2017 Free agency

[blueman]

Unless they think they'll be in the running for a Whitworth type signing, they should lock up Ingram. At least take care of that side of the ball, and not create a big hole like that.

[Steve]

The guy I think would be a good fit is Ty Nsekhe of the Redskins. He is their 3rd OT, and has started 6 games over the last couple of years and played most of a couple others. He is a pretty good OT, but because he is a late bloomer, he hasn't had a chance to win a starting job. He is stuck behind Morgan Moses and Trent Williams, plus they want Brandon Schreff back at OT at some point. He has also bounced around a number of camps, and practice squads before finally becoming a pretty good player at age 30. He is a low wear guy, but only has 2 years vested, so he is a restricted FA. If he waits the 2 more years to go leave, he will never get a chance to sign a real contract, so the Redskins are sympathietic to the idea of letting him go and take his chances to become a starter. It helps that the Redskins are also high on Kevin Bowen a rookie they brought in last year, so they are not devoid of OT talent.

IF the Redskins tender him, we can probably trade a late round pick for him, and give him pretty average starters money for a guy who is pretty low wear. HE is not a long term solution, but he is a guy who has started games in the NFL and has shown he belongs. HE can also play both sides and is a good run blocker, in addition to being a Dunlap caliber pass protector.

[Boltjolt]

Makes sense, the Ravens are a winning organization. Maybe I should become a Ravens fan.

They have won two SBs but have made the playoffs only once since their last SB in 2012. More consistant than us for sure. Ive seen some players wanting to recruit Ingram, led by Weddle on Twitter. No idea if the front office is interested.

[Fleet]

The price for JPP would be the thing. If you are not willing to pay a big contract to Ingram, why would you pay an even more inconsistent and injury history anything like what you would pay Ingram? To me JPP is not that great a player because he is so up and down. He has proven he is a poor risk since he can't play consistently when he is still motivated by earning a big money contract. If you give it to him, why would he be playing hard every down?

I just watched some Youtube videos of Reddick and I don't see him being that great. He is a great athlete, that much is obvious. But I don't see him being a great LB. All he has done to date is play DE, and not even very well. He is a good college DE vs average OL. BUt I would have liked to see him be productive.

The interesting thing is that we have a ton of 34 OLB to play the SAM LB and LEO rush LB spot. Ingram will get whatever spot they feel he fits best, and then everyone else will be in a battle to make the roster. Since we are rotten with OLB, I am not sure why we would draft another one, unless the guy can come in and play right away. Reddick is going to take a year or two to learn to play LB in the NFL. And since he can't rush the passer well, he is not going to be much of an impact guy. IN time he might be, but I think 2nd is way too high for a guy who is such a project.

I also don't see Brown being moved to play OLB. I think many fans are hoping he gets moved there because of his size, but his skill set says he is a classic read and react LB. Given that we can protect him better with 4 DL than with just 3, I think he will be in a much better spot.

Toomer is the guy I want to see what happens with. Seattle actually did draft him to play SAM. He has the same kind of range and athelticism as Reddick, and we don't have to spend a draft pick on him.

We are rotten with LB types on our roster right now. I am not sure drafting yet another LB make that much sense. That will be even more clear when we find out who is playing where. Any number of our guys could be either LEO or SAM lb. SAM Lb is just a drop LB who only rushes the QB on passing downs. Leo is the OLB/DE who ALWAYS rushes. That is why we switched to this flavor of defense. Because it really doesn't change what we are doing.

JPP when hes on the field leads most everyone in QB pressures. Hes relentless. He blew his hand off. Ingram has been injured as well. So you cant say Ingram is more dependable. This is based on the rumors that he may want to be in Baltimore. Id prefer we just tag him than sign JPP. But its a backup plan like i said. If JPP dosnt blow up his hand he probably has missed less time than Ingram. 20 games 48 hurries injured over the last 2 years. 50 through 32 games for Ingram the last 2 years. I expect JPP to rebound. But i also would prefer Ingram. Like i said backup plan.

Oh and thanks for educating me on the SAM LB. I forgot you're the only one who knows what hes talking about here. My bad. I wont even respond to the rest of what you said if think im that clueless.

I disagree with you on Reddick. I think a lot of team scouts would as well. At least from what i hear. Hes got a bright future. You may want to take a look at more than just a couple youtube vids. You didnt have much to say about SB practices and the game from what i remember. He made everyone look silly. From the DE spot as well as OLB. He was a machine. His ceiling is high. Im honestly sort of shocked you would even say you dont think hes good based on a couple youtube vids. Im just curious are you always right about players? I dont think so.

With that we can just disagree on the player.

[Steve]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtrN78cmDyM (Temple vs Cinci)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKDG5MDHRvc (Temple vs ND)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-XQI1ygSBs (Temple vs USF)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-OJMFzyYCs (Temple vs Memphis)

No one is saying he doesn't have the potential to be a great player at some point, but he hasn't done it based on these games. And a full game of cut ups, not highlight and watered down all star games offense or defense (in terms of scheme and players studying one another and game planning) gives a far better look into what a player is really like.

[Fleet]

22 tackles for loss. Lead the country. 10/11 sacks. Dominated the best at the SB. At DE and at OLB. I understand Jeremiah and Mayock are not always correct. But they pretty much reiterated what i already knew. Hes a baller. I wont come off that. Every year you guys get on me about players i like. Its nothing new. They end up doing pretty well. Especially the LB's. To each there own. Y9ou said you watched a couple youtube videos and came to the conclusion that he wasnt very good. I was just shocked someone like you would even say that.

[Steve]

I'm not getting on you for players you like or don't like. I don't care that much. When I start seeing multiple mention of players others like I watch them and come to my own conclusions. But I didn't watch that much college football this year, and this is sort of how I do my pre-scouting. If you don't want me to scout players any more, I won't, or at least keep it to myself.

But I call it like I see it. He is a very good college player who has great stats but I don't see what he does translating to the NFL. Admittedly, I am developing a bias against good athletes with poor technique. Lately, doing a quick check, if you look at the players we have taken recently, the ones who go on and have some immediate success, it tends to be the guys who have better technique and "play" like an NFL player. That means DE who get a good jump off the ball, use their hands well. LB who attack the line. DB who can sink their hips and use their hands in press....... Reddick is a great athlete but a raw football player.

He slow plays almost everything. He doesn't attack the line. He doesn't use his hands well. He is slow to disengage when he is being blocked. I am not saying he can't become a great player. I am saying he is a long way off as of right now. He has the speed. He looks effortless when he runs. In the 4 games above he has numerous tackles for a loss, but he had manybe one where the play was run at him, the rest all came when he outran the angle, which isn't going to happen in the NFL. He appears to be slow to react. HE does take good angles and is very athletic in space. But it takes some technque and effort to do things right to be successful as an NFL player. He can't live off being a great athlete like he did in college.

He reminds me a lot of how Jarvis Jones played OLB at Georgia. Jones would get up to the line, engage a blocker, then disengage and chase the guy down. I checked every sack he had his last year, and half of them from the year before, and only 1 sack came where he beat the snap, ran around the guy. Jones had something like 20 sacks (also lead the country) his last (senior?) year at GA. What has he done in the NFL?

I see Reddick as being a similar style of player. The key will be how fast can he read and react to plays and can he attack the line downhill. Jones still can't do that and is on his way out of pro football. If Reddick can't do that, he doesn't have a place in the NFL, at least not as a defender. What you are saying is that he probably did a bette job at the senior bowl of reading reacting and attacking. if he did, great, he is not the player I saw. But I didn't see the senior bowl, and I don't have a copy of the game, so unless I can isolate him for a whole game, I don't like watching just the highlights. It doesn't tell you enough about the "other" plays, and it is the "other" plays that tell the story.

Jeremiah and Mayock, and all the draftnik guys are trying to sell a product. See the guys no one has ever heard of and discover them at the senior bowl. SAme with the combine. But in truth, I think the only thing that really matters is how they play during the season. At the senior bowl, watching a smaller school guy like Reddick, since he went to TEmple is somewhat important, since it tells you how coachable guys are. But beyond that, the draft boards should be made and only get refined by the interviews and a few misc questions get answered. And from what I get the sense of listening to John Spanos and TT, and McCoy, that is how I think it has worked. At least last year, it seemed to work well.

As far as the ideal way to watch players, I would prefer to be able to watch a player progress through his final season. See how he improves. Then mix ina couple of games from the previous season. Sadly, too few of these cutups get done, so you can't go off of that very often. I did Dion Jordan like that a couple of years ago, I thought it was interesting how his technique was average when he had a ton of practice time, then fell apart when they played consequative games. Then got better again after their bye.

Also, interesting you say dominated the best. He dominated the other players at the senior bowl. A lot of the "best" didn't even attend. In the case of a lot of guys like Reddick, it would be nice to see him side by side vs Garrett or Thomas.

[Rugger05]

Looks like Melvin wants to get paid. Not surprising and who knows if it's true


"Colts could be a possible landing spot for LB Melvin Ingram. Ingram is reportedly asking for Olivier Vernon money (5 yers, $85M)"

[Fleet]

We will have to agree to disagree. But im willing to wait and see how he does in the pros. And i think you might look back and say you might have been wrong. I think he will be a very good player. Even if thats inside in a 34.

[Boltjolt]

Looks like Melvin wants to get paid. Not surprising and who knows if it's true


"Colts could be a possible landing spot for LB Melvin Ingram. Ingram is reportedly asking for Olivier Vernon money (5 yers, $85M)"

IMO Melvin ain't worth that.

[Fleet]

IMO Melvin ain't worth that.

Cheaper to go after Berry and draft DE/OLB.

[Fleet]

PFF"s Top 10

There should be plenty of teams looking to upgrade along their offensive lines this offseason, and this year’s crop of free-agent linemen is one of the best in recent years. It’s a particularly interior-heavy group, but there are still good options at either tackle position, as well.

Here’s the list of the top offensive linemen set to hit free agency:

1. Kevin Zeitler, G, Cincinnati Bengals
Zeitler may be just below the “elite” tier of guards, but not by much. He has earned a top-10 overall grade among guards in each of the last three seasons, and is pretty balanced in having success as both a run and pass blocker. Zeitler has allowed just one sack over the past two seasons, and recorded the fifth-highest pass-blocking efficiency among guards in 2016. At age 27, he likely has a whole contract’s worth of good years ahead of him, which gives him the edge over the next two players.

2. T.J. Lang, G, Green Bay Packers

Lang dealt with some injuries this past season that probably contributed to a slight dip in his play, but he still finished as our eighth-ranked guard in 2016 after earning a top-five spot the previous two years. Lang is consistently one of the best pass blockers in the league, and in this past season, did not allow a single sack or hit despite Aaron Rodgers holding onto the ball longer than all but one other NFL quarterback. While Lang is a noticeably better pass protector than run blocker, he’s still well above average in the ground game. He’s two years older than Zeitler, but could still be a better fit for a team that is pass-heavy and looking to upgrade its pass protection.

3. Andrew Whitworth, T, Cincinnati Bengals
At age 35, Whitworth may not be a long-term solution at this point. However, at worst, he can be an exceptional short-term answer for teams needing help at the tackle position. Whitworth has graded among the top-10 tackles for eight consecutive seasons, and his best play has actually come in recent years, as he’s ranked among the top-five tackles for the last four seasons. He remains one of the better pass-protecting left tackles, having allowed just 14 total QB pressures last season. Even though it may only be for a limited time, Whitworth could be a difference-maker for a playoff contender.

4. Larry Warford, G, Detroit Lions
Warford put together one of the best rookie performances for an offensive lineman in 2013, enough to earn PFF’s Rookie of the Year award. Unfortunately for the Lions, he hasn’t been able to replicate that season since then. However, Warford remains a solid guard who is above-average as both a run and pass blocker. There’s also still a chance that a change of scenery and coaching could help him get back to his rookie level.

5. Ronald Leary, G, Dallas Cowboys
Leary has been fortunate to play between two of the best players at tackle and center. That said, he’s actually shown to be a pretty good one-on-one blocker when given the opportunity. Leary managed to not allow a single sack on nearly 500 snaps in pass protection last season, and didn’t allow a hit until Week 14. As impressive as that is, he’s actually been a better run blocker than pass blocker. He has ranked among the top-15 guards in run-blocking grading in his last two full seasons as a starter. Leary would be a good fit for a team that runs a zone-blocking scheme and is looking to upgrade its run blocking.

6. J.C. Tretter, C, Green Bay Packers
Tretter is somewhat of a wildcard, given that he’s barely played a full season’s worth of snaps in his four-year career. However, when he has been on the field, he’s performed pretty well. After starting just a handful of games at the end of the 2015 season, Tretter was able to unseat Corey Linsley in the offseason to take over as the starting center for the Packers. Through eight weeks, it looked like Green Bay had made the correct choice, as Tretter was the fifth-ranked center at the time, but a knee injury abruptly ended his season. Whoever is willing to give Tretter a chance likely will end up with a solid starter. He may also provide some positional flexibility, since the Packers’ original plan was to used him at guard.

7. Ricky Wagner, T, Baltimore Ravens

Wagner has been a starter for the Ravens for three seasons now, and his play has been all over the place during that time. His best season came in 2014 when he just missed the top-10 in overall grade, but did rank eighth as a pass blocker, along with an above-average run-blocking grade. Wagner is coming off a similar performance in 2016, with just slight steps back in both aspects of blocking. Sandwiched between those two seasons was a disastrous year in which Wagner allowed a career-high 52 total QB pressures, 20 more than his next-highest season. He also struggled as a run blocker on a fairly regular basis. Wagner very well may be the player we saw in 2014 and 2016, but teams will also need to be wary of what exactly happened in 2015 that caused such a stark drop in performance.

8. Stefan Wisniewski, C/G, Philadelphia Eagles
Wisniewski has bounced around among teams the last few seasons and was relegated to a backup role last year before stepping in as a starter for a few weeks. He is a few years removed from his best performances, though he’s never really had a below-average season as a starter. Oddly, teams have been willing to move on after just one season anyways. He’s probably still best-suited as a center, but he did show last year that he’s a capable guard, and that positional flexibility should only be an added value for a team.

9. Kelvin Beachum, T, Jacksonville Jaguars
The Jaguars decided to move on from Beachum after one season. He had easily the worst season of his career, but he should still be worth a look. Beachum’s poor performance came in his first year returning from an ACL injury sustained early in the 2015 season, as well as his first in a different offensive system. Prior to the injury, he had a breakout year in 2014 when he was the fifth-ranked tackle in the NFL. He had a rocky start to the 2015 season, as he allowed four total QB pressures in the season opener against the Patriots, but he settled down and allowed just two over his next four-plus games before the season-ending injury. At age 27, he is still young and worth taking a chance on with limited guaranteed money in hopes that he can get closer to his 2014 level.

10. John Sullivan, C, Washington Redskins
Sullivan played just 98 snaps last year after missing the entire 2015 season with a back injury. At age 31, Sullivan is now more than three seasons removed from the top of his game. He finished among the top-three graded centers from 2011–2013. In his last full season in 2014, Sullivan still earned above-average grades as both a pass protector and run blocker to finish as the seventh-ranked center. He may not be an elite center anymore, but he’s definitely worth a look from a team trying to upgrade at the position.