Five reasons im optimistic about the Chargers.

[QSmokey]

Jets and Chargers should both be pitiful to watch this year.

Downright Clowney.

[oneinchpunch]

What was he, then...cut? I guess Den would have just kept him.

I think they should've. Good blocking TE.

[Millionaire Wussy]

Hey guys, at least we have plenty of intriguing WR's on the roster!:woot:

[sandiego17]

Hey guys, at least we have plenty of intriguing WR's on the roster!:woot:

All injury prone, but there is a VJ.

[Den60]

You said bottom third. 21st is just as likely as 32nd, if you stick to that definition. Or, you can just give us a number. 31st? 30th? Bottom third - which I agree with, by the way - is a range.

I know what you said - we ALL know what you've said - and this is all I've been able to glean from your posts (call me Den60 challenged):

1) The only information I've been able to take away from all your posts on the draft is that you would have drafted an OLB (who?) with our choice @11 and that you would probably have taken somebody like Warford in the 3rd-4th round. That's it. I don't recall seeing your name connected with any particular draft choice(s), other than "somebody like Warford". On the other hand, we know a TON about who you would NOT have drafted (i.e., just about any player TT did draft. ).

2) Free agency. It seems you would have signed Cox and Woodshed. You would also have re-signed Vasquez, Barnes, Martin for sure, and Franklin (I think). Maybe McMichael. Based on the venom toward the Freeney signing, I'm guessing you would have liked to re-sign Phillips after Ingram went down, but...he had already been signed by the Broncos, so scratch that one. Oh, and you would have signed Bulter at almost any cost, and immediately. Again, we know a lot about what you would NOT have done: Brown (redundant); Starks, Ohmberger Reinhart (all suck); Freeney (sucks, old, overpriced); the TE from Dallas (sucks).

So, as I see it - and this is an invitation to correct all my inaccuracies - a Den60 off-season would have looked something like this:

Free Agents
Cox
Woodshed
Vasquez
Barnes
Martin
Franklin
McMichael
Somebody to replace Ingram (but NOT Phillips, since he was already gone)
More???

Draft
1) Jarvis Jones (since he was the only OLB of any worth left on the board @11)
2) Another defensive player (Who? What position?)
3) "Somebody like Warford" (But NOT Warford; because he was already gone)
4) ???
5) ???
6) ???
7) ???

Please fill in the blanks, if you care to play along. Or not, if you don't. It would give the rest of us something to evaluate...and YOU something to defend. Right now, you've stayed, very carefully, just out of reach (perhaps on purpose), giving us only glimpses of what you might have done. There has been precious little in the way of specifics (i.e. player NAMES) to the Den60 Plan, particularly in regards to the Draft.

I see our o-line as marginally better than last year's. In fact I have said that repeatedly here and on the previous board. I also said I thought that in pass protection it could be worse with Fluker at RT and with the loss of McMichael (who was a good blocker).

By the way, I always advocated taking two o-linemen in the first 3 rounds.

Early in the draft process I liked Jarvis Jones. I shied away from him because of his back issues when someone mentioned the word "stenosis." However, I am not privy to his medical records nor do I have doctors I can rely on to review those records. What I can say is that Pittsburgh was comfortable taking him just 6 picks later and Pittsburgh has a pretty good history of drafting players. Oh, and Pittsburgh has a handful more rings than we do. I would have taken Warford in the second (many draft analysts had him rated to go where were positioned). I know, people on here will say that is a reach because he went later than that and I would counter that they are probably the same people who think we drafted three "first" rounders this draft. I would also say that there are probably many fans in Detroit bragging that they got a second round talent in the 3rd round. I would have preferred "reaching" for a guard at 45 over doing the same at #11.

In the third it would have been hard to pass up Allen so I don't fault TT for taking him (and have said so). Since we would have still had 4th round pick we would have had a lot of options. We could trade up a few picks (it would have taken very few in fact) and taken Schwenke or Bakhtari or stayed put to take Barret Jones or Watford to help fill our o-line needs. We also could have stayed put and drafted Nassib or Wilson if we wanted to take a QB to groom for life beyond Rivers.

As for free agents I don't like losing young talent. We have a finite number of picks that doesn't even take care of the holes we have, much less those one would reasonably expect to see through attrition. Personally, I would have much preferred paying Vasquez than Freeney and would have cut Clary over letting Vasquez walk as well. Just doing the latter would have taken care of a large potion of Vasquez' cap hit in Denver this year (leaving only about $600K to account for). I have said that I don't think we have done one thing for the future of our o-line and we have simply traded Vasquez for Fluker. Next year I envision needing 4 new starters along the o-line.

I didn't hate the signing of Starks, I just don't think he is any good. I question signing him after bringing in Dunlap (the latter was signed to two years whereas Starks got just one). If Fluker plays RT where does Dunlap fit in? If we keep Clary why do we need a backup RT since Clary could simply move outside?

I also predicted McMichael would be let go. I don't believe Phillips can block as well as McMichael. I did advocate drafting a blocking TE in the 5th round. You can go back to the old board and look that up if you want. But, I figured we were going to have issues at OT this year regardless of who was drafted so I thought it would behoove the team to get someone who could help the OTs out.

I like Martin better than the guy we got to replace him. I do believe you need depth along the D-line and I think someone like Reyes will lose effectiveness if overused. Heaven forbid if we lose either him or Luiget for any length of time by the way.

I had some tepid interest in re-signing Franklin though not bringing back guys like Barnes or Martin diminishes the defense enough on its own to make me believe that even with Ingram on the roster we would be too thin to be counted on.

You forgot Jammer. I have said that I would have favored keeping and moving him to SS over doing that with Gilchrist. First, I think Jammer would be better at the position in the first place and second, I think we are way too thin at CB even without considering our two projected starters have had injury issues.

I would have kept Barnes who will be used in NY like he was used here. He is not a 3 down LBer in NY or on any other team. He is a pass rush specialist. He also would have been a lot cheaper than Freeney had we decided to pay him more than the Jets offered. I have said, players go where the money is a great majority of the time. This is especially true of those players who have never been considered stars. Do you think Woodhead chose us over the Pats for any other reason than money? I sure as shit don't.

Is that enough to start with? This isn't all new by the way. I have made all these points before. Frankly I find it surprising that you even accuse me of not being detailed in my reasoning on here. I doubt you could find many on here who go to the extent of defending their positions in the detail that I do.

[oneinchpunch]

Tommy T should be fired for taking a WR before the 4th round.

[sandiego17]

Definitely, and not finding two starting OL in the draft that had 7 taken in the first round. Silly kid. If he trades Jim Lachey...

[Den60]

Tommy T should be fired for taking a WR before the 4th round.

Yep, said that prior to the draft. I don't think he was targeting a WR though so I give him a pass for that selection. What I didn't like more was the selection of Te'o, especially trading our 4th to get him. Go and look around where we would have picked in the 4th and see if there aren't some interesting choices there.

I don't think Allen is going to be a superstar (not enough speed nor dominant size for that) but I think with him and VB we could have a solid WR tandem for the future. I do hope that his failure to test clean was an aberration and not indicative of future issues with him. He did go to Berkeley by the way.

[Mister Hoarse]

My daughter went to Berkeley.

#whatthefuckdoesthatmean

[oneinchpunch]

My daughter went to Berkeley.

#whatthefuckdoesthatmean

Contact highs

[Mister Hoarse]

No wonder they charge so much

[QSmokey]

By the way, I always advocated taking two o-linemen in the first 3 rounds.

Is that enough to start with? This isn't all new by the way. I have made all these points before. Frankly I find it surprising that you even accuse me of not being detailed in my reasoning on here. I doubt you could find many on here who go to the extent of defending their positions in the detail that I do.

Phew! More than enough to start with.

#1...It was never my impression, from your posts, that you "advocated" taking 2 offensive linemen with our first 3 picks. More like you "resolved" yourself to that possibility...much to your own disappointment/chagrin. I think you made it fairly obvious that you wanted to go defense, but had grudgingly accepted the 'fact' that TT was going to go heavy on the OL at the top of the draft. That's the impression you gave me, anyway.

So, let's see if I can boil down the verbiage into a "GM Den60 Off-Season". I was really looking just for names, but your explanation was good reading nonetheless.

DRAFT
1) Jarvis Jones, OLB
2) Warford, OG
3) Keenan Allen, WR
4) Barrett Jones, OT
(So much for going heavy on defense at the top of the draft, eh? )
5) Blocking TE
6) I guess it doesn't because it's all a crap
7) shoot at this point anyway. Fair?

FREE AGENCY
- Vasquez (while cutting Clary)
- Dunlap or Starks
- Martin
- Barnes
- Jammer
- Franklin (maybe)
- Woodhead (but not Brown, because he is redundant)
- Cox (you didn't specifically mention him, but you have been supportive of his signing)
- Re-upping Butler NOW (you've been pretty emphatic about that)

When I have the time, I will try to do a side-by-side comparison of starting lineups/depth for TT's off-season vs. GM Den60's. If will be interesting to see how this shakes out. Thanks for the input.