Los Angeles or Las Vegas

[Boltnut]

My take (as a native San Diegan):

SD Sports History 101: Historically, our teams have always been out-spent by bigger US cities/markets. The Yankees tore Dave Winfield away from the Padres. Ozzie left soon afterwards for the Cardinals. Kevin Brown got poached by the Dodgers. Fred Dean and Gary Big Hands Johnson fled to SF and brought the 49ers Super Bowls. The only super star I remember staying for the love of the team/city was Tony Gwynn. The Clippers outright picked up and left. Small market... small think owners. Every time the team got close to bringing a championship... poof... players leave (or get traded). Always playing 2nd fiddle... many times, being mocked and made fun of. The Dodgers fans in the 70's were brutal. Invade the Murph, hurl insults, beat us, and leave. The LA Raiders fans would get violent. Imagine going to the friendly confines... and finding it un-friendly. Always being told "You suck!" for decades. Competing on an un-level playing field... always. Call it an inferiority complex... call it frustration. Often perpetuated by our neighbors to the north... LA. They were our rivals... and didn't even know it. We were just lovable losers to them. We hated them... deep in our bones. Think Red Sox fans (pre WS win) and Yankee fans. Intolerable!

Then along comes revenue share and salary cap to the NFL. San Diego's one chance to compete on a level playing field. And all of the sudden there was hope. We even got real close in 1994. 2006... even though we choked in the playoffs... we still had the best team in the NFL. You have to understand, that just doesn't happen in San Diego. We're used to cheering our asses off for sub-par product. We were sure we'd see a championship eventually. Anyone happen to see what this city looked like in 1994 after the Pittsburgh AFC Championship game...? We wanted that enthusiasm every once in a while. Soon afterwards, the Chargers began grumbling about the stadium and threatening to move... always to LA. LA this, LA that... this was the threat... over and over again. Every time the city didn't give the NFL exactly what it wanted. Sticking it to the fans/taxpayers... every time.

And finally it happened... how do you expect us to feel? Would we be happier if the Chargers moved to Las Vegas...? No. It wouldn't make us any happier. It's a sick feeling in our stomachs either way. But c'mon... LA? Now people are just being dicks...

[Boltnut]

BTW... Hodad's blows In-N-Out out of the water...

[RobH]

My take (as a native San Diegan):

SD Sports History 101: Historically, our teams have always been out-spent by bigger US cities/markets. The Yankees tore Dave Winfield away from the Padres. Ozzie left soon afterwards for the Cardinals. Kevin Brown got poached by the Dodgers. Fred Dean and Gary Big Hands Johnson fled to SF and brought the 49ers Super Bowls. The only super star I remember staying for the love of the team/city was Tony Gwynn. The Clippers outright picked up and left. Small market... small think owners. Every time the team got close to bringing a championship... poof... players leave (or get traded). Always playing 2nd fiddle... many times, being mocked and made fun of. The Dodgers fans in the 70's were brutal. Invade the Murph, hurl insults, beat us, and leave. The LA Raiders fans would get violent. Imagine going to the friendly confines... and finding it un-friendly. Always being told "You suck!" for decades. Competing on an un-level playing field... always. Call it an inferiority complex... call it frustration. Often perpetuated by our neighbors to the north... LA. They were our rivals... and didn't even know it. We were just lovable losers to them. We hated them... deep in our bones. Think Red Sox fans (pre WS win) and Yankee fans. Intolerable!

Then along comes revenue share and salary cap to the NFL. San Diego's one chance to compete on a level playing field. And all of the sudden there was hope. We even got real close in 1994. 2006... even though we choked in the playoffs... we still had the best team in the NFL. You have to understand, that just doesn't happen in San Diego. We're used to cheering our asses off for sub-par product. We were sure we'd see a championship eventually. Anyone happen to see what this city looked like in 1994 after the Pittsburgh AFC Championship game...? We wanted that enthusiasm every once in a while. Soon afterwards, the Chargers began grumbling about the stadium and threatening to move... always to LA. LA this, LA that... this was the threat... over and over again. Every time the city didn't give the NFL exactly what it wanted. Sticking it to the fans/taxpayers... every time.

And finally it happened... how do you expect us to feel? Would we be happier if the Chargers moved to Las Vegas...? No. It wouldn't make us any happier. It's a sick feeling in our stomachs either way. But c'mon... LA? Now people are just being dicks...

That pretty much says it all.

[Boltjolt]

BTW... Hodad's blows In-N-Out out of the water...

One place I never been to. Don't live down there , have heard it's good

[Bolt-O]

Ozzie Smith was traded for Gary Templeton, who at the time was a more rounded player. Dean and Johnson were also traded.

[Boltnut]

One place I never been to. Don't live down there , have heard it's good

You'll probably never get in. It was featured on some eatery show several years back. Now, there are lines that go around the corner... morning and night. Call in and pick up your order at the back door. Or wait in a line for an hour and a half... bump elbows with all the tourists...

[Boltnut]

Ozzie Smith was traded for Gary Templeton, who at the time was a more rounded player. Dean and Johnson were also traded.

Exactly! Ozzie demanded a trade or he was going to walk. Templeton wasn't half the player Ozzie was. Dean and Johnson also demanded trades because cheap-ass Gene Klein refused to pay them what they were worth. Add JJ to that list too. We've always been cursed with shitty owners. We're like a magnet for incompetent owners... Spanos included.

[Boltjolt]

Exactly! Ozzie demanded a trade or he was going to walk. Templeton wasn't half the player Ozzie was. Dean and Johnson also demanded trades because cheap-ass Gene Klein refused to pay them what they were worth. Add JJ to that list too. We've always been cursed with shitty owners. We're like a magnet for incompetent owners... Spanos included.

Templeton was the much better hitter at the time. Ozzie had a weak bat and was a .220-.230 hitter with us but a hell of a shortstop. Templeton was pretty good SS himself but had a bit of a attitude there which made him expendible.

That turf at Busch stadium made Ozzie and Templeton better hitters.

Templeton regularly hit over .300 or damn near .300 while in St Louis.

[Boltnut]

That pretty much says it all.

RobH, You and I understand what others can't even imagine. You just had to be there... over and over and over again.

[Boltjolt]

You'll probably never get in. It was featured on some eatery show several years back. Now, there are lines that go around the corner... morning and night. Call in and pick up your order at the back door. Or wait in a line for an hour and a half... bump elbows with all the tourists...

It was on triple D. I'm sure it's good but I'd never wait that long.

[Bolt-O]

I'll agree with your statement that Gwynn was the only true superstar that resisted the call for him to go elsewhere. In reality, pro athletes have limited control of where they play, and how long they play. Some like where they finally end up, or others just go where they can get paid. Many athletes like the San Diego area and have homes here, like Rodgers and Brees. No disagreement on the owners gracing the local teams, they generally were incompetent.

The Dodgers and Raiders I loathe as rivals to my favorite teams (Padres, not so much anymore), but its just only that. Some of their fans are real assholes, but most are just like us, cheering for laundry and wins. I'm just not into hating other locations, or dwelling in the past, where we have no control... just have to learn from that.

[Boltnut]

Templeton was the much better hitter at the time. Ozzie had a weak bat but a hell of a shortstop. Templeton was pretty good SS himself but had a bit of a attitude there which made him expendible.

That turf at Busch stadium made Ozzie and Templeton better hitters though Ozzie still wasn't a great hitter.

Templeton regularly hit over .300 or damn near .300 while in St Louis.

Ozzie's bat didn't come alive until he hit the turf... and Templeton's bat cooled once he left the turf.

Unless you saw Ozzie play the field his first 4 years... you wouldn't understand how great he was... he got very little national coverage. But I saw him live many, many times. He was "The Wizzard". Templeton was a good fielder also... but nothing like Ozzie.

BTW... you'll never see a youtube of it. But I saw Winfield catch a fly ball against the right field wall (pre-temporary wall) and throw a guy out at home (tagging up) by several feet. Swear to God, that ball never got more than 15 feet off the ground. F-ing cannon arm, that guy!