4BTB6_2P7o&t=10s

Of course, to have attacking LB's you need good cover corners... something I thought we'd see more of with Staley.

[Boltjolt]

We have a pretty good TE in Gerald Everett. IMO, we need a TE to back him up in case of injury. Hayden Hurst and Austin Hooper are both FA's at year's end. There are a lot of other FA TE's too.

Geisecki, Shultz, Engram, Tonyan, Irv Smith, Moreau. I'd see what the market brings. If we could get Akins, Hurst, Hooper, or Moreau for 3-5 million... we wouldn't have to spend any draft capital on that position. Plus, we already have targets (albeit injured this year)... KA, MW, Palmer, EKE, Everett.

Just not sure it's a good idea to spend 3 to 5 mil a year on a backup TE. Geisecki for instance can't block for shit. No thanks to him. Rookie TE would be much cheaper and be around longer even if he is a first rounder.

I like 2 on that list that may be affordable. Tonyan and Moreau. Shultz isn't going to be affordable. Everett has 1 year left on his contract after this season.

[JupiterBolt]

I was impressed with wr Charlie Jones from Purdue. He’s going to be a good slot.

[Fleet 1]

OSU star Jaxon Smith-Njigba tells ESPN’s @peterthamel that he’s declaring for the NFL Draft and will not compete in the CFP. “I was unable to come back on multiple occasions during the season and the doctors determined I would be unable to participate in the playoffs.”

[DerwinBosa]

I was impressed with wr Charlie Jones from Purdue. He’s going to be a good slot.

I was thinking the exact same thing while watching that game.

[Rambler]

OSU star Jaxon Smith-Njigba tells ESPN’s @peterthamel that he’s declaring for the NFL Draft and will not compete in the CFP. “I was unable to come back on multiple occasions during the season and the doctors determined I would be unable to participate in the playoffs.”

If he's medically cleared, that is who I would want in the first round. Widely considered the best of three wide receivers at OSU last year. Always seemed to be open. Risky to pick a WR out for the entire year this season for medical, especially for the Chargers, but he's a true #1 who would be great for Justin, and might allow us to move on from Keenan (who is still very good, but his injury history and age are becoming bigger factors now). The only reason Smith-Njigba might be available when the Chargers pick is the injury question--otherwise he's probably top ten, maybe higher. A more complete receiver than Keenan, as he's got both speed and moves. We know Mike Williams, although paid as a No. 1, is really just a No. 2, and needs a true No. 1 to take some of the defensive focus away from him. Bills have great receivers, so do Miami and Cincinnati. How are we going to compete without a better WR group, starting with a true (and young) No. 1? How are we going to draft a true No. 1 when we're consistently picking in the mid-to-late teens?

There are other needs, obviously, but a lot of them might be solved next year with our injured players returning. I'd like another corner, as I think we'll lose Callahan in free agency, and I'd like to move Asante Samuel Jr. to nickel, which I think would be a better position for him than corner, with its run-stopping responsibilities which he is clearly struggling to handle. But corners can be found in later rounds, or maybe one of the guys we drafted in late rounds this year will emerge. Linebackers as well. A guard to replace Feiler, if you don't shift Salyer to left guard and re-sign Pipkins to play right tackle. Someone who you could also groom to move to center, maybe Steve Avila from TCU in round 3 or 4. Another tight end. And a backup QB-- Chase showed exactly nothing when he had to go in to the 49er game for a few snaps. Easton Stick has been a wasted roster spot, time to move on.

Most of all, I want a GM willing to trade down and accumulate more picks when opportunities present themselves. Tom Telesco has never, not even once, traded down, in 10 years. Trading down allows you to draft more depth for more positions. We have a top-heavy roster, a lot of money tied to a few really good players (as well as too much money to some seriously average ones). Having more draft picks to play with allows you to build depth cheaply with better young players than the bottom of the barrel free agents we are often forced to plug in (hello, Clapp, for example) when injuries occur (and for whatever reason, they occur to us much more frequently than others). And drafting better, avoiding the "need" picks like McKitty and Woods (that don't actually perform to eliminate the stated need) is a must.

But then you need a teaching coaching staff who are good at developing players. Who has Staley developed in his almost two years in charge? I'll give him Pipkins. But where is the growth from players like Adderly and (ours until recent weeks) Tillery? Why is Jaimes so bad as a backup? Why is Murray so incredibly unproductive? Why does it seem like Zion and Salyer are regressing rather than improving? Maybe it's coaching. Because Staley is so relatively new to the league, he wasn't able to attract many great assistant coaches. Some-- Frank Smith, now with Miami, did a great job with the Oline last year, and the new special teams coach this year is really good too (we'll probably lose him at end of year as well). But everyone else? I don't see great coaching, halftime adjustments, strong player development going on here. Have players quit? I can't say that. But are they improving? Are they put in positions to succeed, to develop into better players? I can't say that either. Too soon in Staley's tenure to draw a definitive conclusion, but the data isn't trending favorably.

Maybe this is an indictment of the entire structure of the organization. From the very top. Hiring family members and putting them in important positions of authority over football people. Family members who did not earn their positions, but were handed them, and seem to have no accountability. And ownership very reluctant to fire underperforming GMs and head coaches with years left on their contracts.

I want the Chargers to succeed. I root for them every week. Every year I hope Telesco's drafting acumen has improved, but can't quite see it yet (and it's been a decade or so). Every game I hope to see game plans tailored to addressing the current opponent, and halftime adjustments that work, players showing consistent improvement over time. It's just hard watching this level of failure-- not total failure, good enough to barely beat some bad to mediocre teams, and to put up a fight against some better teams, but still losing--but, even with a franchise-level QB, consistently falling far short of what could be, what seems possible, while many other teams seem to be able to figure it out.

Sorry for the rant. It's been a tough season.

[Berserker76]

If he's medically cleared, that is who I would want in the first round. Widely considered the best of three wide receivers at OSU last year. Always seemed to be open. Risky to pick a WR out for the entire year this season for medical, especially for the Chargers, but he's a true #1 who would be great for Justin, and might allow us to move on from Keenan (who is still very good, but his injury history and age are becoming bigger factors now). The only reason Smith-Njigba might be available when the Chargers pick is the injury question--otherwise he's probably top ten, maybe higher. A more complete receiver than Keenan, as he's got both speed and moves. We know Mike Williams, although paid as a No. 1, is really just a No. 2, and needs a true No. 1 to take some of the defensive focus away from him. Bills have great receivers, so do Miami and Cincinnati. How are we going to compete without a better WR group, starting with a true (and young) No. 1? How are we going to draft a true No. 1 when we're consistently picking in the mid-to-late teens?

There are other needs, obviously, but a lot of them might be solved next year with our injured players returning. I'd like another corner, as I think we'll lose Callahan in free agency, and I'd like to move Asante Samuel Jr. to nickel, which I think would be a better position for him than corner, with its run-stopping responsibilities which he is clearly struggling to handle. But corners can be found in later rounds, or maybe one of the guys we drafted in late rounds this year will emerge. Linebackers as well. A guard to replace Feiler, if you don't shift Salyer to left guard and re-sign Pipkins to play right tackle. Someone who you could also groom to move to center, maybe Steve Avila from TCU in round 3 or 4. Another tight end. And a backup QB-- Chase showed exactly nothing when he had to go in to the 49er game for a few snaps. Easton Stick has been a wasted roster spot, time to move on.

Most of all, I want a GM willing to trade down and accumulate more picks when opportunities present themselves. Tom Telesco has never, not even once, traded down, in 10 years. Trading down allows you to draft more depth for more positions. We have a top-heavy roster, a lot of money tied to a few really good players (as well as too much money to some seriously average ones). Having more draft picks to play with allows you to build depth cheaply with better young players than the bottom of the barrel free agents we are often forced to plug in (hello, Clapp, for example) when injuries occur (and for whatever reason, they occur to us much more frequently than others). And drafting better, avoiding the "need" picks like McKitty and Woods (that don't actually perform to eliminate the stated need) is a must.

But then you need a teaching coaching staff who are good at developing players. Who has Staley developed in his almost two years in charge? I'll give him Pipkins. But where is the growth from players like Adderly and (ours until recent weeks) Tillery? Why is Jaimes so bad as a backup? Why is Murray so incredibly unproductive? Why does it seem like Zion and Salyer are regressing rather than improving? Maybe it's coaching. Because Staley is so relatively new to the league, he wasn't able to attract many great assistant coaches. Some-- Frank Smith, now with Miami, did a great job with the Oline last year, and the new special teams coach this year is really good too (we'll probably lose him at end of year as well). But everyone else? I don't see great coaching, halftime adjustments, strong player development going on here. Have players quit? I can't say that. But are they improving? Are they put in positions to succeed, to develop into better players? I can't say that either. Too soon in Staley's tenure to draw a definitive conclusion, but the data isn't trending favorably.

Maybe this is an indictment of the entire structure of the organization. From the very top. Hiring family members and putting them in important positions of authority over football people. Family members who did not earn their positions, but were handed them, and seem to have no accountability. And ownership very reluctant to fire underperforming GMs and head coaches with years left on their contracts.

I want the Chargers to succeed. I root for them every week. Every year I hope Telesco's drafting acumen has improved, but can't quite see it yet (and it's been a decade or so). Every game I hope to see game plans tailored to addressing the current opponent, and halftime adjustments that work, players showing consistent improvement over time. It's just hard watching this level of failure-- not total failure, good enough to barely beat some bad to mediocre teams, and to put up a fight against some better teams, but still losing--but, even with a franchise-level QB, consistently falling far short of what could be, what seems possible, while many other teams seem to be able to figure it out.

Sorry for the rant. It's been a tough season.

Some great takes there, Rambler. That was by no means a rant.

[Boltjolt]

If he's medically cleared, that is who I would want in the first round. Widely considered the best of three wide receivers at OSU last year. Always seemed to be open. Risky to pick a WR out for the entire year this season for medical, especially for the Chargers, but he's a true #1 who would be great for Justin, and might allow us to move on from Keenan (who is still very good, but his injury history and age are becoming bigger factors now). The only reason Smith-Njigba might be available when the Chargers pick is the injury question--otherwise he's probably top ten, maybe higher. A more complete receiver than Keenan, as he's got both speed and moves. We know Mike Williams, although paid as a No. 1, is really just a No. 2, and needs a true No. 1 to take some of the defensive focus away from him. Bills have great receivers, so do Miami and Cincinnati. How are we going to compete without a better WR group, starting with a true (and young) No. 1? How are we going to draft a true No. 1 when we're consistently picking in the mid-to-late teens?

There are other needs, obviously, but a lot of them might be solved next year with our injured players returning. I'd like another corner, as I think we'll lose Callahan in free agency, and I'd like to move Asante Samuel Jr. to nickel, which I think would be a better position for him than corner, with its run-stopping responsibilities which he is clearly struggling to handle. But corners can be found in later rounds, or maybe one of the guys we drafted in late rounds this year will emerge. Linebackers as well. A guard to replace Feiler, if you don't shift Salyer to left guard and re-sign Pipkins to play right tackle. Someone who you could also groom to move to center, maybe Steve Avila from TCU in round 3 or 4. Another tight end. And a backup QB-- Chase showed exactly nothing when he had to go in to the 49er game for a few snaps. Easton Stick has been a wasted roster spot, time to move on.

Most of all, I want a GM willing to trade down and accumulate more picks when opportunities present themselves. Tom Telesco has never, not even once, traded down, in 10 years. Trading down allows you to draft more depth for more positions. We have a top-heavy roster, a lot of money tied to a few really good players (as well as too much money to some seriously average ones). Having more draft picks to play with allows you to build depth cheaply with better young players than the bottom of the barrel free agents we are often forced to plug in (hello, Clapp, for example) when injuries occur (and for whatever reason, they occur to us much more frequently than others). And drafting better, avoiding the "need" picks like McKitty and Woods (that don't actually perform to eliminate the stated need) is a must.

But then you need a teaching coaching staff who are good at developing players. Who has Staley developed in his almost two years in charge? I'll give him Pipkins. But where is the growth from players like Adderly and (ours until recent weeks) Tillery? Why is Jaimes so bad as a backup? Why is Murray so incredibly unproductive? Why does it seem like Zion and Salyer are regressing rather than improving? Maybe it's coaching. Because Staley is so relatively new to the league, he wasn't able to attract many great assistant coaches. Some-- Frank Smith, now with Miami, did a great job with the Oline last year, and the new special teams coach this year is really good too (we'll probably lose him at end of year as well). But everyone else? I don't see great coaching, halftime adjustments, strong player development going on here. Have players quit? I can't say that. But are they improving? Are they put in positions to succeed, to develop into better players? I can't say that either. Too soon in Staley's tenure to draw a definitive conclusion, but the data isn't trending favorably.

Maybe this is an indictment of the entire structure of the organization. From the very top. Hiring family members and putting them in important positions of authority over football people. Family members who did not earn their positions, but were handed them, and seem to have no accountability. And ownership very reluctant to fire underperforming GMs and head coaches with years left on their contracts.

I want the Chargers to succeed. I root for them every week. Every year I hope Telesco's drafting acumen has improved, but can't quite see it yet (and it's been a decade or so). Every game I hope to see game plans tailored to addressing the current opponent, and halftime adjustments that work, players showing consistent improvement over time. It's just hard watching this level of failure-- not total failure, good enough to barely beat some bad to mediocre teams, and to put up a fight against some better teams, but still losing--but, even with a franchise-level QB, consistently falling far short of what could be, what seems possible, while many other teams seem to be able to figure it out.

Sorry for the rant. It's been a tough season.

I think calling any college WR a more complete reciever than Keenan without taking an NFL snap and coming off missing a college season puzzling.

Based on what? I'll give you speed but that's it.
Entering this season, you don't set a record with the most receptions in a 5 year span by being hurt.


Zion and Salyer are rookies and hitting the rookie wall is a real thing.

That said I'm ready to fire a Telesco and Staley......and get new owners.

[AL9000]

Oh, no doubt. I just have a hard time spending a high draft pick on TE.
I'd be tempted to pick up a FA on the "cheap"... 3-5 million.
I think we're slotted for a good CB.

If the Raiders don’t bring back Foster Moreau, I’d snatch him up for 3-5 mil.

[Boltnut]

If the Raiders don’t bring back Foster Moreau, I’d snatch him up for 3-5 mil.

For sure! I think certain positions can be had relatively cheaply through free agency. TE is one of those positions.
The positions that get paid (and burden your cap) are: QB, OT, DE, WR, and CB. I'd rather spend my early round capital on those positions... not TE.

The last 4 or 5 first round TE's aren't even on their original teams... didn't even make it through their rookie contracts before being traded.