San Diego drafts Johny Manzel...

[Steve]

I didn't think guys drafted that low in the baseball draft were all signed to a farm team? I thought some of it was just to hold the guys rights for a year, then you could redraft them again (which happens fairly often, especially among college guys).

[TABF]

I didn't think guys drafted that low in the baseball draft were all signed to a farm team? I thought some of it was just to hold the guys rights for a year, then you could redraft them again (which happens fairly often, especially among college guys).

There is only one draft nowadays... Back in the day there were three draft to accommodate all types of players... The other two were eliminated with the last being eliminated in 86. Now we have one draft.

Kids can be drafted out of HS,*
if at a 4 year college they can be drafted after their Jr. and Sr. years or anytime if they are 21. *
If at a JUCO, they can be drafted at any time.*
If they transfer from a JUCO to a 4 year from a JUCO they are eligible after the Jr. and Sr. athletic year (essentially having 4 years of draft eligibility)*

Steve, it all comes down to options. Lots of guys are not great students, but are fantastic baseball players. If a kid coming out of HS is a prospect and said player doesn't have any noteworthy options after HS, teams will draft him late, as they have the bargaining tools. If that same kid had a full ride to say UCI or USC, that player (if teams are interested) would probably get drafted a bit higher wherein that slot money is enough to get that player out of his commitment to his NLI (national letter of intent). College Seniors have the least amount of options and typically go late in the draft.

After the HS senior year and after the junior year in college are typically the best time to get drafted. This is where most kids have the bargaining power. If a college junior or HS senior forgoes and does not sign during the designated signing period (Until July 8 ish) said player remains an amateur and is eligible to be drafted by any team during the next years draft as long as they are draft eligible*. If a player is drafted and that player does not have any college eligibility remaining, I believe the team that drafted him retains his rights up to two weeks prior to the next years draft.

its a tough process, most players do not have agents (so they can remain amateurs), they are allowed to have advisors, but that contact is limited as well.

Typically a scout (pre draft) will ask a kid, their bottom number or what will it take to get you out of your commitment (remaining college years)... If the team drafting the player see's draft slot value they will take the kid near that number. Teams will also take a flyer on a kid. They know the kid will only sign for 400k, but they will draft him very late, just in case something happens. It is very tempting to the kid that dreams of player professional baseball.

This isn't even taking into consideration the BS games that take place within the draft... Like favors (Mike Piazza was actually a favor to Lasorda), and other items that mess with young players heads.

[Steve]

I just remember in Moneyball (book, not movie), Chad Bradford got drafted a couple times by the White Sox. He finally got an invitation to join their minor league single A team, and was then able to work his way up. But something about it was they didn't even make a contract offer because he was such a low level pick.

So in terms of Manziel, is the 28th round a low enough level and is there any advantage to drafting guys who don't get contract offers? IS that low enough level that they don't necessarily mind spending pick, because he isn't normally going to get offered a pick?

The other issue is where would Manziel have been drafted when he was coming out of HS (I am assuming he played in HS)? Baseball teams draft HS players all the time, so it is not like they have the same rigours as NFL picks, in terms of getting guys on the roster.

[TABF]

I just remember in Moneyball (book, not movie), Chad Bradford got drafted a couple times by the White Sox. He finally got an invitation to join their minor league single A team, and was then able to work his way up. But something about it was they didn't even make a contract offer because he was such a low level pick.

So in terms of Manziel, is the 28th round a low enough level and is there any advantage to drafting guys who don't get contract offers? IS that low enough level that they don't necessarily mind spending pick, because he isn't normally going to get offered a pick?

The other issue is where would Manziel have been drafted when he was coming out of HS (I am assuming he played in HS)? Baseball teams draft HS players all the time, so it is not like they have the same rigours as NFL picks, in terms of getting guys on the roster.

Yea... It was way different back then. Now its one simple draft, they own your rights for a few months if you have college elgibility and if not, they have you for roughly 50 weeks. Manziel played baseball through his Jr. year in HS. I have no idea how good he was, his teams maxpreps.com page doesn't show his HS stats for that year. He did however play at a competitive HS... But no telling where/if he would have been drafted.

The 28th round type players are somewhat fliers...Meaning, if you have a college/HS guy at a collegiate program that is spendy (USC, Pepperdine, USD, Ivy League, Stanford), and a degree from said college is valuable... Teams may take a flyer on a guy in the 28th willing to tempt him, but knowing that he will probably stay with his school as the slotted money is weak. The 28th on up is also a place where area scouts go to battle w/their GM's about guys they have seen locally, that maybe some of the team level guys have not seen. This is where the scout puts his ass on the line for a kid he believes it. This is where I have a rub w/the Manziel pick. There was some area scout for the padres begging to get his guy drafted at that spot (everyone wants to find the late round gem), and the Padres decided to go the gimmick route. Pissed me off big time. (still pissed off).

[Steve]

The only thing I wondered, and it is a pure guess, (because I don't follow baseball seriously and really don't follow Manziel), but ......

did the Padres pick him in hopes that he has some sort of a contract squabble with Cleveland and then get him to play baseball again?

There is probably no basis for that, although I do think Manziel is probably going to be one of the last 1st round picks to sign. These days, that means almost nothing, since slotting has virtually eliminated long holdouts.

[TABF]

The only thing I wondered, and it is a pure guess, (because I don't follow baseball seriously and really don't follow Manziel), but ......

did the Padres pick him in hopes that he has some sort of a contract squabble with Cleveland and then get him to play baseball again?

There is probably no basis for that, although I do think Manziel is probably going to be one of the last 1st round picks to sign. These days, that means almost nothing, since slotting has virtually eliminated long holdouts.

The Padres picked him up as an admitted gimmick (Twitter quote of Byrnes)... Mike Dee also joked about it. They are back peddling a bit on this as the fan base isn't reacting the way they hoped. When you team batting average is in the 220, the jokes and gimmicks need to be done with.

[Boltjolt]

The Padres picked him up as an admitted gimmick (Twitter quote of Byrnes)... Mike Dee also joked about it. They are back peddling a bit on this as the fan base isn't reacting the way they hoped. When you team batting average is in the 220, the jokes and gimmicks need to be done with.

Two dumbfucks running the show. The team cant hit for shit. I bet Tony Gwynn right now would be the best hitter on that team with all his issues and weight gain. One game their pitcher drove in all three runs. Gyorco or whatever his name is sucks ass at the plate. They need to send him down so he can regain his stroke since they signed him to a long term deal. He is hitting like .170, Headley is hovering at or below .200...this team is embarassing.

[thelightningwill]

Two dumbfucks running the show. The team cant hit for shit. I bet Tony Gwynn right now would be the best hitter on that team with all his issues and weight gain. One game their pitcher drove in all three runs. Gyorco or whatever his name is sucks ass at the plate. They need to send him down so he can regain his stroke since they signed him to a long term deal. He is hitting like .170, Headley is hovering at or below .200...this team is embarassing.

Gwynn was at his best as a hitter at the end of his career. Just couldn't stay healthy and was losing his ability to run. I'm sure the dude could still hit - just might not make it to first base.

[TABF]

We quite frankly are not very good and our 28th round draft choice isn't making us any better. However, if we would have drafted a deserving baseball player, you never really know what he would have developed into.

[Beerman]

We quite frankly are not very good and our 28th round draft choice isn't making us any better. However, if we would have drafted a deserving baseball player, you never really know what he would have developed into.

I'm sorry but that's such a tired argument I've been fighting with other padres fans about. A 28th round pick is garbage. In fact most after round 10 are garbage. He's just another shitty UDFA nfl wise that will get thrown out with the garbage at the end of camp. Manziel was a pr stunt that will get thrown away soon just like the rest of the 28th round picks in baseball. I just can't bring myself to care about it. It was funny, that's it.

I'd rather bitch about the on field product that's trash and that they have actual control over.

[TABF]

I'm sorry but that's such a tired argument I've been fighting with other padres fans about. A 28th round pick is garbage. In fact most after round 10 are garbage. He's just another shitty UDFA nfl wise that will get thrown out with the garbage at the end of camp. Manziel was a pr stunt that will get thrown away soon just like the rest of the 28th round picks in baseball. I just can't bring myself to care about it. It was funny, that's it.

I'd rather bitch about the on field product that's trash and that they have actual control over.

We will never ever know will we Beerman...? Regardless, you are ill advised in player development if that is a real argument regarding the MLB Draft and draft position.

I will give you one case in point covering the last two years: I have many other examples mind you!

Aaron Brown (Pepperdine) was drafted with the 891st pick in the 30th round of the 2013 Draft. A mere 365 (ish) days later, he is drafted with the 81st pick in the 3rd round of the 2014 draft.

Lets just use your above post. In your assessment, Aaron Brown last season was a 'garbage' 30th round baseball player ...and a mere 365 days later he is worthy of 3rd round money/talent? So, if he can develop and improve at the collegiate level to a point of a 27 round increase, isn't it possible that our guy in the 28th (had we taken a real baseball player) could have developed into a legit player under the tutelage of the professional coaches?

Point being, players get better and develop in the game of baseball at different rates than other sports. Aaron Brown will be in the bigs and he will be an impact player. Not bad for a guy that was a junk/GARBAGE pick in your assessment.

If you need more examples, just let me know...

[Beerman]

Someone came up with the math, it was about 1% of 28th rounders that did a damn thing. I'm ok with my initial assessment. I'll complain about things that are much more in control of the front office, like say for example the garbage product on the field or first round picks.