AFC West Roster Positional Rankings

[Guest]

Needs to stop throwing pick 6s in the 4th quarter.

Jared Cook being gone should take care of most of that.

[Guest]

Not out to win. I think you and I are having a fine conversation. Just thought the video was funny.

ESPN interviewed NFL executives, coaches, and players in order to comprise a Top 10 list at quarterback, and it shook out like this:

10. Dak Prescott
9. Deshaun Watson
8. Russell Wilson
7. Justin Herbert
6. Matthew Stafford
5. Joe Burrow
4. Tom Brady
3. Josh Allen
2. Patrick Mahomes
1. Aaron Rodgers

It's an insider article, so I can't read it, but I think we all agree that Herbert is ranked too low. I think Herbert should be somewhere in the three-to-five range, as I believe he is better than Brady and Stafford, and while I think Herbert is better than Allen and Burrow, I can see how others would feel the opposite. I think watching Allen, Burrow, Herbert, Mahomes, and Watson (if he actually plays) is right up there with the days of Elway, Kelly, Marino, and Moon. Although quarterback is not my favorite position (I'm a bigger fan of defense, hence my screen name), it's an interesting time to be watching the game.

Now, cue Chain educating us on how bad every other quarterback is...Lol.

I am unimpressed by ESPN's list. I see players getting a lot of credit for team accomplishments and I see the presence of recency bias propping up with Stafford and Burrow both being overrated. Herbert is the QB with the passing records for QBs in their first two seasons, not Burrow. Stafford is a good, but not elite QB and one better season does not change a decade's worth of lesser results in terms of what one would reasonably expect for 2022.

Presently, I rank the QBs as follows in terms of what I expect in 2022:

1. Justin Herbert
2. Josh Allen
3. Aaron Rodgers
4. Patrick Mahomes
5. Deshaun Watson
6. Lamar Jackson
7. Russell Wilson
8. Tom Brady
9. Matthew Stafford
10. Dak Prescott
11. Joe Burrow
12. Kirk Cousins
13. Kyler Murray

Herbert and Allen are very, very close. Mahomes has been passed by these two physically superior QBs. Rodgers has always been better than Mahomes, but in 2022 I see Herbert and Allen being better than Rodgers. Watson's ranking assumes he plays. If he misses most of the season, then he can be dropped form my list as it relates to 2022. Burrow is only ranked ahead of Cousins because Burrow has the best top 3 group of WRs in the NFL. Burrow is generally overrated and Cousins is very underrated (three straight passer ratings over 103). Both QBs are less athletic QBs that have had some statistical success.

[equivocation]

2 weeks.

[Ghost of Quacksaw]

I disagree with any sort of Mahomerism in which he is characterized as "otherwordly". Having seen both players on the same field in the same game in person, I can 100% guarantee you that Herbert is the bigger, faster player and that he regularly throws a better ball than Mahomes does. Simply put, our car has a bigger and better engine than their car.

Also false is this notion that Mahomes is a better runner than Herbert. He is not. Herbert is faster than Mahomes. The two players had very comparable rushing stats in 2021 (366 yards and 2 TDs for Mahomes versus 302 yards and 3 TDs for Herbert). But keep in mind that opposing defenses played KC very deep because of Hill, which would naturally make it easier for the QB to run in that situation.

Herbert was flat out better than Mahomes in 11 statistical categories in 2021. Some have tried to argue that Mahomes is more accurate because he had a higher completion percentage. This conclusion is false. Herbert actually was the QB with the higher on target percentage, finishing in the top 3 overall in the NFL in that category. Mahomes did not finish in the top 10. Herbert was in the top 6 in lowest poor throw percentage. Mahomes was in the bottom 6 in lowest poor throw percentage, meaning that he threw a higher percentage of poor passes than the vast majority of NFL QBs.

Again, Super Bowl wins are a team accomplishment, not an individual accomplishment. Being on a Super Bowl winning team has zero bearing with respect to a determination of which of two QBs is the better player. That is the kind of nonsense that Giants fans throw out to try to claim that Eli Manning was a better player than Philip Rivers when Rivers was leaps and bounds better than Eli Manning was.

Because of the flukish statistical outlier beginning of his 2018 season, Mahomes has always been given more credit than he is due to the point that when our own QB has a better season than Mahomes as happened in 2021, many Chargers fans refuse to accept that Herbert is simply the more physically gifted and better QB. That is not to say that Mahomes is not a great QB. He is a top 5 QB, but Herbert is better.

Mahomes can run like a RB, with a full complement of jukes and dips He's like a point guard. Herb's less compact, and runs more like a small forward. Austin Ekeler put it *this* way: Herb doesn't have 'moves', he has 'swerve'. My understanding was that Mahomes is a 4.5/40 guy, while Herb timed out at 4.6. They're just not terribly similar as runners, except to say both are faster than most QBs.

In how many statistical categories did Mahomes outperform Herb? Context matters.

To a degree, I think we don't really know who Herb is yet. He hasn't played as much. He has more to prove than Mahomes does. He's off to an unprecedented start, but you can ask Jim Everett what a good start to an NFL career guarantees.

I don't need you to agree with me, and I don't claim that my opinion is more *right* than anyone else's. I just see it differently than you do.

[richpjr]

Mahomes can run like a RB, with a full complement of jukes and dips He's like a point guard. Herb's less compact, and runs more like a small forward. Austin Ekeler put it *this* way: Herb doesn't have 'moves', he has 'swerve'. My understanding was that Mahomes is a 4.5/40 guy, while Herb timed out at 4.6. They're just not terribly similar as runners, except to say both are faster than most QBs.

In how many statistical categories did Mahomes outperform Herb? Context matters.

To a degree, I think we don't really know who Herb is yet. He hasn't played as much. He has more to prove than Mahomes does. He's off to an unprecedented start, but you can ask Jim Everett what a good start to an NFL career guarantees.

I don't need you to agree with me, and I don't claim that my opinion is more *right* than anyone else's. I just see it differently than you do.

Mahomes ran a 4.8 40 and Herbert ran a 4.68 40.

[dmac_bolt]

I am unimpressed by ESPN's list. I see players getting a lot of credit for team accomplishments and I see the presence of recency bias propping up with Stafford and Burrow both being overrated. Herbert is the QB with the passing records for QBs in their first two seasons, not Burrow. Stafford is a good, but not elite QB and one better season does not change a decade's worth of lesser results in terms of what one would reasonably expect for 2022.

Presently, I rank the QBs as follows in terms of what I expect in 2022:

1. Justin Herbert
2. Josh Allen
3. Aaron Rodgers
4. Patrick Mahomes
5. Deshaun Watson
6. Lamar Jackson
7. Russell Wilson
8. Tom Brady
9. Matthew Stafford
10. Dak Prescott
11. Joe Burrow
12. Kirk Cousins
13. Kyler Murray

Herbert and Allen are very, very close. Mahomes has been passed by these two physically superior QBs. Rodgers has always been better than Mahomes, but in 2022 I see Herbert and Allen being better than Rodgers. Watson's ranking assumes he plays. If he misses most of the season, then he can be dropped form my list as it relates to 2022. Burrow is only ranked ahead of Cousins because Burrow has the best top 3 group of WRs in the NFL. Burrow is generally overrated and Cousins is very underrated (three straight passer ratings over 103). Both QBs are less athletic QBs that have had some statistical success.

This is a pretty good/better list than the biased “experts”. I’d adjust as

1. Justin Herbert
2. Josh Allen
3. Aaron Rodgers
4. Patrick Mahomes
11. Joe Burrow
8. Tom Brady
9. Matthew Stafford
7. Russell Wilson
6. Lamar Jackson
10. Dak Prescott
12. Kirk Cousins
13. Kyler Murray
5. Deshaun Watson

Fuck Deshaun - he ain’t even playing …

[chargeroo]

I could go with Dmac's list. It's hard to rank them though, because their teammates can have such a big effect on them.

[sonorajim]

QB production 2021:
Passing yds: Brady, Herbert, Stafford, Mahomes, Carr
Passing TDs : Brady, Herbert, Rodgers, Mahomes, Prescott
QBR : Rodgers, Burrow, Prescott, Cousins, Wilson

It's hard to argue against Brady but Herbert is right there when TB stumbles.

[CivilBolt]

I could go with Dmac's list. It's hard to rank them though, because their teammates can have such a big effect on them.

Hence the drop off of Tyreekless Mahomes :thumbsup:

[SBbound]

It's hard to argue against Brady but Herbert is right there when TB stumbles.

What a dream Superbowl that would be!

[Guest]

Mahomes can run like a RB, with a full complement of jukes and dips He's like a point guard. Herb's less compact, and runs more like a small forward. Austin Ekeler put it *this* way: Herb doesn't have 'moves', he has 'swerve'. My understanding was that Mahomes is a 4.5/40 guy, while Herb timed out at 4.6. They're just not terribly similar as runners, except to say both are faster than most QBs.

In how many statistical categories did Mahomes outperform Herb? Context matters.

To a degree, I think we don't really know who Herb is yet. He hasn't played as much. He has more to prove than Mahomes does. He's off to an unprecedented start, but you can ask Jim Everett what a good start to an NFL career guarantees.

I don't need you to agree with me, and I don't claim that my opinion is more *right* than anyone else's. I just see it differently than you do.

Mahomes runs a 4.8 40. He is much slower than most people think he is.

[RockyMtnBoltFan]

I don’t care what Mahomes 40 time is. My eyes tell me that he has a great feel for pressure, how to avoid it and when to use his feet to make plays at critical moments. He’s f-ing killed the Chargers with that $hit seemingly every year This whole thread is stupid. Mahomes IS a GREAT QB…Herbert IS a GREAT QB….and I’m glad to have Herbert on my side compared to that Kermit the Frog motherfucker!