2024 Chargers Roster Build Discussion - Transactions | News

[blueman]

Salyer at RT ?

Been saying this for months..

[SuperChargedRodney37]

Yeah, Bowers will cost MUCH less in his 2nd contract than Nabers ,MHJ or Odunze or any top WR. Look who just got 25 mil a year

As they should but it's not $25 million a year. The guaranteed money is what matters in the NFL. These contracts are more complexed than the MLB/NBA/NHL where everything is guaranteed.

[dmac_bolt]

As they should but it's not $25 million a year. The guaranteed money is what matters in the NFL. These contracts are more complexed than the MLB/NBA/NHL where everything is guaranteed.

"Bowers will get a lot less in his second contract" is not a reason to draft him, I am not sure some people understand the strategic implication of this.

We can sign him as a FA after his rookie contract is completed, any team can sign him.

[Boltjolt]

As they should but it's not $25 million a year. The guaranteed money is what matters in the NFL. These contracts are more complexed than the MLB/NBA/NHL where everything is guaranteed.

Still averages 25 a year. 51 m of that is guaranteed. That's what AoV means on OTC and Sportrac. I assume he will get 51 his first two years and year three just makes it easier to cut him. In any case, however it is structured that's expensive for a #2 WR.

That's my point when saying Bowers will be much cheaper to resign if we draft him, to his 2nd contract than a top WR we draft.....and Bowers can be in the slot often and be a good one.

[dmac_bolt]

Still averages 25 a year. 51 m of that is guaranteed. That's what AoV means on OTC and Sportrac. I assume he will get 51 his first two years and year three just makes it easier to cut him. In any case, however it is structured that's expensive for a #2 WR.

That's my point when saying Bowers will be much cheaper to resign if we draft him, to his 2nd contract than a top WR we draft.....and Bowers can be in the slot often and be a good one.

I'm not saying don't draft Bowers. I like him, I like him plenty - I'd be fine if they draft him if thats their vision to build the team. But the draft value argument is the exact opposite. Any team can sign a FA player after they play out their rookie contract, the key value is gained while the player is still in their rookie deal (according to this theory).

The team cap value model of drafting looks for the biggest difference between rookie contract and current top contracts for that same position. Top WRs cost ~$10M more per year than Top TEs do ($25m vs $15m when I looked up Top 5 of each). According to the Team Cap Value Theory, drafting a top WR instead of a Top TE allows a team to have $10M more available in their team cap per year while the rookie deal is in place. This $10M can be used for one, two, three other solid proven veteran players on the roster.

According to this theory - you should use your #1 pick on OT or WR every 4 years and let them walk a the end and draft new ones (and take comp picks as they sign with new teams for the biggest contracts). Meanwhile you just go out and sign the most expensive FA TE in the league and don't worry about that cost as you're saving it and more in your OTs and WRs.

I am more in the camp of just go draft the best player you think will help your team to win the most. But arguing "value" for drafting a TE Bowers in Rd1 over WR, OT, Edge, or even DT is a loser argument. its completely inverted from the real value.

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Unless we get into the "well, what if I franchise tag all of these players every year - then eventually the WR and OT is more expensive" thats true - but you can only tag them for a couple years and then they are UFA that can sign with anyone. the purist "Team Cap Value" proponents let them walk and draft new players.

[Boltnut]

Just because they brought him in doesnt mean they are considering him at 23....or the other teams for that matter. Ravens might be, but they also have OT as a bigger need in round 1.

We brought in Guerendo. He isnt coming close to round 1. He is likely round 5. Teams bring in some players to get medical evals and interviews and get a better idea of them for those they have an interest in. Not neccessarily because they are a early target. Guerendo has had injuries that ended his seasons so he imo is a medical eval. Two of those were hamstring injuries. Another a LisFranc. Cooper from what i can gather hasnt had any big injuries so he is a different interview.

I havent seen who all they brought in so far.

You're right, it doesn't mean they are neccessarily considering him @#23. Maybe the #22, #24, #25, and #26 teams are actually considering him in he 2nd round @ #55, #57, #58, #59, and #60. But I know a team (the Chargers) that is not @#56... so are they an outlier...?

Now I know the Chargers aren't officially @#23 either. But that trade-back with the Vikings seems pretty certain. I think Cooper is a pretty good comp to Patrick Queen (who the Ravens took @#28 a few years back). The pass rushing element of Cooper pushes him up a bit IMO.

I'm just spit-balling (with a few game tapes under my belt)... but I see a defensive weapon in this guy.

[dmac_bolt]

You're right, it doesn't mean they are neccessarily considering him @#23. Maybe the #22, #24, #25, and #26 teams are actually considering him in he 2nd round @ #55, #57, #58, #59, and #60. But I know a team (the Chargers) that is not @#56... so are they an outlier...?

Now I know the Chargers aren't officially @#23 either. But that trade-back with the Vikings seems pretty certain. I think Cooper is a pretty good comp to Patrick Queen (who the Ravens took @#28 a few years back). The pass rushing element of Cooper pushes him up a bit IMO.

I'm just spit-balling (with a few game tapes under my belt)... but I see a defensive weapon in this guy.

I'd like them to draft Cooper - he's 23 worthy. not as sexy as we tend to not notice the guy who covered his player well and prevented the QB from ever throwing him the ball but he's the best pass-defense LB in the class that can also penetrate blitz the QB, stop the run, etc.

The problem is there's a half dozen or more other players we all like that are 23-worthy too - hence some will need to come in and argue he's not worth 23 because they prefer someone else. Its fair to prefer someone else but these draft pick threads have turned into game of thrones blood sport ... lol ...

[Boltnut]

I'd like them to draft Cooper - he's 23 worthy. not as sexy as we tend to not notice the guy who covered his player well and prevented the QB from ever throwing him the ball but he's the best pass-defense LB in the class that can also penetrate blitz the QB, stop the run, etc.

The problem is there's a half dozen or more other players we all like that are 23-worthy too - hence some will need to come in and argue he's not worth 23 because they prefer someone else. Its fair to prefer someone else but these draft pick threads have turned into game of thrones blood sport ... lol ...

I agree. There may be a lot of other guys that can be had with that #23 pick. I've even listed several others that I'd like to have there.
One poster (I forget who) suggested that we'd be trading back for a bag of Doritos. The #23 pick will be more than a bag of Doritos.
I'm just looking for a guy that could make the team better. As many have pointed out, we have several holes to fill.

[DerwinBosa]

Pipkins I believe is in his contract year. So whether or not he starts this year is the only concern. He is not going to be with the Chargers for 4-5 more years.
But Zion might and that's a concern because we are not a championship team in 2024. But beyond that we hope to be so Zion and Sayler are much bigger
concerns for me. Not to mention a starting C, which is also a big key to improving the OG play.

Pipkins is signed through 2025, but there is a potential out next offseason. So, yes, right tackle is a major concern, being how our current starting right tackle, who isn't in the top 25 at his position, very likely won't be with the team beyond this season.

No centers or guards will be worth taking fifth or 11th overall in this draft. If there were a Quenton Nelson or Zack Martin in this draft, believe me, I would be thrilled to take one of them at #5.

[SuperChargedRodney37]

Still averages 25 a year. 51 m of that is guaranteed. That's what AoV means on OTC and Sportrac. I assume he will get 51 his first two years and year three just makes it easier to cut him. In any case, however it is structured that's expensive for a #2 WR.

That's my point when saying Bowers will be much cheaper to resign if we draft him, to his 2nd contract than a top WR we draft.....and Bowers can be in the slot often and be a good one.

The Eagles paid a Top #10 drafted receiver earlier to beat the run that is about to happen with Jefferson &Chase. They actually got good value here as the 5th year option would have been $15,591,000 fully guaranteed.

Bowers again would be cheaper and should be because he’s a TE. Even though he will be cheaper, his value is still going to be upside down. Bowers is more acceptable at the pick #11 pay scale but is still an overpay from day one. So unless he becomes what people are opining he will be, he will continue to be overpaid as far as positional value.
He’s a Blue Chip prospect but is he Top 6 TE good? We don’t know but to live up to the contract he would get paid, he has to be. That a lot of pressure for any young man to live up to.
Not to mention his first job will be to block which he is no fan of.

Again, he’s a Blue Chip prospect but the fans think he’s a greater fit than the actual team does.

[charger1_sj]

Pipkins is signed through 2025, but there is a potential out next offseason. So, yes, right tackle is a major concern, being how our current starting right tackle, who isn't in the top 25 at his position, very likely won't be with the team beyond this season.

No centers or guards will be worth taking fifth or 11th overall in this draft. If there were a Quenton Nelson or Zack Martin in this draft, believe me, I would be thrilled to take one of them at #5.

I'm not advocating taking a OG or C @5. Far from it. I'm saying that the C and OG positions were more of a problem than Pipkins.
Yet all the bitching is about Pipkins. There are 32 starting RTs in the NFL, Pipkins is somewhere in the muddled middle not as bad
as you and others seem to think. Yes an upgrade would be nice and welcomed even needed after this year. But I would not draft a OT
@5 if comes down to it, not when one or more of the top WRs in this draft are there. If we trade down I'll think about it if we get 2 1st
rounder out of the deal because there will be some very good WRs still there.

[Boltjolt]

The Eagles paid a Top #10 drafted receiver earlier to beat the run that is about to happen with Jefferson &Chase. They actually got good value here as the 5th year option would have been $15,591,000 fully guaranteed.

Bowers again would be cheaper and should be because he’s a TE. Even though he will be cheaper, his value is still going to be upside down. Bowers is more acceptable at the pick #11 pay scale but is still an overpay from day one. So unless he becomes what people are opining he will be, he will continue to be overpaid as far as positional value.
He’s a Blue Chip prospect but is he Top 6 TE good? We don’t know but to live up to the contract he would get paid, he has to be. That a lot of pressure for any young man to live up to.
Not to mention his first job will be to block which he is no fan of.

Again, he’s a Blue Chip prospect but the fans think he’s a greater fit than the actual team does.

The Eagles are still going to pay that 5th year option guaranteed money as it was part of the deal. It changes nothing. His new deal was a 3 year extension. What if he gets hurt badly the next two years at his size? Then they are on the hook for 51mil guaranteed. He has been durable his first three years but he is 170 lbs. It may take its toll. True he got less than Chase or Jefferson but he isn't either of them and wouldn't get as much anyways. He is the #2 receiver on his team.

Again, this shows owners don't care about that as much as you seem to think. You keep track of this as if you are going to the store with coupons. JaMarcus freaking Russell was drafted #1. Trey Lance was 3rd and they traded up to get him. Sean Taylor was drafted 4th..a safety.

AJ Brown signed a 4 year 100 mil deal with them as well. However, when Smiths extension kicks in, Brown will be in the last year of his so they may release or trade him but before that season Devonta will be on his 15.8 mil 5th year option.