Trade Weddle???#WTF!!!

[Fleet]

Personally feel the best way to build a successful team is through the draft. And when you hit on a player that you drafted you keep him. For a few different reasons. Leadership...continuity...community...and ability. You dont just trade a playmaker...you lose the leadership.

[MakoShark]

I don't know if SB teams all have great play at S. Seems like they should, but I bet there are some who don't. I just like the idea of:
A). Finding elite players at any position are rare, even the best teams only have a couple, so why force yourself to go find another?
B). Build up the middle. A guy in the middle is a factor on plays that are at him, or in pursuit to either side. But players on the edge are not really a factor if they have to pursuit all the way across the field.
C). Even though potentially you have to the chance to find elite players in the draft, it is still a rarity for even top 5 picks to become elite players. Most of them are good or even great players, but not many players in the league ever get to the level Weddle is at. And the fact that there are just not many great S coming out of college suggests to me the big hole up the middle of the secondary could get really bad before it gets better, if we were to trade Weddle.

Us in 94? Someone shot the Sheriff in that game!

[thelightningwill]

Us in 94? Someone shot the Sheriff in that game!

Our safeties were our biggest weakness. But other than kick returns, nothing worked that night.
Dennis Gibson for president.

[Mister Hoarse]

Personally feel the best way to build a successful team is through the draft. And when you hit on a player that you drafted you keep him. For a few different reasons. Leadership...continuity...community...and ability. You dont just trade a playmaker...you lose the leadership.

Someone might want to forward this post to Donald Sterling.

[Den60]

I still think you are massively undervaluing him, in terms of the compensation.

It is a key position on any D. Not many FS can play cover 1 and cover the whole field like Weddle does. He can play in the box, deep cover 2, cover 3, man, zone,.... He has even developed into a pretty big hitter, which was part of why some teams didn't think he was a good prospect. The knock on him was that he was a solid tackler, but didn't lay out receivers like coaches like to see, but Weddle has gotten a couple of fines for big hits on defenseless receivers.

I think the main reason that so many teams don't value S more highly is that most of them end up being somewhat of a disappointment. There just are not that many top S around. You have to spend a top pick, or a lot of salary cap space on someone to fill the hole, then you don't get much production for it, ....unless you have Weddle. Teams throw away from him and often don't attack the middle of our D, and he still makes a fair number of plays. In general, I agree, no one is going to trade for a S giving away that much. Weddle is the exception, which is why I think the trade value discussion starts at several #1 picks.

Personally I think he is better in the box than downfield. I've always felt him more quick than fast, and I have had issues with him being overly aggressive on plays - leaving CBs on an island in the process. If I thought we could get two first rounders for him then I would possibly consider trading him. But there is no way in hell he would command that much.

[QSmokey]

If I thought we could get two first rounders for him then I would possibly consider trading him. But there is no way in hell he would command that much.

So what? How many players today would? You're cyber-tone seems to be putting a negative slant on the fact that our 2nd-team All-Pro safety wouldn't command 2 1st-round picks. I don't think he'd command 2 1st-rounders, either (for what that's worth). You'd be hard-pressed - we all would - to produce a non-QB list that WOULD command 2 1st-round draft choices. Even the QB list would be a short one.

Let's try:

1. Adrian Peterson
2. JJ Watt
3. Andrew Luck
4. Colin Kapernick
5. Calvin Johnson
6. RGIII (pre-injury)
7. Ndamukong Suh

Even in my short, not-terribly-well-researched list, there's a ton of potential for debate/disagreement. I couldn't even fashion a list of 10 in the entire NFL.

[thelightningwill]

So what? How many players today would? You're cyber-tone seems to be putting a negative slant on the fact that our 2nd-team All-Pro safety wouldn't command 2 1st-round picks. I don't think he'd command 2 1st-rounders, either (for what that's worth). You'd be hard-pressed - we all would - to produce a non-QB list that WOULD command 2 1st-round draft choices. Even the QB list would be a short one.

Let's try:

1. Adrian Peterson
2. JJ Watt
3. Andrew Luck
4. Colin Kapernick
5. Calvin Johnson
6. RGIII (pre-injury)
7. Ndamukong Suh

Even in my short, not-terribly-well-researched list, there's a ton of potential for debate/disagreement. I couldn't even fashion a list of 10 in the entire NFL.

Didn't the Cardinals and Raiders recently trade 2 #1s for scrubby quarterbacks?

[Steve]

To me, there are just no other S in the league who do a better job in the middle of the field. Yes, even Weddle will make more plays up close to the line, but that is the nature of the position. A S up close to the ball is AROUND more plays, so he can make more. A deep S is further away from the ball, so he has fewer chances. But when you don't have that deep S help, the number of big plays up the middle increases, and the vast majority of the big plays our D gives up are outside the hash marks. When I watch Weddle, I agree, he can over run some plays, but that goes with the territory. QB use their eyes to deceive the FS, and the only thing the FS can do is read the eyes. If you don't play the read, he just completes that pass and you gave up a play anyway. What we have to do is improve the pass rush so that QB are not able to go through their progression and don't have time to give the false reads. But until that happens, I don't see how anyone else will do much, if any better, and most will be far, far worse, and some of them are decent players. Weddle is just that good.

Ed Reed in his prime is a better player then Weddle is now, but not by much, and he had a much better supporting cast then Weddle has. Maybe Eric Berry and Earl Thomas will be better, but they aren't there yet, and both have a long way to go, and both have a lot more help. Seems like the last couple of years there are 1 or 2 decent prospects, but it is really, really hard to find guys who can play at that level, in the middle. There are more guys like Troy P, who are active and all over the field, but you put him deep middle of the field, they often disappear, which Denver did really well against him last year when Clark was out.

Weddle is playing at a level and with skills you just don't see out of guys. He is beyond what is reasonable to expect from a guy, so to think we can trade for draft picks and then simply replace him, just is unrealistic. You may find a successor, but you never really replace him.

I wouldn't trade Weddle at all, but if I had to put a price, maybe 3 1st's. I think his play is that rare, given his abilities, he just cannot be replaced. I also don't like the message it sends to the players on the team either. It tells every player you are a slab of meat, and even if you are the best FS in football, you are expendable, and not important to us. I also screams we aren't trying to win now, and you don't play your hardest for a team that isn't trying to win now. Yes, that is a somewhat dillusional thinking that is going on, but players and coaches do that as a defense mechanism. I think the team has to approach it that way. And if you don't prepared to be that suprise team that comes out of no where (like the Colts last year), then you won't ever do it. You will doom yourself to always underachieving, even as your talent level improves.

I think there are players you want to have around, to point to and say they are the guys who are the franchise, who you tell the young guys to copy. Weddle's preparation, his work ethic, his focus, .... the whole package. He is the guy I want Mathews following around like a puppy, soaking up everything. Teo and Allen too. Those guys all have great physical talent, but there are 32 1st round picks every year, and there are not 32 great players when you look back. Some guy not only help because they are players, but because of leadership and example, and Weddle is as valuable in that as he is in his play.

As far as the player list goes, I wouldn't put Kapernick or RG3 on there yet. Neither is that great a QB yet. Both do a ton of damage with their legs, but with every team getting the graduate seminar on defending the college zone read (and they have all been doing it), I think the guys who can't throw so well are going to struggle some. If you insist on leaving them in there, then I think Wilson needs to be there. He is not as productive during the season, but was a much better passer by the end of the season. The Seahawks through a lot more pocket passing at him, and he really responded. He still has a long way to go, but so do Luck, RG3, Kapernick.......

[Den60]

So what? How many players today would? You're cyber-tone seems to be putting a negative slant on the fact that our 2nd-team All-Pro safety wouldn't command 2 1st-round picks. I don't think he'd command 2 1st-rounders, either (for what that's worth). You'd be hard-pressed - we all would - to produce a non-QB list that WOULD command 2 1st-round draft choices. Even the QB list would be a short one.

Let's try:

1. Adrian Peterson
2. JJ Watt
3. Andrew Luck
4. Colin Kapernick
5. Calvin Johnson
6. RGIII (pre-injury)
7. Ndamukong Suh

Even in my short, not-terribly-well-researched list, there's a ton of potential for debate/disagreement. I couldn't even fashion a list of 10 in the entire NFL.

Gee, this thread is named "Trade Weddle" so I am merely putting my $0.02 worth in. Someone (I don't want to name names so I don't find myself pissing off the board gods again) mentioned we could get two firsts for him and I was called an "idiot" for saying I thought it was more like a third. It isn't like I have proposed trading him but the reactionary posters on here are out in force, and all I want is my "due process." So, I said I thought a second round pick was more realistic and said possibly a 1st if a team felt they were just a safety away from a ring (which would make it a late first by the way). But I also said it doesn't make sense to trade him if you are just going to use the pick to try to replace him to me. You have the chance of perhaps getting younger at the position doing that but you don't make the team better overall. Now, should Stuckey start showing something maybe you entertain the idea of trading him if you can get that first round pick for him. You would clear some cap room, get a bit younger, and pick up a pick to use on another position.

[Beerman]

http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/70170/the-all-22-all-star-team-eric-weddle-the-secret-superstar

The All-22 All-Star Team: Eric Weddle, the Secret Superstar

Serious fluf***e of Weddle in this article. Glad to see he's getting some pub. Fantastic article highlighting how he's the top S in the league.

[Zot]

would you still feel that way after this year if we go 4-12 and suck badly on both defense and offense this year- making it clear we need a LOT of high picks to restock the roster and we could get a high 1st + more for Weddle?

I understand your point...and I'd be hard pressed to say yes. Fortunately, I see us being somewhat competitive this year and building up.

[Steve]

Gee, this thread is named "Trade Weddle" so I am merely putting my $0.02 worth in. Someone (I don't want to name names so I don't find myself pissing off the board gods again) mentioned we could get two firsts for him and I was called an "idiot" for saying I thought it was more like a third. It isn't like I have proposed trading him but the reactionary posters on here are out in force, and all I want is my "due process." So, I said I thought a second round pick was more realistic and said possibly a 1st if a team felt they were just a safety away from a ring (which would make it a late first by the way). But I also said it doesn't make sense to trade him if you are just going to use the pick to try to replace him to me. You have the chance of perhaps getting younger at the position doing that but you don't make the team better overall. Now, should Stuckey start showing something maybe you entertain the idea of trading him if you can get that first round pick for him. You would clear some cap room, get a bit younger, and pick up a pick to use on another position.

Does this follow from the idea that we have only had 1 decent S most of the last few years, so we only need 1 S now? We just get by with the same old guys who couldn't cut it and not worry about both spots?

I don't see how Stuckey playing well has anything to do with Weddle, at least not until we have a full secondary, plus some depth. Most NFL DC prefer to have at least 3 starting CB and 3 starting caliber S. Then you can play a nickle with either 3 S on the field or 3 CB, and/or dime package.