Do We Need The Gutsy (Analytics) Staley Back?

[Maniaque 6]

I don't like the Steelers but they got something amazing
3 HC in +30 years and some championship matches

[Xenos]

Yes we do.

[NoMoreChillies]

I reckon the 4th and Staley call was gutsy. The play call was bonkers. Herb sneak all day there

[ChargersPowderBlue]

Staley is lucky we won. plain and simple. He had a great game up until that point, it could have been put away much earlier.

It would. If the refs didn't gift MIN 3 of their points, where there should have been a fumble but they ruled forward progress. That was debatable. And before that, a penalty on DJ that extended Minnesota's drive which was hypocritical when a Vikings defender did the same thing he did. Another one that helped Minnesota stay in the game is Dicker missing a 53 yard field goal attempt. If he could make 50 yard kicks that would help. He's only made one in his career. Staley could have also punted instead on that drive.

As pointed out by Ghost, Parham missed a key block. It wasn't a good game by Kelley, and maybe Spiller would have been better there. Short yardage plays are not a strong suit historically, they need to do better.

Teams get those short yardage situations most of the time. The interior OL did a poor job of getting push on Viking defenders on that play. Linsley, Zion, and Salyer crashed down leading to Kelly getting stuffed. The two young guys have had their struggles this year.

[Bolt-O]

Teams get those short yardage situations most of the time. The interior OL did a poor job of getting push on Viking defenders on that play. Linsley, Zion, and Salyer crashed down leading to Kelly getting stuffed. The two young guys have had their struggles this year.

I saw the play again, and Pipkins completely missed his block as well. Kelley was occupied with pass protection as well for most of the game with the constant blitzing, so even though the numbers on the running game have fallen off, Moore was calling plays that took what the Vikings were giving on their 'all-in' blitz heavy plan.

So bringing this back to the topic... the decision to go for it on 4th down was good, given the issues with the D on stopping longer drives late, the play call was so-so, probably better to go with a QB sneak than with the cold RB dive, but poor execution of the play that was called. All this obviated if Keenan had made the line to gain on his reception on 3rd down.

[charger1_sj]

I saw the play again, and Pipkins completely missed his block as well. Kelley was occupied with pass protection as well for most of the game with the constant blitzing, so even though the numbers on the running game have fallen off, Moore was calling plays that took what the Vikings were giving on their 'all-in' blitz heavy plan.

So bringing this back to the topic... the decision to go for it on 4th down was good, given the issues with the D on stopping longer drives late, the play call was so-so, probably better to go with a QB sneak than with the cold RB dive, but poor execution of the play that was called. All this obviated if Keenan had made the line to gain on his reception on 3rd down.

Given the circumstances I don't think it was good. Start with the Vikings putting 8 guys in the box all game long. Running for the 1st was going to be a challenge to begin with.
Passing on 4th and 1 is a gamble. The DBs are going to jam the receivers and pass rushers are coming through the gaps. Vikings were out of time outs. They would have
gotten the ball back with approximately 1:40 left and anywhere from 50 to 65 yards from pay dirt. If you can't keep them out of the end zone in those circumstances you deserve to lose.

We won due to the incompetence of the Vikings. They also came up short earlier from our 3 yards line. They are inept. If we had lost that game, serious discussions about
Staley's job would have been considered.

[Bolt-O]

Given the circumstances I don't think it was good. Start with the Vikings putting 8 guys in the box all game long. Running for the 1st was going to be a challenge to begin with.
Passing on 4th and 1 is a gamble. The DBs are going to jam the receivers and pass rushers are coming through the gaps. Vikings were out of time outs. They would have
gotten the ball back with approximately 1:40 left and anywhere from 50 to 65 yards from pay dirt. If you can't keep them out of the end zone in those circumstances you deserve to lose.

We won due to the incompetence of the Vikings. They also came up short earlier from our 3 yards line. They are inept. If we had lost that game, serious discussions about
Staley's job would have been considered.

Here's where we have agree to disagree. I think Staley didn't just rely on analytics, but was betting that the offense could get the 1 freaking yard. The Defense up to that moment just came off a stop, maybe the first time they did that deep, and has had the history of giving up lots of chunk plays that made 60 yards look easy. I know all the conventional wisdom arguments scream punt, but Staley should have a better feel of his team than talking heads, including that HOF coach because he was there. It sounds like I'm making excuses for Staley, but I'm only speculating on his thinking. Ultimately it was execution of the play, not the decision that was the failure point.

Anyway, yeah the Vikings choked hard on their second chance. That mess was far worse than the 4th and 1.

[foreigner]

.

[charger1_sj]

Here's where we have agree to disagree. I think Staley didn't just rely on analytics, but was betting that the offense could get the 1 freaking yard. The Defense up to that moment just came off a stop, maybe the first time they did that deep, and has had the history of giving up lots of chunk plays that made 60 yards look easy. I know all the conventional wisdom arguments scream punt, but Staley should have a better feel of his team than talking heads, including that HOF coach because he was there. It sounds like I'm making excuses for Staley, but I'm only speculating on his thinking. Ultimately it was execution of the play, not the decision that was the failure point.

Anyway, yeah the Vikings choked hard on their second chance. That mess was far worse than the 4th and 1.

Betting that you can get 1 yard is based on analytics. Down and yards situation. It disregards the human element. Purely math based. Yes Staley should know his players better
than a retired NFL HOF coach. On the other hand that guy is speaking from experience and he's not the only one.

We got away with one that we needed badly. So it's off to the next game. Let's just hope we don't get in another similar situation.

[AK47]

Betting that you can get 1 yard is based on analytics. Down and yards situation. It disregards the human element. Purely math based. Yes Staley should know his players better
than a retired NFL HOF coach. On the other hand that guy is speaking from experience and he's not the only one.

We got away with one that we needed badly. So it's off to the next game. Let's just hope we don't get in another similar situation.

This is learning experience from Herbert. I'm curious what a young Manning or Brady would do in the same situation. Plead with the coach to punt or go out and play.

[Riverwalk]

Betting that you can get 1 yard is based on analytics. Down and yards situation. It disregards the human element. Purely math based. Yes Staley should know his players better
than a retired NFL HOF coach. On the other hand that guy is speaking from experience and he's not the only one.

We got away with one that we needed badly. So it's off to the next game. Let's just hope we don't get in another similar situation.

Exactly. Analytics take league wide stats in similar circumstance.

However Chargers don’t have the typical OL or downhill power RB that makes those 4th and 1’s work most of the time. That’s where the “human element” you’re talking about factors into play.

Kelley isn’t Derrick Henry.

[charger1_sj]

Exactly. Analytics take league wide stats in similar circumstance.

However Chargers don’t have the typical OL or downhill power RB that makes those 4th and 1’s work most of the time. That’s where the “human element” you’re talking about factors into play.

Kelley isn’t Derrick Henry.

Well he did it again and we failed again. Luck would have it being the Raiders with a 4th round QB that has not played a single down in the NFL until this game
throws an interception at the goal line. Lighting struck twice in the same circumstance.

What's going to be the excuse next time, because the law of averages is going to catch up and we're not going to be so lucky