Official 2025 NFL Draft Superthread | Prospect Discussion

[wu-dai clan]

Our resident draft gurus have always considered Zierlein very good.

Not anymore, apparently.

I guess he's no Bob McGinn .

So you do not want to hear what Lance had to say today.

He considers Jeanty the best player in this draft, and the player most likely to earn a Gold Jacket.

Go ahead...shoot the messenger.

[Boltjolt]

Our resident draft gurus have always considered Zierlein very good.

Not anymore, apparently.

I guess he's no Bob McGinn .

So you do not want to hear what Lance had to say today.

He considers Jeanty the best player in this draft, and the player most likely to earn a Gold Jacket.

Go ahead...shoot the messenger.

I like Zeirlien but like everyone else, he is somtimes wrong.

Man I love Jeanty but not enough to trade up to 5 and give up future firsts for him. I mentioned Jeanty before the college season as one to keep an eye on. I also mentioned Ollie Gordon and he isn't even on my board now 🤦

[Jack Burton]

Our resident draft gurus have always considered Zierlein very good.

Not anymore, apparently.

I guess he's no Bob McGinn .

So you do not want to hear what Lance had to say today.

He considers Jeanty the best player in this draft, and the player most likely to earn a Gold Jacket.

Go ahead...shoot the messenger.

I’ve heard Zerlein for weeks say this. He likes the cost control too.
He talked about getting Jeanty for 7 seasons and how important it is to a teams roster.
5 years on the rookie contract and 2 tag years. Teams see RBs differently than other players.

[beachcomber]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Chargers/co...are&utm_term=4

Worst kept secret.

love the photo of his three kids…. super cool,

[Formula 21]

---

Defensive tackle is the 49ers' biggest need and Mason Graham is the top-ranked player at the position in this year's draft.

Whatever the 49ers do, they should not draft him with the 11th pick.

Early in the offseason, Graham was considered a lock to get drafted in the top five. But the Combine revealed that he's relatively small for a defensive tackle (6'3", 296 lbs.) and his arms are extremely short (32 inches). And in three seasons at Michigan, he recorded just 9 sacks.

Yikes.

Compare Graham to Solomon Thomas, whom the 49ers took with the third pick in the 2017 NFL Draft. Thomas is 6'3", 295 lbs. and his arms are 33 inches long. And he had 11.5 sacks in two seasons at Stanford. And he was extremely athletic at the Combine. And yet, he lacks the size and length to be an effective starter at defensive tackle in the NFL. So he's a backup.

I'm not saying Graham definitely will be a bust and a long-term backup like Thomas. I'm just saying the 49ers probably shouldn't draft a Solomon Thomas doppelganger in Round 1. Let some other team take a chance on a sub-300-pound defensive tackle with 32-inch arms and minimal sack production.

Graham didn't even do any of the athletic testing at the Combine. And at his Pro Day he did position drills only. Sounds like a player who could drop into the late first round.

If the 49ers take a defensive tackle in Round 1, they'd be better off taking Kenneth Grant or Derrick Harmon.

[beachcomber]

recall @least one poster who was pretty darn adamant ‘bout drafting Solomon Thomas,

[DerwinBosa]

Our resident draft gurus have always considered Zierlein very good.

Not anymore, apparently.

I guess he's no Bob McGinn .

So you do not want to hear what Lance had to say today.

He considers Jeanty the best player in this draft, and the player most likely to earn a Gold Jacket.

Go ahead...shoot the messenger.

He's not, because Bob McGinn is a long-time journalist who quotes actual NFL scouts and reports on the draft instead of shouting about a rankings board he is not qualified to make. Unlike the Mel Kipers and Trevor Sikkemas of the industry, McGinn doesn't pretend to be an NFL scout.

And with that said, here is what McGinn reported on some of the pass-rushers in this draft.

Part 8, Edge: Herd of QB Hunters arrive with warnings...

Which prospect with red flags is worth the gamble? Tennessee's James Pearce & Marshall's Mike Green are igniting lively debate in draft meetings. Scouts tell all to our Bob McGinn.

By Bob McGinn

Penn State’s Abdul Carter casts a large shadow over this class of edge rushers. Not only does Carter clearly rank as the best at his position, he might wind up as the best player in the draft.

After that, it’s about as clear as mud.

One team had 14 players graded as starters. Another team projected about half that many.

Missing information clouds the picture for evaluators with anxious owners waiting to write big checks. Ten of the top 15 prospects have yet to run and/or probably won’t run the 40-yard dash, an unprecedented number. Only seven have performed the vertical jump and the bench press.

In the last four years 53 edge rushers have been selected among the top 100 picks, an average of 13.3. That looks about right for this class.

Of the 53, 22 have gone in the first round.

Ten of the 11 edge rushers that made the all-rookie team as selected by the Pro Football Writers of America in the past four years were taken in the first round. The exception was the Rams’ Byron Young, a third-round pick in 2023. Two of the rookie stalwarts — Aidan Hutchinson and Jared Verse — have been voted to the Pro Bowl.

Like most positions, it helps to draft edge rushers early. Of course, there are exceptions.

The Broncos’ Nik Bonitto, the last pick of the second round in 2022, made the Pro Bowl last season. Bonitto has 23 career sacks while another unheralded Bronco, Jonathon Cooper (seventh round, 2021), has 23 ½.

Many of the leading prospects have their fair share of warts. One personnel executive, who happened to rank Marshall’s Mike Green second behind Carter, said, “It’s kind of hit or miss. After the top two it’s strictly developmental. You’re just hoping with the rest of these guys.”

1. ABDUL CARTER, Penn State (6-3 ½, 250, no 40, 1): Third-year junior. “Early in the season he didn’t show much but he was dominating after that,” one scout said. “I’d take (Aidan) Hutchinson. It’s two different body types and two different type of twitches. Carter’s more twitchy. Hutchinson is stronger, more rangy. Carter can come off the edge and bend better.” Started in 2023 as an off-the-ball linebacker before moving to the edge last season. “It’s almost like they did Micah Parsons,” said a second scout. “I guess those guys don’t know how to coach there. They got the top pick in the draft playing inside linebacker last year. He’s a legitimate difference-maker. He’s rare with his motor and athletic ability. He does get beat up some. He’s on the ground too often. He’s just going to keep getting better once he gets more reps (outside).” Started 35 of 42 games, finishing with 172 tackles (41 for loss), 23 sacks, 13 passes defensed and five forced fumbles. “He’s, like, really good,” said a third scout. “He’s f-----g quick. He’s got a get-off. Fluid. Elite pass rusher. He closes quickly and has range all over the field. In the run game, he’s not the most powerful taking on blocks but, shit, the run and chase on him, he’s all over. But the pass game is where he makes his money.”

Spent the off-season rehabilitating foot and shoulder injuries. “He’s just what you want up there (top of the first round),” a fourth scout said. “He’s a Pro Bowl player. He’s got everything you’re looking for as an edge rusher. But he’s not a quality guy.” That scout was one of four personnel people to express reservations about Carter’s makeup. “He’s not a great worker,” said one. “Plays his ass off on Saturday but he’s not a great guy during the week because he’s so gifted. I give him credit. He got hurt in the Boise State (playoff) game and had no business playing against Notre Dame. Played, and played his ass off. He’s a modern, high-maintenance, big-time player. There are similarities to Micah Parsons as a player and as a kid. Micah was probably a little more malicious coming out.” Four-year recruit from Philadelphia. Lettered in basketball as a power forward. “Super athletic,” said a fifth scout. “There’s a little baggage that comes with him. Some people just shrug their shoulders and say it comes with the territory. Other people were a little more concerned with it. Penn State seemed to dial it back because they obviously wanted him to go top 5 or top 10. There’s a pretty strong consensus here that he’s the top defender out there.” His 23 sacks rank sixth on the Nittany Lions’ career list. “If you watch 2023 tape he’s a top-10 will linebacker,” said one scout. “His rarity is he plays at an elite level at two different positions, one of which is a major elite position: pass rusher. You could just as well stand the guy up and say, ‘Hey, go cover this guy,’ and he can do it better than anybody else. Dynamite pass rusher. Just natural. In some games he makes like every other play. Now, with guys with this amount of talent, there’s times you want a little more out of him.”

2. JALON WALKER, Georgia (6-1, 243, no 40, 1): Third-year junior, one-year starter. “When you add the whole player up I’d rather have this guy (than Carter),” said one scout. “Quick twitch, good speed. Big-time motor. If you don’t like him, he’s a tweener. If you like him, he’s a hybrid, and you can use him as an outside linebacker and as a rusher.” Played on and off the ball throughout his career. Often compared to Nolan Smith (6-2, 240, 4.42, 32 5/8 arm), his former teammate and the Eagles’ 30^th overall selection in 2023. “He’s not as speedy (as Smith) but he plays heavier and bigger,” a second scout said. “Nolan was also a little more of a one-trick pony where they lined him up almost as a wide-9 rusher. This guy has more versatility as a pass rusher.” Played as a backup in 29 games as a freshman and sophomore before starting 11 of 14 in 2024. “He’s a defensive coordinator’s dream,” said a third scout. “He played stack backer but he’s best as a DPR (designated pass rusher). You can align this guy all across the front. He has twitch, the ability to bend and to redirect to create pressure. There’s a defensive coordinator right now watching this guy and frothing at the mouth as to what he can do with this guy and creating pressure on the quarterback.” Finished with 89 tackles (19 for loss), 12 ½ sacks and three passes defensed. “What is this guy?” said a fourth scout. “Really good athlete. Can run like the wind. He’s a great quarterback spy. He does show edge speed when he’s allowed to attack, which is not as often as you would like. Not a ton of wiggle as a pass rusher. More just straight bursts and speed upfield. I questioned his instincts and reaction quickness as a linebacker. Gets stuck on blocks too much and needs work on his hand use. Doesn’t have a great body of work in terms of his career because they’ve had so many guys there.” Semifinalist for the Jason Witten Collegiate Man of the Year Award. His makeup was praised by multiple personnel men. “He has top character off the field,” a fifth scout said. “He has that mentality and I like the way he plays, but he just doesn’t produce. He doesn’t feel it. He doesn’t have good instincts. It’s almost similar to the Packers’ Quay Walker guy. When he figures it out and see it, he goes and attacks. He is a tough guy. Plays hard. I think he kind of short-circuits a little bit. He has to be a 3-4 (edge) and not do all this other stuff they do with him. They played him off and he didn’t see it. He was a disappointment.” Arms were 32, hands were 10 ¼.

3. SHEMAR STEWART, Texas A&M (6-5, 270, 4.58, 1): Third-year junior, one-year starter. “He’s the classic example of a guy who has no idea how to play football,” one scout said. “Doesn’t know how to take on blocks, doesn’t know how to find the ball, doesn’t know how to work off things. I was shocked he was 281 (at the Senior Bowl). He plays like he’s 240. He crushed it at the combine but in the games he is just a nonfactor. Just can’t figure it out. He’s damn near defensive-tackle size and they’re playing him standing up, too. He should be a hand-down, go-at-it guy.”

Was 270 at pro day after being 267 at the combine, where he was clocked in 4.58 despite tweaking his hamstring, posted a 40-inch vertical jump and a position-best 10-11 broad jump. “He looks incredible but he’s got like five sacks in his career,” said a second scout. “It’s a little bit all over the map, but the way he tested and the way he looked and ran he’s going in the first round.” Arms were 34 1/8, hands were 9 5/8. “Height-weight-speed physical freak show,” a third scout said. “He’s almost as good as Abdul Carter. Different guy completely. Good effort player. Plays hard in pursuit and in-line. Why isn’t this guy more productive? Wow edge speed. You really see it coming out of the turn. He’s explosive down the middle of a blocker. He’s really stout at the point. Plays with physicality. He lacked instincts and awareness. Mental delays when he’s stunting inside. Mental has to be looked into. Maybe it’s what they’re asking him to do. I don’t know. Maybe we could do something different with him and it would look different. Physically, this guy’s everything you want. He could play either defensive end or 3-technique.” Finished with 65 tackles, 4 ½ sacks and four passes defensed in 37 games, including 19 starts. Five-star recruit from Miami.

4. MYKEL WILLIAMS, Georgia (6-5, 267, 4.77, 1): Suffered an ankle injury in the opener, missed time and played 12 games. At the combine, he said he was “less than 60%” for the balance of the season. “He’s been beat-up,” one scout said. “He just doesn’t have the production you would expect out of his traits. I interviewed him. He got really fired up when I started asking him about teams banging on him on production. He said, ‘I can’t wait for this. I played what the coaches told me to play. I two-gapped a lot and they put me inside a lot of times. I’m an edge rusher, and I can have 10 sacks on the edge.’ That’s his narrative.” In 2022, Georgia edge Travon Walker (6-5, 270, 4.59, 35 ½ arm) was the first overall choice by Jacksonville. “Very similar,” the scout said. “Travon’s a little looser athlete. Definitely runs a lot better. Better in space. Mykel’s a little bit more of a power player where Travon could do a lot athletically.” Longest arms at the position (34 3/8). Hands were 10 ¼. “I thought this guy was better than Travon Walker,” a second scout said. “If he had had the year he was supposed to he would have challenged for the first pick in the draft. That didn’t happen.” Two-year starter. Finished with 67 tackles (23 for loss), 14 sacks and four passes defensed. “This is a true, 5, 6-technique but can play 4i,” said a third scout. “Has speed to power. Has enough bend and redirect. He can long-arm tackles off the edge. He was obviously really good last year and this year battled injuries. You can go look at the Texas game when he’s throwing guys around. You can’t have enough players like this.” Four-star recruit from Columbus, Ga. “He’s very similar to Travon Walker,” said a fourth scout. “Big tough-ass guy who looks like he should be a monster but he’s not. Reminded me of Boogie Basham that came out of Wake Forest and bounced around (four seasons, 4 ½ sacks). A lot of these Georgia guys, they play hard and they play their role but they don’t know how to play.” Added a fifth scout: “True classic 4-3 defensive end. He’s able to just beat up on a tight end and have enough pass rush to get home. No, he wouldn’t be a standup guy. I just didn’t see quite the athleticism in space to be a standup guy. I almost think, ‘Hey, maybe you bulk this guy up and he could be a 5-technique.’ That’s the way they played him some of the time. He stood up as well.”

5. JAMES PEARCE, Tennessee (6-5, 248, 4.48, 1): Third-year junior, one-year starter. “He’s talented — really talented,” one scout said. “Built like an NFL player. He’s got twitch, can get off the ball, got production. Some scouts are worried about the guy. I was at a game and the guy was just a complete Lone Ranger. By himself on the sideline, standing 20 yards from anybody on his team. Didn’t look like he cared at all. Claims he was a captain and a leader and all that stuff, but it’s just one of those things that he might just have been anointed that versus earning it. Traits-wise, he’s for sure first round.” Ran a blazing 40 but his vertical jump (31) was the poorest of the top 20 at the position. “Really liked the get-off and burst of speed and bend,” a second scout said. “Not a lot of power in his rush but he can really run. Didn’t play a ton of snaps like you would think. Not soft. Mid-first round.” Arms were 32 ¾, hands were 10. “There’s some concerns on the character,” said a third scout. “Lot of emotional outbursts and inconsistency. He’s not quite Von Miller but he’s got that kind of ability to turn the corner and get home on the quarterback. More of a one-dimensional player at this point in his career. Not heavy enough to play the run. He’s a leaky tackler who falls off too often. He had top-5 buzz coming off 2023 (10 sacks) and then with more attention focused on him he disappeared in some games.” Finished with 71 tackles (30 for loss), 19 ½ sacks and two passes defensed in 39 games, including 12 starts. “Pearce belongs with the top three but the mental part, the personality part is what I would say pushes him down,” a fourth scout said. “You knew at the combine he would put on that show, and he did. He did not disappoint. He probably goes after Williams, Carter and Stewart. But it will probably be to a successful team that will feel like they can take him on. At Tennessee, he was literally a no-go. You ask somebody there: ‘Hey, if you had a chance to come to the league, would you bring this guy?’ They’re, like, ‘Absolutely not.’ On his own program. The whole team’s working out and he’s in his apartment. They didn’t know where he was.” Four-star recruit from Charlotte. “Almost a basketball player’s body,” a fifth scout said. “Got some first-step quicks but not really explosive. He’s not strong. They push him around. Not very physical at the point of attack. A 3-4 guy. I’ve seen a lot of profiles like this go bust. He’s scary. He had a lot of hype coming in. That will carry him a long way.” Volunteers’ first defensive lineman to make first team All-Southeastern Conference two straight years since John Henderson 25 years ago.

6. MIKE GREEN, Marshall (6-3, 248, no 40, 1-2): His 17 sacks in 2024 led FBS. “He’s my No. 2 edge,” said one scout. “I wouldn’t want him as a D-end but he could be a difference-maker as a 3-4 linebacker. Hell of a player. He’s probably got the best pass-rush arsenal of all these guys. He’s a menace. Former high-school wrestler, and you see that the way he can use his hands and get off things. He uses leverage and angles. That (short arms) will hurt him.” Arms were 32. Smallest hands (8 ½) among the top 12 at the position. Bench-press reps of 28 led the position. His 3-cone time of 6.79 was superb. “The guy has twitch and he’s quick,” said a second scout. “He’s slippery. He can go underneath blocks. He has a long arm. He can rip. He can dip. He has all the qualities you want as an outside guy. Doesn’t have a lot of bulk and strength but because he’s so quick and has the speed he’ll catch you off-balance and go by you. He can go around and circle behind the quarterback. The effort’s there, too. But he had a couple Title IX’s in his lifetime.” Was dismissed in September 2022 after his freshman year at Virginia and played at Marshall in 2023-’24. At the combine, Green said there have been two allegations of sexual assault against him, both of which he denied. The other occurred during his high school years in Williamsburg, Va. “He’s got the character issue,” said a third scout. “Nothing ever came of it legally but there’s a lot of smoke. He’s got some problems. Just a natural pass rusher. Has lower-body tightness. Struggles against the run. He’s like a backup-third down rusher.” Finished with 131 tackles (33 for loss), 22 ½ sacks and two passes defensed. “We didn’t have him in the first round,” said a fourth scout. “There are people who do. If he goes first round it’s more later because of that (character). He might be the next just pure rusher after Carter.” Three-star recruit. Voted Marshall’s most valuable player in 2024. “Really a violent player,” a fifth scout said. “Little undisciplined, but he’s a quick-twitch athlete with really good speed and can disrupt all over the field. Not the biggest guy, but plays the run with effort and toughness.”

[wu-dai clan]

I seem to have triggered some of our draft gurus.

[dmac_bolt]

A rookie for four years will cost what this guy costs for one year and you have to extend him.
this year would be 6.5m -- the next three years would probably be another $20m

A rookie would be $5m total - and might be just as good

One thing is - listening to podcasts lately, winning teams get rookies to play and contribute

Therein lies the entirety of the rub. Mr Day2 or Day3 Rookie might only not be just as good, he might be no good at all. Folks can point to their favorite 4th or 5th round starting OC, but they ignore the dozens of others that wash out. I remember Tuerk (was that his name, from UCLA I think?). And if Mr Rook is no good at all, Herbie has another long 17 games of fuck me until Joe gets to try again. Is it worth $6M to ensure Justin doesn’t suffer another 17 game fuck over? Has he suffered enough of those with shit OCs yet? Clary, Boze, … ffs, amiright?

I don’t know how this McGovern sub-thread got started, but any OC draft pick taken Rd3 or later is an IF proposition. McGov seems to be another fanciful thread filler exercise absent any facts to me - one of many as we await to learn what really will happen. Thats cool, it’s fun. This guy ain’t no pro bowler, but any OC with a proven NFL PFF grade of 70 goes to the top of the Charger depth chart the day they issue him a locker and pads.

one thing is - watching real football every weekend every year - NO TEAM gets all of their rookies to play and contribute. No GM hits on every pick. None. Which ones will and which ones won’t is always the question.

[Chargers8491]

Chargers are definitely looking to bolster their LBing core. This is the 2nd LBer they have brought in. They brought in Xander Mueller, Northwestern. I'm going to have to do some research on him. Apparently, he is good in coverage and had a lot of tackles. His 2024 season was cut short due to injury. I'll drop a link below:

Chargers scored pre-draft meeting with 200-plus tackle linebacker

[Jack Burton]

Chargers are definitely looking to bolster their LBing core. This is the 2nd LBer they have brought in. They brought in Xander Mueller, Northwestern. I'm going to have to do some research on him. Apparently, he is good in coverage and had a lot of tackles. His 2024 season was cut short due to injury. I'll drop a link below:

Chargers scored pre-draft meeting with 200-plus tackle linebacker

Good insight. Somethings up there…

[Bolt4Knob]

Our resident draft gurus have always considered Zierlein very good.

Not anymore, apparently.

I guess he's no Bob McGinn .

So you do not want to hear what Lance had to say today.

He considers Jeanty the best player in this draft, and the player most likely to earn a Gold Jacket.

Go ahead...shoot the messenger.

Dane Brugler had Jeanty as a top 3 player on his board

Chargers not trading up for Jeanty isn't about the player Jeanty is - its about the cost to get him and the needs on the roster. Especially in a RB deep class

You take Jeanty and a bunch of 6th rounders
I will fill three needs -- one of which is a solid RB