OT: PBS Frontline episode: League of Denial

[richpjr]

Boxing has become a marginalized sport due to a variety of factors, but largely because the appetite for brutality is not what it once was. Boxing still exists. Even at a youth level. But it isn't the national obsession it once was. I can see football becoming diminished in popularity largely because of parents keeping kids out of playing the sport. But I cannot ever really see it going the way of boxing.

I am thinking that boxing fans are switching over to watch MMA - that sport is booming.

[Panama]

All sport (worth playing) entails some risk. Most athletes, parents, etc., understand and accept this. However, some types of risk are just deemed unacceptable. If the NFL wants to survive -- or perhaps this is too dramatic? perhaps we should say "remain the most popular sport in America"? -- protection technology needs to improve. I don't want to see big hits disappear. Like SuperCharger, those big hits are a huge part of why I got so hooked on the sport. (How can one not love watching Ronnie Lott lay down the wood? Few players excited me as much as Rodney Harrison or Chuck Cecil in their heydays!) Instead, I want to see protection technology improve so that big hits (and the small but repetitive hits that seem to be just as much if not more at fault) just aren't so detrimental to the health. And while we're at it, develop some sort of leg brace that greatly reduces the chances of ligament tears without reducing mobility.

Pipe dream? Perhaps. But so was landing a man on the moon. It's in the NFL's best interests to throw money at this sort of research!

[QSmokey]

I am thinking that boxing fans are switching over to watch MMA - that sport is booming.

And there's noting brutal about that. I have to admit, I watch it at times; almost like watching a train wreck. The kicks and punches - multiple - that these guys take to their noggins has got to be doing some serious damage. I can't imagine why anyone would want to participate in such a blood sport. Modern day gladiators...except these guys - and GIRLS! - are willing participants. Nuts.

[Bolt-O]

I am thinking that boxing fans are switching over to watch MMA - that sport is booming.

This... but I think its the BS politics of the alphabet associations that has turned a lot of the long time boxing fans off, and the lack of a decent HW division doesn't help. People still like combat sports, but there isn't the level of excitement anymore with Boxing. I think basic boxing skills are mediocre in MMA, and is only a part of the sport, and because of that, that effect of the small hits that can possibly be a cause of CTE may not be as big of an issue long term. MMA may actually be safer than boxing as far as concussions go. But I digress.

[ArtistFormerlyKnownAsBKR]

This... but I think its the BS politics of the alphabet associations that has turned a lot of the long time boxing fans off, and the lack of a decent HW division doesn't help. People still like combat sports, but there isn't the level of excitement anymore with Boxing. I think basic boxing skills are mediocre in MMA, and is only a part of the sport, and because of that, that effect of the small hits that can possibly be a cause of CTE may not be as big of an issue long term. MMA may actually be safer than boxing as far as concussions go. But I digress.

I think these are fair points. But IMO you have a group of hardcore fans of boxing/combat sports. Boxing used to be a sport followed by the masses, but not so anymore. And the bulk of those folks aren't going to MMA. That said, your point about the politics of boxing is on-point, and I kind of alluded to it, earlier. There's also the whole pay-per-view issue (I remember people at a high school football game bringing a small TV so they wouldn't miss Ali-Spinks). So there's a lot going into the issue. But a lot of what's keeping the masses from boxing is the outright brutality of it. People just have a different mindset about it these days. I think the NFL avoids much of that because of how ingrained it is in the culture (the SB is practically a national holiday). People love the violence, but it has always appeared to be a controlled violence. We'll see how the sport reacts and how successive generations judge the product. But for now, IMO the biggest threat is moms saying no to pee-wee. Who knows, maybe baseball benefits from this?

[Bolt-O]

For sure the threat for football going forward are the parents that will hold their kids from playing a 'dangerous' sport. Unless there is a legacy connection, any family with decent income will steer toward less violent sports, like baseball and soccer (which is now seeing the same issue with concussions...). However, for those in lower economic status and aren't going to be basketball stars, football will still be a the way out, and encourage their athletically gifted to go that direction.

I think there will be football for the near future, and if the equipment companies can catch up, then it may be a safer sport. I would enjoy what we have now, because its not going to get any better.

[BoltBalls]

This is an interesting article:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-03-18/helmets-preventing-concussion-seen-quashed-by-nfl-riddell.html

I'm surprised the NFL isn't pushing these pro caps more now. Steve Tasker from the Buffalo Bills used to wear that also.

[Bolt-O]

I'm surprised the NFL isn't pushing these pro caps more now. Steve Tasker from the Buffalo Bills used to wear that also.

Frankly, its not surprising that it all comes down to money (i.e. sponsorship). Riddell made lots of money as the supplier of the helmets, and made nothing from the pro caps, and the presence of the pro caps made the company look bad. I could see caution for thinking that an external cover as being the cure for concussions, but its hard to see how it could add the increased possibility of death due to a neck injury. Time for a better crash test dummy!

[BoltBalls]

Frankly, its not surprising that it all comes down to money (i.e. sponsorship). Riddell made lots of money as the supplier of the helmets, and made nothing from the pro caps, and the presence of the pro caps made the company look bad. I could see caution for thinking that an external cover as being the cure for concussions, but its hard to see how it could add the increased possibility of death due to a neck injury. Time for a better crash test dummy!

Yeah it's all about the money of course but with the impending lawsuits, scientific findings, and continual rules changes it is only a matter of time before the NFL's popularity will begin its decline. That is big money at stake.

[floydefisher]

I am thinking that boxing fans are switching over to watch MMA - that sport is booming.

This times a lot.

I distinctly remember watching my first MMA tournament (UFC IV)...it was taped, and it was still electric to watch.

What a rush.

As far as the NFL is concerned, it's not going anywhere. Here's what I predict will happen.

1. Improved diagnosis to screen for players at the very earliest stages of CTE, and a major effort to remove those diagnosed from ever playing again (similar to other issues like heart problems).

2. Mandatory retirement age (probably around 30...most of the problem seems to be from players going beyond this age).

3. More tweaks to the game, and possibly some new tech like collision absorbent playing surfaces which can help.

I don't see the game itself going anywhere...it's survived other attempts to ban it, so I doubt it's going to get banned now. Regulated? Possibly, but not banned.

[Panama]

This times a lot.

I distinctly remember watching my first MMA tournament (UFC IV)...it was taped, and it was still electric to watch.

What a rush.

As far as the NFL is concerned, it's not going anywhere. Here's what I predict will happen.

1. Improved diagnosis to screen for players at the very earliest stages of CTE, and a major effort to remove those diagnosed from ever playing again (similar to other issues like heart problems).

2. Mandatory retirement age (probably around 30...most of the problem seems to be from players going beyond this age).

3. More tweaks to the game, and possibly some new tech like collision absorbent playing surfaces which can help.

I don't see the game itself going anywhere...it's survived other attempts to ban it, so I doubt it's going to get banned now. Regulated? Possibly, but not banned.

The NFLPA would never sanction a mandatory retirement age.

No one's talking about the game being banned. Rather, some of us are concerned that as fewer and fewer people risk playing at the lower levels, less talent will come into the league, the quality of play will suffer, and fans will lose interest in a watered down product, relegating the NFL to they same level of relevance as boxing.

[floydefisher]

The NFLPA would never sanction a mandatory retirement age.

No one's talking about the game being banned. Rather, some of us are concerned that as fewer and fewer people risk playing at the lower levels, less talent will come into the league, the quality of play will suffer, and fans will lose interest in a watered down product, relegating the NFL to they same level of relevance as boxing.

With an issue like CFA on the table, how can you not stop people from playing too long? We now pay for everyone's health bills (Obamacare)...so we now all get to tell you what you can and can't do...simple.

NFLPA wants to fight this, they can get bent. The only right they have now is to shut up and eat their tofu.