Ravens at Chargers (+3.5) Pregame Discussion (Wk 12)

[Velo]

Let’s bring this thread back to the issue at hand.

I have to admit I have mixed feelings about the Chargers beating the Ravens. If they win, it saves Staley’s job for another week. If they lose, it puts more pressure on the Spanoses to send Brandon home.

[Berserker76]

There is a way they can beat the Ravens, and it would require getting a few good licks on Lamar and making his injured ankle feel not so good. I would never advocate a players injury, but this is football and it is a violent sport. Actually think we will do a better job of containing him with Bosa out.

[HerbieParadigm]

Although a newbie, I consider it Chargering to tank or root to lose. I want to see Herbert tear up Moore's predictable Eckler up the middle and have a shoot out with the Ravens.

[Topcat]

A lot of truth here, in hindsight. Add a third - the top offenses have all adjusted to the Fangio scheme at the core of Staley’s design and are more successful against all teams that use it than they were 4 and 5 years ago. Then add the fourth factor - what Mr Genius Smarter-Than-You Staley added was elements to disguise formations and confuse QBs. On paper it seems genius indeed but ln practice what has happened is he confuses his own players more than he confuses the opposing offenses more. it’s a net negative addition to the Fangio scheme.

”its an execution thing”. Its finally clicked with me - Herein lies Staley’s fatal conceit and flaw. He will never get his flaw. he is not burdened with abnormally stupid players, his system requires more rapid split second decisions and reactions by 11 normal NFL players than they are able to reliably execute. Maybe it works on paper by a bunch of genius coaches sitting in chairs, but it doesnt work with live NFL athletes on a field with clocks ticking, bright lights glaring, etc. You can’t replace the best athletes with the best data processors as you can’t win without the best athletes. You have to adjust the scheme to fit the capabilities of your workforce and he just does not get it!

His design cannot be ever realized in the real world of real human players. I’ve worked in design and process development of various industries for 35+ years and while its very different, industry to industry, at the core of conceptualizing process excellence its always the exact same. I’ve seen it from “genius designers” time after time. A process will never be excellent if the design is too complex for humans to consistently and repeatably produce. If a design requires a process that is too complicated for the workforce to consistently and exactly repeat time after time - it is a bad design and has to be changed. You will have more field failures, more warranty returns, lower quality/higher scrap. There are entire professional fields of study on how to design products to optimize process repeatability that have been applied in industries like auto, aerospace’s, electronics, etc - they all trade off the “optimal perfect design” for a design that the workers can produce with the highest quality. Staley’s comments confirm to me he is never going to get this and is doomed to fail forever.

very sad to watch “smart guys” too stupid to understand things as basic as this.

Good analysis, and with some of the latest info we have on Staley's D. + what we see on the field, I think u r correct...In private industry, if a company keeps producing a defective product, the marketplace decides and sales go down...a company needs to quickly correct any design flaws or it faces bankruptcy and/or lawsuits for negligence or other reasons...in my field, education, a teacher needs to make adjustments to lessons, or test scores go down, students fail, discipline issues increase and the teacher gets called on the carpet for all this...in the sports world, a head coach needs to be very much in tune with what's working, and what's not working...and he needs to make adjustments in scheme, game planning and in-game adjustments to counter what the opposing team is doing...with Staley I see a classic case of cognitive dissonance--the total failure to recognize that certain issues need addressing, and to listen to others' concerns...and this has continued over the past few seasons...it's the "my way or the highway" mentality...

[sonorajim]

Although a newbie, I consider it Chargering to tank or root to lose. I want to see Herbert tear up Moore's predictable Eckler up the middle and have a shoot out with the Ravens.

I'm with you. Ravens are a top opponent. Herbert's in his own house and will not be inclined to kneel. Hopefully he runs his own offense.
I don't think there's any hope for our D Staley's anal y tics has made them incontinent and incompetent as a unit.

[sonorajim]

Let’s bring this thread back to the issue at hand.

I have to admit I have mixed feelings about the Chargers beating the Ravens. If they win, it saves Staley’s job for another week. If they lose, it puts more pressure on the Spanoses to send Brandon home.

I support our players. Let them play for pride.
F Brandon and the horse he rode in.

[Berserker76]

I support our players. Let them play for pride.
F Brandon and the horse he rode in.

Agree with this. We're going to be at the game and would love to witness another win. Even with a win, everyone will know it's in spite of Staley being our HC, not because of him.

[21&500]

This is a trap game for Baltimore.
with their bye week in sight, we are cornered animals
Lamar is good for 1 interception and/or fumble.

LFG!!!

[Lefty2SLO]

Here's another theory for you: What if the defense on the Rams Staley took over was ALREADY INSTALLED?...Then, all Staley did was to continue the previous program...AND he also had great players...then, when Staley comes to the Bolts, he says, "I'm going to install my OWN, ORIGINAL defense, and make a name for myself..."
(and it flopped...)

Could be right . . . . . . . . .this would mean that Staley even dumber than I thought . . . . . . .

[Charge!]

This is a trap game for Baltimore.
with their bye week in sight, we are cornered animals
Lamar is good for 1 interception and/or fumble.

LFG!!!

Ravens love to run..... and they also have a great set of receivers.....Since Chargers cannot cover anyone and play so far from receivers, will ravens be tempted/forced to pass more, or will they stick to what they love to do?

[dmac_bolt]

Good analysis, and with some of the latest info we have on Staley's D. + what we see on the field, I think u r correct...In private industry, if a company keeps producing a defective product, the marketplace decides and sales go down...a company needs to quickly correct any design flaws or it faces bankruptcy and/or lawsuits for negligence or other reasons...in my field, education, a teacher needs to make adjustments to lessons, or test scores go down, students fail, discipline issues increase and the teacher gets called on the carpet for all this...in the sports world, a head coach needs to be very much in tune with what's working, and what's not working...and he needs to make adjustments in scheme, game planning and in-game adjustments to counter what the opposing team is doing...with Staley I see a classic case of cognitive dissonance--the total failure to recognize that certain issues need addressing, and to listen to others' concerns...and this has continued over the past few seasons...it's the "my way or the highway" mentality...

Exactly. Every profession is different but they all have an analogous requirement for honest evaluation of dynamic data and performance and adaptive solutions. Your analogy is excellent - If kids consistently can’t get good scores, a good teacher can’t just keep blaming the kids for being dumb, blame parents for whatever, etc (= “execution”). My daughter had a horrible math teacher a year ago, could not teach anything and did not even have mastery of the basics to be able to. I had several meetings with her and the counselor and she told me the students need to study the lessons she delivers. I took it upon myself to teach her 7th grade math every day after school as I wouldn’t let her be victim to an intransigent incompetent teacher. I couldn’t wait for the system to fix itself. That teacher needs to be removed from math instruction.

Chargers need to stop waiting for Staley to get it because Staley has told us repeatedly, as recently as Sunday and Monday, that he won’t get it - his system is great and the blame is “execution”.

They can stop waiting for TT to acquire above-average talent as well - 10 years and 3 coaches is the end of his 4th quarter too.

Back to the topic at hand - I’m the great optimist here but I’m not confident at all that LAC will win. I will enjoy the game thoroughly as I always do but I don’t expect a big smile at the end of it. I see the Ravens carving his defense like a plump 6-legged turducken on Madden’s bus. Herbie will be valiant, he is a fucking God, but he will probably not be able to pull it out. Someone or several ones will pucker up like prunes at key points due to the pressure the defense creates on the offense.

[21&500]

Ravens love to run..... and they also have a great set of receivers.....Since Chargers cannot cover anyone and play so far from receivers, will ravens be tempted/forced to pass more, or will they stick to what they love to do?

I believe our run D will show up and tempt the Ravens to go away from the run
I think Andrews being out is huge, he's an easy go-to target for LJ.
LJ will get his yards through the air but not having that security blanket could be a challenge for him.
Herbo continues to use his legs to keep drives alive, I say we have a great chance at an upset.
Q redeems himself.
Fake grass can also mess with the Ravens who are used to real grass.