POLL: Should The Bolts Trade Down From #6?

[Boltjolt]

We still need a OT. You can't fix slow feet at OT. Scott needs to move inside or be cut. Tevi inside as well.

[Steve]

Settle down.

I was laying out 2 sides of the hypothetical argument. Both sides have merit. Both sides have flaws. That is the problem with hypotheticals, they are too absolute. The real world is a much more interesting place than that.

The Chargers need to add more good players. Forget super stars. The Chargers probably have enough stars. Almost certainly do. And good players play better if there are plenty of other good players around them. The Chargers have a lot of players who are not playing well, and to some degree they need to fix that. By that I mean that some of the guys who didn't play well this year are at the point in their careers where they may still come along, so guys like Tillery and Jones (for example) are hardly lost causes. Guys at the end of their rookie deals (Lamp and Feeney) are much closer to being written off.

The catch is that we don't have enough draft picks to fill all the potential holes we have, and that is only by a straight number count. If we hit on every single draft pick, we still won't fill all our needs. And since only about 50% of high 1st round picks (the easiest to judge) are successful, then it is very, very clear we are a couple years away from being able to fill all of our needs.

With Lamp and Feeney also reaching the end of their rookie deals (next year), they are both at a crossroads. They either need to play well or move on. If they do play well, we may be reluctant to pay the large contracts

The second issue is that no team, not even SB winners are really complete rosters. KC had no OL depth, weak perimeter players outside of Clark, poor coverage at ILB. We can go back and list the strengths and weaknesses of every SB winner (and loser) for the last few years, and the point that everyone would have to conclude is that even great teams have weaknesses. The key is to do the synergy thing, and make sure that parts of the O, D and ST complement each other to the point that it minimizes problems.

As far as OL goes, every OL coach preaches fundamentals. The days of the Carl Mauck type guys (just motivators) is pretty much over, at least in the NFL. And as far as concepts, we played a fair amount of zone under Meyer, it didn't necessarily help. We also will continue to need to coach and install power fundamentals, because the backups and defenders who make up our scout team offense will need them to give us a good look. So, in the end, I really don't see much difference. Campen has a better track record, but if you are looking for an overnight turnaround, he couldn't pull that off with Cleveland last season, with arguably better initial talent to work with (although he has a LT in Okung for the Chargers).

[Topcat]

Settle down.

I was laying out 2 sides of the hypothetical argument. Both sides have merit. Both sides have flaws. That is the problem with hypotheticals, they are too absolute. The real world is a much more interesting place than that.

The Chargers need to add more good players. Forget super stars. The Chargers probably have enough stars. Almost certainly do. And good players play better if there are plenty of other good players around them. The Chargers have a lot of players who are not playing well, and to some degree they need to fix that. By that I mean that some of the guys who didn't play well this year are at the point in their careers where they may still come along, so guys like Tillery and Jones (for example) are hardly lost causes. Guys at the end of their rookie deals (Lamp and Feeney) are much closer to being written off.

The catch is that we don't have enough draft picks to fill all the potential holes we have, and that is only by a straight number count. If we hit on every single draft pick, we still won't fill all our needs. And since only about 50% of high 1st round picks (the easiest to judge) are successful, then it is very, very clear we are a couple years away from being able to fill all of our needs.

With Lamp and Feeney also reaching the end of their rookie deals (next year), they are both at a crossroads. They either need to play well or move on. If they do play well, we may be reluctant to pay the large contracts

The second issue is that no team, not even SB winners are really complete rosters. KC had no OL depth, weak perimeter players outside of Clark, poor coverage at ILB. We can go back and list the strengths and weaknesses of every SB winner (and loser) for the last few years, and the point that everyone would have to conclude is that even great teams have weaknesses. The key is to do the synergy thing, and make sure that parts of the O, D and ST complement each other to the point that it minimizes problems.

As far as OL goes, every OL coach preaches fundamentals. The days of the Carl Mauck type guys (just motivators) is pretty much over, at least in the NFL. And as far as concepts, we played a fair amount of zone under Meyer, it didn't necessarily help. We also will continue to need to coach and install power fundamentals, because the backups and defenders who make up our scout team offense will need them to give us a good look. So, in the end, I really don't see much difference. Campen has a better track record, but if you are looking for an overnight turnaround, he couldn't pull that off with Cleveland last season, with arguably better initial talent to work with (although he has a LT in Okung for the Chargers).

This is a key year for both Lamp and Feeney. If Happy Campen is able to develop one or both of them technique-wise to be at least solid, it makes sense to extend them. If not, adios...

[powderblueboy]

Settle down.

I was laying out 2 sides of the hypothetical argument. Both sides have merit. Both sides have flaws. That is the problem with hypotheticals, they are too absolute. The real world is a much more interesting place than that.

The Chargers need to add more good players. Forget super stars. The Chargers probably have enough stars. Almost certainly do. And good players play better if there are plenty of other good players around them. The Chargers have a lot of players who are not playing well, and to some degree they need to fix that. By that I mean that some of the guys who didn't play well this year are at the point in their careers where they may still come along, so guys like Tillery and Jones (for example) are hardly lost causes. Guys at the end of their rookie deals (Lamp and Feeney) are much closer to being written off.

The catch is that we don't have enough draft picks to fill all the potential holes we have, and that is only by a straight number count. If we hit on every single draft pick, we still won't fill all our needs. And since only about 50% of high 1st round picks (the easiest to judge) are successful, then it is very, very clear we are a couple years away from being able to fill all of our needs.

With Lamp and Feeney also reaching the end of their rookie deals (next year), they are both at a crossroads. They either need to play well or move on. If they do play well, we may be reluctant to pay the large contracts

The second issue is that no team, not even SB winners are really complete rosters. KC had no OL depth, weak perimeter players outside of Clark, poor coverage at ILB. We can go back and list the strengths and weaknesses of every SB winner (and loser) for the last few years, and the point that everyone would have to conclude is that even great teams have weaknesses. The key is to do the synergy thing, and make sure that parts of the O, D and ST complement each other to the point that it minimizes problems.

As far as OL goes, every OL coach preaches fundamentals. The days of the Carl Mauck type guys (just motivators) is pretty much over, at least in the NFL. And as far as concepts, we played a fair amount of zone under Meyer, it didn't necessarily help. We also will continue to need to coach and install power fundamentals, because the backups and defenders who make up our scout team offense will need them to give us a good look. So, in the end, I really don't see much difference. Campen has a better track record, but if you are looking for an overnight turnaround, he couldn't pull that off with Cleveland last season, with arguably better initial talent to work with (although he has a LT in Okung for the Chargers).

Pretty much every position group needs to be upgraded or has aging parts that under best circumstances will need to be replaced within the next few years.
I'd hate to see them not mining from the deepest draft groups this draft, trying to fill in holes. I'd hate to go the route of Campen finding
late round nuggets. Bradley was supposedly good at that, but his draft input in L.A. has not been successful.

OTs, wide receivers, running backs, corners.....draft from those groups after pick #6.

They are not close to competing with KC and the elite teams.

[Sgt Schultz]

Simmons kind of sounded like a move toward great defense at first but for a real impact Gus would have to change the defense to the all DB one from New England/ Ravens games 2 years ago. Could/ would he do that? Would a good press corner have more impact?

Seems to me that maximizing the stars we already have is the best route.

[blueman]

Simmons kind of sounded like a move toward great defense at first but for a real impact Gus would have to change the defense to the all DB one from New England/ Ravens games 2 years ago. Could/ would he do that? Would a good press corner have more impact?

Seems to me that maximizing the stars we already have is the best route.

Validity to that for both sides of the ball.

Trade down, acquire more picks (or even the right players), add help for Bosa and Derwin on the DL and at CB, bolster LB corps. Same on O, upgrade OL and add weapons at RB, WE, and TE for Tyrod. But as many point out, we are currently running a talent deficit at almost every position, not sure passing on a guy line Simmons helps us short or long term. Similarly trading up to #2 for Tua will cost a heckuva lot, how much is too much and what players might be in the mix? The FO likely has an idea by now what can be done with Bosa, will it be more crippling to extend him, or trade him in a deal for Tua? Other than picks he is the only player I can see having such value in a trade deal, if the FO thinks that’s the way to go. Again, that would drop our talent deficit even lower at one position, but raise it considerably at another, for less $$$. Something to think about for sure.

[JOJAX85]

I don't think they should, but I'm not opposed to it depending on how their board falls. I don't think should ever trade away a top 10 pick, but if you can trade down & still get your target guy I understand.

[Topcat]

I don't think they should, but I'm not opposed to it depending on how their board falls. I don't think should ever trade away a top 10 pick, but if you can trade down & still get your target guy I understand.

That's why I said earlier that if we trade down from #6 to #9, and any of the following FOUR of Becton, Wills, Wirfs and Thomas are still on the board, then simple math tells us that at least ONE of them will still be there at #9. To pick up an extra 2nd or even a high 3rd rounder in this draft would be huge...now, if Simmons is there...we pick him at #6 quicker than AJ can say "Marcus McNeill"...

[Topcat]

We still need a OT. You can't fix slow feet at OT. Scott needs to move inside or be cut. Tevi inside as well.

Yep...tired of Tevi, unless Happy Campen can somehow work some magic with him...I say draft an OT AND sign a FA O-lineman at the very least...

[like54ninjas]

We still need a OT. You can't fix slow feet at OT. Scott needs to move inside or be cut. Tevi inside as well.

Tevi does not have slow feet. His athleticism, agility, lateral movement flexibility are all excellent. Sam has shit fundamentals, ducts his head often in initial contact, kickslide mechanics, poor drive step on inside counters, lacks grip strength, and inconsistent handstrike placement. I really like Tevi at ORG. With his skillset, size, athleticism, power, length, and some coaching that translates to game performance, Sam will be an outstanding OG with OT depth value.

TScott’s only chance is to move inside agreed.

[Topcat]

Tevi does not have slow feet. His athleticism, agility, lateral movement flexibility are all excellent. Sam has shit fundamentals, ducts his head often in initial contact, kickslide mechanics, poor drive step on inside counters, lacks grip strength, and inconsistent handstrike placement. I really like Tevi at ORG. With his skillset, size, athleticism, power, length, and some coaching that translates to game performance, Sam will be an outstanding OG with OT depth value.

TScott’s only chance is to move inside agreed.

When you watch edge rushers blow by Tevi, his feet sure look slow to me...now, on run blocking, Tevi moves well and blocks well...I like the idea of kicking Tevi inside, because we can use him for pulling...

[like54ninjas]

This is a key year for both Lamp and Feeney. If Happy Campen is able to develop one or both of them technique-wise to be at least solid, it makes sense to extend them. If not, adios...

Okung, Pouncey, Tevi, Feeney, & Lamp are all in the last year of their contracts.
Okung & MP have over a $22 million combined cap hit in 2020 after playing in a combined 11 games in 2019.
Hey we have Qberry locked up through 2021 and Pip till 2022, so all is good.
Nothing to be concerned about with our Oline.

:hadworse:

:LOL: