Justin Herbert - Bolts Franchise QB Official Discussion

[powderblueboy]

I don't, either. I will say I don't think Lamar Jackson is in the same class as Peyton, Stafford, Brady, and others when it comes to commanding the offense. I'm not sure Herbert will ever get there. And I'm not talking about being a fiery leader, either. Montana had complete command of the 49ers' offense, and he was as quiet as Herbert is.

Montana had Bill Walsh as his head coach his first decade, one of the all time great offensive minds and QB developers.
Herbert has had a slew of OCs of varying qualities, new systems every year or two and generally bad offensive lines.

Not an appropriate comparison.

[powderblueboy]

OK. my guess is that Herbert has options. Not personnel package but what he does with it. Quick snap, use all the clock. Bring a player across the formation, send him where he's at. On and On. Play what you practice but we don't know what they have practiced.

I have nothing to add about Jax. The Chargers sucked hard on O and D.

Did anyone hear Danny Woodhead talk about how PR, in shot gun and with the snap coming to him, once audibled for Woodhead to change his route to over the middle?
It was the 2nd half of the playoff victory over Cincy .... a big play to Woodhead.

Does Bozeman get away with changing the blocking scheme and having PR get blasted, without PR getting on his ass?

[Riverwalk]

Montana had Bill Walsh as his head coach his first decade, one of the all time great offensive minds and QB developers.
Herbert has had a slew of OCs of varying qualities, new systems every year or two and generally bad offensive lines.

Not an appropriate comparison.

Here we go with poor Justin has had different OC’s over 6 seasons and none of them are hall of famers excuse again.

Tom Brady said he had a core set of plays he would go to when they were in a rut to snap out of it.

I ask myself if Herbert is elite why hasn’t he figured out offensive plays that work over 6 seasons of experience?

If he does indeed collaborate with Gro then he shares some of the criticism and if Justin has nothing to do with the play calling you have to ask yourself why.

[dmac_bolt]

Montana had Bill Walsh as his head coach his first decade, one of the all time great offensive minds and QB developers.
Herbert has had a slew of OCs of varying qualities, new systems every year or two and generally bad offensive lines.

Not an appropriate comparison.

I don’t see any Bill Walshes up in the Chargers booth.

Guys can blame Herbert as they want to, whatever. Its a tired debate. He has the worst offensive line in the league, literally and empirically the worst OL in the league. and a too-often predictable OC who fails to adjust well to what defenses are doing.

they are gobsmacked that he isn’t a super hero magician. Idunno, maybe they are just new to professional football.

[Bolt4Knob]

I don’t see any Bill Walshes up in the Chargers booth.

Guys can blame Herbert as they want to, whatever. Its a tired debate. He has the worst offensive line in the league, literally and empirically the worst OL in the league. and a too-often predictable OC who fails to adjust well to what defenses are doing.

they are gobsmacked that he isn’t a super hero magician. Idunno, maybe they are just new to professional football.

Klint Kubiak meet Sam Darnold

The reason I think so many don't like GRo is because he has a philosophy that he wants to do but maybe he should see the personnel and try to match the personnel to a strategy

Herbert is bleeping good. Maximize his skillset. If the run game tapers off a bit because Salyer is not as good but he is better in the passing game and that helps the passing game, duh!! Hampton will help the run game

[Boltjolt]

QBs used to call all the plays back in the day.

They are free to audible but no QBs call their own plays these days. Brady didnt, Brees didnt....Phil didnt. Not sure they ALL did back then. Some for sure.

[Factotum]

IIRC, I have only been critical of Justin Herbert on two issues which I think were quite valid in the past but I am coming around to believing that Jim has been very crucial in fixing those issues:

1- Getting Justin to believe in himself that he is indeed the undisputed field commander on that entire team, ergo even the D draws confidence and inspiration through him when he is clicking by putting it all out there on the line. The ability to come back to win close games which we did not see much of and if anything, the exact opposite of it during Lynn and Staley.

2- For a 6'6" QB, the trajectory of some of his passes were not at ideal elevated angles causing batted passed and sometimes INTs at the line of scrimmage. Of course the shoddy OL was also and still is on occasions a culprit on this issue.

I think that Jim has mentored him to believe in himself (he was famously a big believer in himself back when he was the signal caller for the Colts) and has also discussed mechanics with him. There was also another issue in the past which I do not want to make a separate line 3 for it because I believe that some of the happy feet at times was because of him being injured, trying to compromise with a crappy OL.

Crucial potential future injuries notwithstanding, I will reserve judgement on JH/JH and the other JH after the 2026 draft and FA activities to ge the OL sorted out. I know this much that once Justin is no longer our QB, we will reminisce these days when the guy under center ends up being another dud coached by another dud!

[Boltjolt]

Here we go with poor Justin has had different OC’s over 6 seasons and none of them are hall of famers excuse again.

Tom Brady said he had a core set of plays he would go to when they were in a rut to snap out of it.

I ask myself if Herbert is elite why hasn’t he figured out offensive plays that work over 6 seasons of experience?

If he does indeed collaborate with Gro then he shares some of the criticism and if Justin has nothing to do with the play calling you have to ask yourself why.

You answered that in your first sentence. I know you somehow dont think that doesnt matter but it do! He likely does have a few he likes and told that to Roman, especially since he has Keenan back.

Romans offense is different than Steichen, Moore and Lombardi's. If Roman is retained after this season, it will be the first time Herbert has been in the same offense for 3 years since highschool.
Brady played in the same offense til his last two in TB as a 18 year vet. Probably brought those go to plays with him and who would argue with him?

When Phil had to learn a new offense after many years he said he was drowning in it but then said...but i will learn it. It takes time and Herbert has had a new one nearly every year.

[Boltjolt]

IIRC, I have only been critical of Justin Herbert on two issues which I think were quite valid in the past but I am coming around to believing that Jim has been very crucial in fixing those issues:

1- Getting Justin to believe in himself that he is indeed the undisputed field commander on that entire team, ergo even the D draws confidence and inspiration through him when he is clicking by putting it all out there on the line. The ability to come back to win close games which we did not see much of and if anything, the exact opposite of it during Lynn and Staley.

2- For a 6'6" QB, the trajectory of some of his passes were not at ideal elevated angles causing batted passed and sometimes INTs at the line of scrimmage. Of course the shoddy OL was also and still is on occasions a culprit on this issue.

I think that Jim has mentored him to believe in himself (he was famously a big believer in himself back when he was the signal caller for the Colts) and has also discussed mechanics with him. There was also another issue in the past which I do not want to make a separate line 3 for it because I believe that some of the happy feet at times was because of him being injured, trying to compromise with a crappy OL.

Crucial potential future injuries notwithstanding, I will reserve judgement on JH/JH and the other JH after the 2026 draft and FA activities to ge the OL sorted out. I know this much that once Justin is no longer our QB, we will reminisce these days when the guy under center ends up being another dud coached by another dud!

Every QB has batted passes. Couple weeks ago, Goff had 6 in one game.

[jamrock]

They are free to audible but no QBs call their own plays these days. Brady didnt, Brees didnt....Phil didnt. Not sure they ALL did back then. Some for sure.

Just another way the game has evolved. The great ones still have a lot to say about how the plays are called and game plans made.

[powderblueboy]

Here we go with poor Justin has had different OC’s over 6 seasons and none of them are hall of famers excuse again.

Tom Brady said he had a core set of plays he would go to when they were in a rut to snap out of it.

I ask myself if Herbert is elite why hasn’t he figured out offensive plays that work over 6 seasons of experience?

If he does indeed collaborate with Gro then he shares some of the criticism and if Justin has nothing to do with the play calling you have to ask yourself why.

I merely said that it was a bad comparison.

You think Montana would have been El Commandante if drafted by New Orleans, go ahead!

[powderblueboy]

Is Justin having a bad season?
One really bad game, where the entire team stunk to high heaven, and you`d think he was a total fuck up this year by reading recent posts.