For just once in my miserable life as a Chargers fan

[Boltdog]

I think the only issues I can really take with the content of your post are two, and both carry qualifications:

(1) This season, Te'o has been extremely productive when healthy. Of course, since he hasn't been healthy, he hasn't been productive.

Manti Teo's record of "productivity" so far in his NFL career:

No Sacks
No INTs
No Fumbles Forced or Recovered
Not sure if he even has one tackle for loss
19 Tackles in 2014 with 7 of those assisted (many of his tackles as a pro appear to be of the Donnie-Edwards-5-yards-beyond LOS style)

So Teo has been "extremely productive"?? Many here could probably give you a list of other 2nd year LBs who have been more productive than Teo.
The reason for his lack of impact remains his smallish size and foot speed. The fact that he outplays Butler when healthy says more about Butler's
problems this season than it does Teo, who probably would not start for most other NFL teams running a 3-4. If he can ever stay healthy, Teo might
earn his keep with his instincts, but otherwise he has not yet earned any superlatives for his "production." He's still a work in progress, but his career is
starting to look more like Larry English at this juncture...


Do you sell time shares or do MLM? Your hyper-enthusiasm sometimes does remind me of those folks...

[thelightningwill]

Manti Teo's record of "productivity" so far in his NFL career:

No Sacks
No INTs
No Fumbles Forced or Recovered
Not sure if he even has one tackle for loss
19 Tackles in 2014 with 7 of those assisted (many of his tackles as a pro appear to be of the Donnie-Edwards-5-yards-beyond LOS style)

So Teo has been "extremely productive"?? Many here could probably give you a list of other 2nd year LBs who have been more productive than Teo.
The reason for his lack of impact remains his smallish size and foot speed. The fact that he outplays Butler when healthy says more about Butler's
problems this season than it does Teo, who probably would not start for most other NFL teams running a 3-4. If he can ever stay healthy, Teo might
earn his keep with his instincts, but otherwise he has not yet earned any superlatives for his "production." He's still a work in progress, but his career is
starting to look more like Larry English at this juncture...


Do you sell time shares or do MLM? Your hyper-enthusiasm sometimes does remind me of those folks...

The reason for Te'o's lack of impact is that he's too often injured. How many games has he missed? And, when he's played, how often has he been healthy enough to help us?

Same goes for a number of players on our team. We need to do a better job of getting players who play. I don't give a shit how talented you are if you can't play.

[Boltx]

I still think Teo can become a productive starter. But right now he's not even a Zeke Moreno.

[Panama]

Manti Teo's record of "productivity" so far in his NFL career:

No Sacks
No INTs
No Fumbles Forced or Recovered
Not sure if he even has one tackle for loss
19 Tackles in 2014 with 7 of those assisted (many of his tackles as a pro appear to be of the Donnie-Edwards-5-yards-beyond LOS style)

So Teo has been "extremely productive"?? Many here could probably give you a list of other 2nd year LBs who have been more productive than Teo.
The reason for his lack of impact remains his smallish size and foot speed. The fact that he outplays Butler when healthy says more about Butler's
problems this season than it does Teo, who probably would not start for most other NFL teams running a 3-4. If he can ever stay healthy, Teo might
earn his keep with his instincts, but otherwise he has not yet earned any superlatives for his "production." He's still a work in progress, but his career is
starting to look more like Larry English at this juncture...


Do you sell time shares or do MLM? Your hyper-enthusiasm sometimes does remind me of those folks...

I'll ignore the little dig at the end and instead focus on criticizing you for not reading carefully. I very clearly stated that (1) when healthy he has been productive but (2) he has not been healthy therefore he has not been productive. You are correct, those numbers are not typically classed as "productive," and I don't pretend that they are. (Though I'm not sure why you include INTs and sacks, as he's neither a DB nor a pass rusher.)

However, go look at the stats that have been posted here and elsewhere. (I'm not going to dig them up for you.) This season, before he got hurt, he led the team in tackles and in stops (tackles for loss, no gain, or minimal gain). You are right that he has not been productive overall, but you are wrong if you think he has not been productive when healthy this season.

(P.S., what's MLM anyway?)

[Panama]

I still think Teo can become a productive starter. But right now he's not even a Zeke Moreno.

That's a low blow! :lol:

[Boltjolt]

I'll ignore the little dig at the end and instead focus on criticizing you for not reading carefully. I very clearly stated that (1) when healthy he has been productive but (2) he has not been healthy therefore he has not been productive. You are correct, those numbers are not typically classed as "productive," and I don't pretend that they are. (Though I'm not sure why you include INTs and sacks, as he's neither a DB nor a pass rusher.)

However, go look at the stats that have been posted here and elsewhere. (I'm not going to dig them up for you.) This season, before he got hurt, he led the team in tackles and in stops (tackles for loss, no gain, or minimal gain). You are right that he has not been productive overall, but you are wrong if you think he has not been productive when healthy this season.

(P.S., what's MLM anyway?)

And he was towards rhe end of last season. Lets not forget he missed all of preseason his rookie year and fell behind and then played all year on a broken foot. Id really like to see what he can do in a season when he doesnt miss games and doesnt have foot injuries.

[Steve]

One of the problems with defining impact plays for ILB is what is their role in the D? Do our ILB have a chance to make a ton of those kinds of plays? ILB are not big pass rushers, and are usually inside rushers when they blitz. So, they are not in a position to make a lot of sacks. Has ANY ILB EVER gotten 10 sacks in a year? So, the fact that a guy has missed time probably means that even if he can get pressure blitzing, he hasn't had enough chances to get a sack.

Pass coverage is pretty similar. They tend to cover short passes that the QB is most accurate on. They are also at an athletic and alignment mismatch against the guy who run those patterns either in man or zone. Typically whichever ILB has the most int in a season, usually has 4 or 5 most years. Sometimes it is only 3. So, again, if the guy misses some time, and doesn't play on all the passing downs, he just isn't going to be on the field enough for that slim chance of making a big play to happen.

The one place that an ILB has a chance to make an impact is tackles close to the line. That means coming up to the line, filling their gap (ALL LB get a gap where they have to take on and defeat an OL, FB or TE) and then make a tackle. And even if they do, it is not a huge game changer. Unless you are one of the few elite player, in the right schemes, with the right players around them, they aren't going to be "impact" players, even if they are playing very well.

There are 2 other things worth noting.

1). The idea that football is more about ability then it is learned skills is complete bullshit. Players have to learn skills and develop those skills and like any athletic skill, that takes time and practice. And unlike most things in sport, you can't learn their skills anywhere else. You have to go on a field and bash each others brains out play after play, getting a little bit better play after play. So the idea that you know how good a player will be as a rookie is just crap.

2). Given the point made above, and how college football is played these days, how many impact LB are going to be coming out of college now? Before we start ditching our ILB like crazy, there is not a very big pool of accomplished LB coming out to replace them. So, if we are going to dump Teo (or Butler), we better be damn sure that they really are guys we cannot live with, because finding "impact" ILB is almost impossible and is only going to get tougher.

[oneinchpunch]

Here's a look at the offensive line's numbers this year

Player Snaps Blown Block(R) Blown Block(P) QB Hit Sack Penalty
Dunlap 585 5 12.5 3 3 2
Rinehart 594 5.5 7.5 5 4 1
Ohrnberger418 9 12 5 2
Troutman 424 14 11 2 2
Watt 193 3.5 1.5 1 1
Fluker 556 12 13.5 3 4 2

[blahblahblah]

Compared the the other C and RG I'd say Watt had earned more PT.

Fluker's been really bad, but we don't need stats to know that.

[oneinchpunch]

http://www.chargers.com/news/article-1/Bolts-at-the-Bye-Recapping-the-O-Line/65d93dbd-452f-43bc-b366-34f180e806ad?adbid=10152630157442713&adbpl=fb&adbpr=86995802712&campaign=social_20141108_35207407

Bolts at the Bye: Recapping the O-Line

Ricky Henne
Managing Editor

The offensive line has proven to be a resilient group heading into the bye. Philip Rivers has been given time to throw for the most part as he’s been sacked only 16 times. That is ninth fewest in the league among quarterbacks to attempt at least 250 passes.

The center position was hit especially hard by injuries. Nick Hardwick’s season ended after one game due to stingers, and his replacement Rich Ohrnberger missed time due to a back ailment. Doug Legursky was signed when Hardwick went down and was thrust into the starting lineup after Ohrnberger’s back flared up. However, Legursky was lost for the season after suffering a knee injury. The Chargers then signed Trevor Robinson off the Cincinnati Bengals practice squad, but he has yet to see game action.

Left tackle King Dunlap and right tackle D.J. Fluker have formed a pair of massive tackles tasked with protecting the quarterback. Both players have started every game, although swing tackle Willie Smith has seen time as well in a reserve role.

Chad Rinehart has played nearly every snap of the season at left guard. While Johnnie Troutman has started each game at right guard, beginning Week 4 against the Jacksonville Jaguars, he started rotating series with third round pick Chris Watt.

[thelightningwill]

http://www.chargers.com/news/article...41108_35207407


Bolts at the Bye: Recapping the O-Line

Ricky Henne
Managing Editor

The offensive line has proven to be a resilient group heading into the bye. Philip Rivers has been given time to throw for the most part as he’s been sacked only 16 times. That is ninth fewest in the league among quarterbacks to attempt at least 250 passes.

The center position was hit especially hard by injuries. Nick Hardwick’s season ended after one game due to stingers, and his replacement Rich Ohrnberger missed time due to a back ailment. Doug Legursky was signed when Hardwick went down and was thrust into the starting lineup after Ohrnberger’s back flared up. However, Legursky was lost for the season after suffering a knee injury. The Chargers then signed Trevor Robinson off the Cincinnati Bengals practice squad, but he has yet to see game action.

Left tackle King Dunlap and right tackle D.J. Fluker have formed a pair of massive tackles tasked with protecting the quarterback. Both players have started every game, although swing tackle Willie Smith has seen time as well in a reserve role.

Chad Rinehart has played nearly every snap of the season at left guard. While Johnnie Troutman has started each game at right guard, beginning Week 4 against the Jacksonville Jaguars, he started rotating series with third round pick Chris Watt.

I don't have Steve-like abilities, so I can't exactly tell what the problem is with the offensive line in contrast to last year's unit. My guess is losing Hardwick sucked and that having rotating guards is a stupid idea. But that's just based on common sense - not really what I've seen. Perhaps the replacement for Hardwick is brilliant and the rotating guards is a great strategy.

[Boltjolt]

http://www.chargers.com/news/article...41108_35207407


Bolts at the Bye: Recapping the O-Line

Ricky Henne
Managing Editor

The offensive line has proven to be a resilient group heading into the bye. Philip Rivers has been given time to throw for the most part as he’s been sacked only 16 times. That is ninth fewest in the league among quarterbacks to attempt at least 250 passes.

The center position was hit especially hard by injuries. Nick Hardwick’s season ended after one game due to stingers, and his replacement Rich Ohrnberger missed time due to a back ailment. Doug Legursky was signed when Hardwick went down and was thrust into the starting lineup after Ohrnberger’s back flared up. However, Legursky was lost for the season after suffering a knee injury. The Chargers then signed Trevor Robinson off the Cincinnati Bengals practice squad, but he has yet to see game action.

Left tackle King Dunlap and right tackle D.J. Fluker have formed a pair of massive tackles tasked with protecting the quarterback. Both players have started every game, although swing tackle Willie Smith has seen time as well in a reserve role.

Chad Rinehart has played nearly every snap of the season at left guard. While Johnnie Troutman has started each game at right guard, beginning Week 4 against the Jacksonville Jaguars, he started rotating series with third round pick Chris Watt.

16 sacks plus numerous throw aways to avoid sack and hurried throws. Does this Ricky Henne watch the games? Not to mention the running game is last in the league.