Former OC Kellen Moore - Discussion

[sonorajim]

I'll put a oar in the water on this one; I'm of the belief that this was a Staley hire, because;

1. I don't think ownership is smart enough to set this up, and
2. Staley knows he's gone anyway if the team doesn't win, he's prioritizing winning as the best way to keep his job, even if Moore is a threat to his position.

Anything less than a playoff win, there will be changes at HC and / or DC.
Moore is totally in the young, talented coach lane.
If we make the AFCC.in '23, the stock goes up for Spanos,TT, BS, KM.
I believe Spanos & TT have made their bed with Staley and have the guts to see it through at least in '23.
I'm glad it's done. KM's input in FA & draft will be important. A lot of work ahead in the next few months.

[perryao]

For years lurking on this (and other) Charger forums I've discounted the notion that ownership was a significant factor in the team's failure (or successes) on the field. I felt that they were just an easy target for frustrated fans. After all - the team was spending up to the cap limit, right? But this season (in particular) has brought home to me how important ownership's decisions can be, and the significant impact those decision can have on the field.

I'm hoping for the best for 23 & 24, but what I really hope for is that all this smoke in regards to the Spanos clan's issues has some serious fire under there somewhere, and drives a change - it's sorely needed.

Wealthy ownership most certainly does factor in a team's success/failure. First, a wealthy owner can afford higher priced coaches (and not just HC's) and other resources that require more money (traingin equip, travel, etc). Second, and more importantly, when an NFL owner signs a player to a contract, he must deposit in escrow all guaranteed money in the contract (up to 75% of the contract, iirc). So, the richest owners, who typically have the most liquidity, have a huge advantage over owners like Spanos, whose wealth is not liquid (most of which is the value of the Chargers).

[dmac_bolt]

What is undeniable is that Moore's resume outweighs Staley's when he was first hired.
no one claims to havet"special insight", if you require that, then I guess you're not allowed to speculate at all.
I've never claimed it was anymore than that and no I don't think it's malicious slander to suggest someone would be strategic in their hiring process outside of on-field purposes.
If you don't think that happens in every industry, you're simply naive.
It's not a stretch to connect dots, staley said he's looking for X, he ended up hiring Y, all the others Xs were guys who had no real chance to supplant staley, therefore safe hires for someone on the hotseat after 2 embarrassing season exits.
Y however, looks like the classic Spanos hire and no one should be shocked if staley is replaced by Moore if our defense sinks and out offense is elite.
but even then I'm sure you'll need a few reports and concrete evidence.
Good luck choosing between fish and chicken for dinner, you might beed proof that each are what they claim they are.

Haha

Moore has a good resume, I love the hire. you said “the bold is undeniable”, i deny it. Your post wasnt stated as speculation, but as unchallengeable fact. One assumption piled atop the next-all negative and defamatory. Thats fine, it’s your right. I just posted my opinion of your fantastic negative imagination.

You repeat your imagined theory here again, cool. it actually is a stretch to connect your dots in the negative way you did, it’s a big stretch. There is zero evidence or even educated rumors in any professional sports press reporting that are remotely close to your theory.

your chicken and fish analogy lack the same imagination as your coach hiring theory. You might work on that.

[electricgold]

This was a great hire, but not enough to say a Brandon Staley head coached team are superbowl favorites or are even playoff winners, tho as always before the season a bunch of people and experts will be saying the Chargers are going to go to the Superbowl next year, every preseason for some weird reason, they are always favored by some to make it to the superbowl! Sorry but the D and D playcaller was as big an issue as our former OC issue was this last season. Its a fact no matter what Staley and TT and owners say!

Here's why this was a great hire realistically speaking. Brandon Staley year 3 is on a short leash so If we start out as a 500 team again the first move is to make K. Moore the HC mid season. 2nd if we lose game 1 in the playoffs and we see no improvements next season, its time to make a pitch and bring in Jim Harbuagh and make him an offer he can't refuse and TT and Staley and even Moore will be out of jobs, unless Harbaugh would want to keep K. Moore on as OC! Staley will come into the draft and next season his usual self trying to explain and sell everyone on justifications or excuses why and when they lose games as always, but again all that matters next season is results, and frankly no progression and a finish like last season will cost Staley's and TT their job, no matter what spin is put on the results!

I'm feeling very good about next season with Brandon Staley and TT because its win or go home! The one thing I will say is if we were to win 1 playoff game in the wildcard round and lose the next game i would be unhappy with an extension for Brandon Staley why? Because we have a top 3 QB in the league! A one win playoff season will be proof that Staley is an underachiever HC! Looking forward to the draft and a deep playoff run, nothing less will be acceptable!

[Boltjolt]

Staley gets another season to turn things around on defense. Moore will help on offense. I dont think Staley intends to hire someone who cant replace him. They jumped on Moore when he became available.
Staleys 4 mil owed at the end of next season makes him replacable and if they do, Harbaugh is said to want this job.

Too bad Dean is too cheap to hire him, so Moore would be a good comp i guess....with an offensive scheme in place.

[Boltjolt]

You know who reminds me of Mathews? Chase Brown...watched a lot of Illini football this year, and thats the comparison that popped into my head.

To add, I do like Brown. I just usually like the bigger RBs for injuries but i heard Brown on NFL Radio being interviewed by Jim Miler and he, like Ekeler is a workout warrior.

Dude squats over 500 lbs. Has linemen like combined numbers in that work out area. Has a brother who is a safety on that team and they compete against each other all the time, work out together.

I see him listed at 200 to 205. If he can get to 210, great. I still prefer 215 to 220 RBs but if they platoon it could be a great combo. Brown is a good player and has some wheels and he cuts on a dime. Very sudden in that area.
He acknowledged his need to improve in pass protection and that will come but id be OK drafting him as well.

[dmac_bolt]

To add, I do like Brown. I just usually like the bigger RBs for injuries but i heard Brown on NFL Radio being interviewed by Jim Miler and he, like Ekeler is a workout warrior. Dude squats over 500 lbs. Has linemen like combined numbers in that work out area. Has a brother who is a safety on that team and they compete against each other all the time, work out together.

I see him listed at 200 to 205. If he can get to 210, great. I still prefer 215 to 220 RBs but if they platoon it could be a great combo. Brown is a good player and has some wheels and he cuts on a dime. Very sudden in that area.
He acknowledged his need to improve in pass protection and that will come but id be OK drafting him as well.

Do you think that’s why we didn’t see any Spiller this year? I’ve wondered - if they’ll hand off to Roundblob on occassion, i mean … cmon.

[21&500]

Moore has a good resume, I love the hire. you said “the bold is undeniable”, i deny it. Your post wasnt stated as speculation, but as unchallengeable fact. One assumption piled atop the next-all negative and defamatory. Thats fine, it’s your right. I just posted my opinion of your fantastic negative imagination.

You repeat your imagined theory here again, cool. it actually is a stretch to connect your dots in the negative way you did, it’s a big stretch. There is zero evidence or even educated rumors in any professional sports press reporting that are remotely close to your theory.

your chicken and fish analogy lack the same imagination as your coach hiring theory. You might work on that.

So much word-vomit just to get to the crux of the matter here.
haha
I am being as objective as I can, in this instance, I wasn't inferring anything negative, you interpreted that way because it's a valid perspective--not hiring the best candidate to avoid potential replacement is not putting the organization ahead of yourself. And that's arguable, some.might say it's smart snd strategic to put yourself first if you believe in your ability to win a championship.

Anyway, I'll continue to be critical when it's warranted and connect dots when they're there, try to get used to it.
I'll be wrong plenty, I don't mind.

Cheers.

[Boltjolt]

Do you think that’s why we didn’t see any Spiller this year? I’ve wondered - if they’ll hand off to Roundblob on occassion, i mean … cmon.

Could be. Staley made a comment about he needs to show something to get into games.. ..don't recall if that was pass protection or what.
Kelly will be in his last year of his deal. He was better but not spectacular.
Hopefully we see more of Spiller.
If we draft a RB, I'd just cut Rountree. Wasn't a fan of him coming out.

As for Brown, he said he knows the assignments on his pass pro and where he needs to be, he just needs to refine his technique.

[DerwinBosa]

I'm hoping to see more Air Coryell in the passing game mixed with a Shanahan-style running attack.


Moore mentioned two systems when discussing his core philosophy. One was the Air Coryell system, developed and made famous by former Chargers head coach Don Coryell. The other was the West Coast system, originated by legendary 49ers coach Bill Walsh.

Moore has ties to both systems.

He spent the final three years of his NFL playing career as a reserve quarterback for former Cowboys head coach Jason Garrett. Garrett adopted the Air Coryell system from Ernie Zampese, an assistant for Coryell from 1979 to 1986. Zampese was the Cowboys’ offensive coordinator from 1994 to 1997, and Garrett was a backup quarterback for Dallas during those seasons. Moore then coached under Garrett for two seasons in Dallas, first as a quarterbacks coach in 2018 and then as the offensive coordinator in 2019. The Air Coryell system is very much a downfield passing attack.

Moore then learned the West Coast system from Cowboys head coach Mike McCarthy. Moore was McCarthy’s offensive coordinator and play caller for the past three seasons. McCarthy coached under Paul Hackett for almost a decade, first at the University of Pittsburgh and then with the Chiefs. Hackett coached under Walsh for three seasons with the 49ers.

The West Coast offense, which is rooted primarily in shorter horizontal timing routes, has a rich history in the league. Lombardi, in fact, is a descendant of Walsh. Lombardi learned the system from Sean Payton, who learned it from Jon Gruden, who learned it from Mike Holmgren, who learned it from Walsh. The system, of course, goes through different iterations and variations as it is passed down and molded by different coaches. But this connection feels worth mentioning, especially since there might be some overlap between what Herbert learned in the previous offense and the West Coast concepts Moore is going to bring in.

“Will you be able to see the Air Coryell-Jason Garrett side? Absolutely,” Moore said. “Will you be able to see the West Coast and Mike McCarthy? Absolutely. We’ll keep things that are in place here that Justin feels really, really good about. And then we’ll be willing to explore.”

https://theathletic.com/4148057/2023...e-coordinator/

[northerner]

any fans from the Fouts era love to hear the words Air Coryell. the Air Coryell chargers were the first team that was as likely to throw on first down, as they were to run. Air Coryell was a game changer, and quickly influenced the whole league.

i was young at the time of the Fouts era, do any old timers agree with my opinion??

[dmac_bolt]

So much word-vomit just to get to the crux of the matter here.
haha
I am being as objective as I can, in this instance, I wasn't inferring anything negative, you interpreted that way because it's a valid perspective--not hiring the best candidate to avoid potential replacement is not putting the organization ahead of yourself. And that's arguable, some.might say it's smart snd strategic to put yourself first if you believe in your ability to win a championship.

Anyway, I'll continue to be critical when it's warranted and connect dots when they're there, try to get used to it.
I'll be wrong plenty, I don't mind.

Cheers.

Lol, glad to bring you cheer. You stated Staley did not decide to hire him and it’s obviously the Spani interjecting themselves and forced Moore’s OC hiring so they will have his replacement on staff. Because they promote a coordinator so often when they fire the HC, it’s just what they always … oh wait, they generally don’t. Never mind that. this time for sure!

I agree that intentionally hiring an inferior candidate on purpose just to not have someone more competent than you in the org would be not putting the organization first. He didnt do that. Instead of applauding him for hiring a proven OC, you instead fabricate a wild theory.

You made up every bit of it. you have zero evidenced to substantiate it, and that would all be fine if you posed it as a question or a or possible wild hypothesis. But you didnt - you called it undeniable, and you continue to berate me for noting the obvious - it’s not known fact at all. Lol

Oh, you’re connecting dots. Stay on it, Sherlock! Check the pizza restaurant!