Justin Herbert - Bolts Franchise QB Official Discussion

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  • Charge!
    Registered Charger Fan
    • Aug 2019
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    Originally posted by Xenos View Post
    Alright back in topic, it would behoove Herbert to get a personal trainer this offseason. Someone who can help him have a good routine to train himself physically and mentally. If the personal trainer happens to be a nutritionist, all the better.

    And just to be clear, this is on top of things he did last offseason (and needs to continue) including learning under the new coaches and working with 3DQB.
    agree with that..... if Herbie takes the work ethic, training, nutrition approach of Brady, that can only help him have a longer more successful career....

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    • Xenos
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      • Feb 2019
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      Didn’t realize that Herbert was going to try to reach out to Brees. That’s nice.

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      • Velo
        Ride!
        • Aug 2019
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        One more thing about Herbert that impressed me: He cleaned up his INTs. He a two-game stretch - Buff & NE - where he threw three INTs. But in the final four games he had only one more INT (albeit against weaker D's) while throwing 8 TD passes. Had 0 INTs in the final three games. A rookie throwing 31 TDs to just 10 INTs is phenomenal. Peyton Manning had 28 INTs to 26 TD passes as a rookie. Andrew Luck had 18 INTs to 23 TD passes as a rookie. Baker Mayfield in 14 games had 14 INTs to 27 TD passes as a rookie.

        Also - 11 of his TD passes went to rookie or 2nd year UDFA practice squad players who had never caught an NFL pass. Guyton, Johnson, Parham and Nabers. When you factor in the plays he was making to undrafted players, his accomplishments in 2020 are even more impressive.

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        • Boltdiehard
          The Precious
          • May 2019
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          Originally posted by Velo View Post
          One more thing about Herbert that impressed me: He cleaned up his INTs. He a two-game stretch - Buff & NE - where he threw three INTs. But in the final four games he had only one more INT (albeit against weaker D's) while throwing 8 TD passes. Had 0 INTs in the final three games. A rookie throwing 31 TDs to just 10 INTs is phenomenal. Peyton Manning had 28 INTs to 26 TD passes as a rookie. Andrew Luck had 18 INTs to 23 TD passes as a rookie. Baker Mayfield in 14 games had 14 INTs to 27 TD passes as a rookie.

          Also - 11 of his TD passes went to rookie or 2nd year UDFA practice squad players who had never caught an NFL pass. Guyton, Johnson, Parham and Nabers. When you factor in the plays he was making to undrafted players, his accomplishments in 2020 are even more impressive.
          I could read this stuff all day Velo and he made me a fan of Johnson as well. Love that guy.

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          • Velo
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            Originally posted by Boltdiehard View Post

            I could read this stuff all day Velo and he made me a fan of Johnson as well. Love that guy.
            What impressed me about TJ is that he caught everything he could get his hands on just about. You don't normally see that in a young project player whose main asset is speed. His completion percentage was 77 percent. Guyton's was just 51 percent. Allen's 68. MW's 58. HH 65. TJ also led the team in avg yards per reception with 19.9. Guyton's was 18.3. GB's Marquez Valdez-Scantling led the league at 20.9.

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            • Boltdiehard
              The Precious
              • May 2019
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              Originally posted by Velo View Post

              What impressed me about TJ is that he caught everything he could get his hands on just about. You don't normally see that in a young project player whose main asset is speed. His completion percentage was 77 percent. Guyton's was just 51 percent. Allen's 68. MW's 58. HH 65. TJ also led the team in avg yards per reception with 19.9. Guyton's was 18.3. GB's Marquez Valdez-Scantling led the league at 20.9.
              I like Guyton but there are some drops in his game maybe that will get better. I remember when Johnson caught that bomb against Tampa and everyone was asking WTF is this guy? :lol:

              Somewhere on here someone posted a great vid on him from OK State. He’s a tough dude and he fights.

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              • Velo
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                Originally posted by Boltdiehard View Post

                I like Guyton but there are some drops in his game maybe that will get better. I remember when Johnson caught that bomb against Tampa and everyone was asking WTF is this guy? :lol:

                Somewhere on here someone posted a great vid on him from OK State. He’s a tough dude and he fights.
                Yep. I had no clue who No. 83 was when he hauled in that bomb from Herbert. When the announcer said Tyron Johnson! I was like who da fook is that.?:rofl:

                Yes, Guyton had some bad drops later in the season, a couple were due to nerves. That didn't seem to plague TJ. I don't know, TJ might be able to develop into a solid No. 2 guy.

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                • BoltUp InLA
                  Registered Charger Fan
                  • Sep 2020
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                  Originally posted by Velo View Post
                  One more thing about Herbert that impressed me: He cleaned up his INTs. He a two-game stretch - Buff & NE - where he threw three INTs. But in the final four games he had only one more INT (albeit against weaker D's) while throwing 8 TD passes. Had 0 INTs in the final three games. A rookie throwing 31 TDs to just 10 INTs is phenomenal. Peyton Manning had 28 INTs to 26 TD passes as a rookie. Andrew Luck had 18 INTs to 23 TD passes as a rookie. Baker Mayfield in 14 games had 14 INTs to 27 TD passes as a rookie.

                  Also - 11 of his TD passes went to rookie or 2nd year UDFA practice squad players who had never caught an NFL pass. Guyton, Johnson, Parham and Nabers. When you factor in the plays he was making to undrafted players, his accomplishments in 2020 are even more impressive.
                  And I know that nobody wants to hear this, but I will say it.. The Chargers coaching staff last season could have done much worse than oversee the development of what looks like the next franchise QB. The NFL is highly competitive in every way, so the thought that Herbert’s development did not at all involve the previous coaching staff is utterly ridiculous.

                  Just review the concerns with him entering the draft last year and how well he developed in those areas. That was a collective effort, including his work with House and Beck in the off-season. His unexpected performance may have been unprecedented really.

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                  • BoltUp InLA
                    Registered Charger Fan
                    • Sep 2020
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                    Not sure if this may have been posted earlier, but it’s an article from PFF.

                    Reranking the top quarterbacks from the 2020 draft class moving forward.

                    The 2020 quarterback class wasn’t billed as anything that will go down in the history books, but most agreed pre-draft that there were multiple franchise-type options to be had. When the dust settled, three quarterbacks were taken inside the top six picks, and all ended up starting at least half the season for their respective franchises.

                    That means we get to do what everyone loves to do: overreact. In all seriousness, let’s try to put their rookie seasons in context, examine what they did well or not so well and rerank them based on future projections.


                    1. JOE BURROW, CINCINNATI BENGALS

                    Burrow wasn’t without his warts, and he got his rookie moment out of the way in Week 5 against the Baltimore Ravens, but the player we saw in a handful of games before his ACL tear was as advertised coming out of LSU. The reason Burrow gets the top spot projecting forward as opposed to the likely Rookie of the Year Justin Herbert is that the things he did well are more stable.

                    The Bengals quarterback was lights-out on intermediate passes as a rookie. His 92.5 passing grade ranked fifth among all quarterbacks in the NFL. The only quarterbacks ahead of him were Patrick Mahomes, Russell Wilson, Deshaun Watson and Aaron Rodgers. That’s not bad company to keep. It was only the fourth time a rookie has graded over 90.0 on such throws — with Robert Griffin III, Dak Prescott and Wilson being the other three. His feel and creativity at that level were already elite.

                    Where he struggled was obviously throwing the deep ball. His 20.8% adjusted completion percentage on throws beat out only Dwayne Haskins and Mitchell Trubisky among starting quarterbacks this season. If there’s any silver lining, it’s that he wasn’t making bad decisions down the field; he just missed. And that wasn't the case at all the year prior at LSU, which goes back to the projectable aspect of this. Intermediate success is far more stable year to year than deep success, and I think with personnel better suited to win downfield in 2021, we could see a big bounce back from Burrow in this regard.

                    The only question at this point is whether the Bengals can fix their offensive line and Burrow can return fully healthy from his gruesome knee injury. If that happens, bet on Burrow grading out as a top-10 quarterback in 2021.


                    2. JUSTIN HERBERT, LOS ANGELES CHARGERS

                    The question at this point isn’t about whether Herbert is good but, rather, how good he can be. How high is the ceiling for a 6-foot-6, 236-pound quarterback with a laser arm and legit mobility? It was part of the intrigue surrounding him coming out of Oregon because, while he hit the ground running in college, he peaked from a grading perspective as a sophomore.

                    We’ve never seen a better performance from a rookie under pressure and, honestly, it’s not even close. His 75.4 passing grade under pressure was not only the highest we’ve ever seen from a rookie, it was also the highest in the entire NFL this season. Of the 30 seasons we’ve seen where a quarterback earned a 70.0-plus passing grade under pressure, only five of them came from players you wouldn’t immediately recognize as sure-fire, stud, franchise quarterbacks: Jeff Garcia (2007), Robert Griffin III (2012), Carson Palmer (2015), Jay Cutler (2015) and Marcus Mariota (2017).

                    Performance under pressure, however, is something that is unstable year to year. Drew Brees led the NFL with a 78.9 passing grade under pressure in 2019. This year, he’s at 44.9. The likely MVP in 2020, Aaron Rodgers, earned only a 65.4 passing grade under pressure this season and completed 45.3% of such passes (Herbert was at 57.0%). Because of the variable nature of pressure, we see clean-pocket passing as being far more predictive year to year. And Herbert was only solid comparatively in that facet. His 76.2 passing grade under pressure trailed Burrow’s 86.2 mark and only slightly outpaced Tagovailoa’s 74.5 grade.

                    Still, what he did behind a similarly awful line to what Burrow and Tagovailoa had was nothing short of incredible. And it again brings us back to the initial question of where his next level is if the Chargers can shore up their offensive line. He’s close enough to Burrow after his rookie season to say that while Bengals fans wouldn’t give up Burrow for Herbert, Chargers fans wouldn’t give up Herbert for Burrow, either.


                    3. TUA TAGOVAILOA, MIAMI DOLPHINS

                    There is absolutely no shame in being last on this list with how well the two guys at the top have played. Herbert and Burrow produced two of the eight highest-graded rookie passing seasons we’ve ever seen. Tua’s 63.9 passing grade as a rookie was higher than that of recent quarterbacks Kyler Murray, Josh Allen and Derek Carr — each of whom turned out all right.

                    When looking for positives, his pocket presence and manipulation really stood out. The Dolphins' line, while improved, was still objectively very bad. Tagovailoa had to operate from some tight quarters, which was a wake-up call from his days at Alabama, and he still made plays.

                    He got rid of the ball in a swift 2.52 seconds on average and had a good feel for the timing of the Dolphins' offense. But it was not a scheme that did him many favors, and it was clear now-departed offensive coordinator Chan Gailey was afraid to take the training wheels off.

                    The worry going forward is whether that was by conservatism on a team with a strong defense or out of necessity because Tua couldn’t do those things. Tagovailoa struggled when tasked with pushing the ball to the deep and intermediate areas of the field — and we’re not talking just the accuracy issues that Burrow experienced on his deep ball.

                    Tagovailoa's 65.2 grade on throws targeted 10-plus yards downfield paled in comparison to Burrow (87.3) and Herbert (89.6). He simply wasn’t finding the opportunities when they presented themselves and lost sight of defenders in coverage too often. It’s easy to chalk up plays like the one below to a “rookie mistake,” but there were enough of them that it's worth monitoring going forward.

                    Still, much of the negative perception around Tua at this point stems from things out of his control. He can’t control how many opportunities he gets to win games with his arm. He can’t control that Burrow and Herbert’s outlier rookie seasons make him look bad by comparison. He can’t control that the Dolphins backed their way into the Texans' third overall selection and could be in play for another quarterback this spring. And he certainly can’t control a pandemic-shortened offseason coming off a catastrophic hip injury.

                    If you were high enough on Tua’s talent to draft him No. 5 overall out of Alabama, his rookie season shouldn’t change your opinion on him.

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                    • Xenos
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                      • Feb 2019
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                      Originally posted by BoltUp InLA View Post
                      And I know that nobody wants to hear this, but I will say it.. The Chargers coaching staff last season could have done much worse than oversee the development of what looks like the next franchise QB. The NFL is highly competitive in every way, so the thought that Herbert’s development did not at all involve the previous coaching staff is utterly ridiculous.

                      Just review the concerns with him entering the draft last year and how well he developed in those areas. That was a collective effort, including his work with House and Beck in the off-season. His unexpected performance may have been unprecedented really.
                      I beg to differ. I for one am glad to hear it. Lynn needed to go but no one should take anything from what him and the other coaches did last season.

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                      • 21&500
                        Bolt Spit-Baller
                        • Sep 2018
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                        PFF doubling down.
                        Herbert’s going to shut them up in 2021
                        .005 Brock Bowers, TE/HB/SR Georgia
                        .037 Braden Fiske, DT Florida St.
                        .069 Mike Sainristil, CB Michigan
                        .105 Brenden Rice, WR USC
                        .110 Mason McCormick, OG/OC S. Dakota St.
                        .140 Zak Zinter, OG Michigan
                        .181 Nehemiah Pritchett, CB Auburn
                        .225 Ainias Smith, WR Texas A&M
                        .253 Carson Steele, RB UCLA

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                        • NoMoreChillies
                          Outback Goon
                          • Sep 2018
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                          Originally posted by Xenos View Post

                          I beg to differ. I for one am glad to hear it. Lynn needed to go but no one should take anything from what him and the other coaches did last season.
                          agree

                          when i pointed this out during the season i was shouted down by many posters saying "Herbert wins in spite of coaching"

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