Post Draft Discussion

[Formula 21]

From PFF
LOS ANGELES CHARGERS


Round 1 (6): QB Justin Herbert, Oregon
Round 1 (23): LB Kenneth Murray, Oklahoma
Round 4 (112): RB Joshua Kelley, UCLA
Round 5 (151): WR Joe Reed, Virginia
Round 6 (186): S Alohi Gilman, Notre Dame
Round 7 (220): WR KJ Hill, Ohio State

Day 1: Justin Herbert has all the arm talent in the world, but the mental aspects of the quarterback position still look like a work in progress. The “off” games against top competition are scary. He has shown elite play in the past, but it’s worth questioning why he didn’t take many steps forward after his sophomore season.

“Justin Herbert is not it. That is not solving your problems… I can’t get on board with this draft strategy whatsoever.” — PFF’s Mike Renner

The Chargers traded picks No. 37 and 71 to the Patriots for pick No. 23 and the opportunity to draft former Oklahoma off-ball linebacker Kenneth Murray. His success at the next level is going to rely heavily on usage. He's not Mr. Do-it-all. He's a hunter in the middle of the field who will limit YAC and make plays in the opposing backfield. LSU’s Patrick Queen was the better off-ball linebacker available at pick No. 23. Murray ranked fourth at off-ball linebacker and 62nd overall on PFF’s board. It will be difficult for Murray to offer more value than the two players who could have been picked at Nos. 37 and 71.

Day 2: As mentioned above, Los Angeles traded picks No. 37 and 71 to the Patriots for pick No. 23 and the opportunity to draft Murray.

Day 3: Hill could end up being one of the steals of the 2020 NFL Draft. The former Ohio State receiver is a forgettable athlete, but he is a technician with a great release package and a knack for creating separation against better athletes. He dominated the competition at the Senior Bowl in the one-on-ones despite seeing very few reps against press with the Buckeyes.

“The player comparison in the PFF Draft Guide for Hill is Cooper Kupp, and I like that comp. Hill isn’t going to be a game-changing top option for an NFL team, but that doesn’t mean he is without value. There are plenty of matchups to exploit and first downs to be had from the slot, and Hill has the skill set to step into that role and take advantage of them from Day 1.” — PFF’s Ben Linsey


Draft Grade: C-

[Formula 21]

Denver Broncos








Draft picks: Alabama WR Jerry Jeudy (No. 15 overall), Penn State WR KJ Hamler(No. 46), Iowa CB Michael Ojemudia (No. 77), LSU C Lloyd Cushenberry (No. 83), Arkansas DT McTelvin Agim (No. 95), Missouri TE Albert Okwuegbunam (No. 118), Wake Forest LB Justin Strnad (No. 178), Fresno State OG Netane Muti (No. 181), Florida WR Tyrie Cleveland (No. 252), North Dakota State LB Derrek Tuszka (No. 254)
Day 1 grade: A
Day 2 grade: A
Day 3 grade: A-
Overall grade: A
Draft analysis: I figured the Broncos would hammer the receiver position -- getting Jeudy and Hamler will cause headaches for opposing defense. The team then found help at center, cornerback and the defensive line on Day 2. The Broncos must have figured Okwuegbunam was too good of an athlete to ignore in the fourth round, and it's tough to argue with them, despite his inconsistency on the field. Strnad would have been picked in the top 120 overall if not for an injury that cost him the majority of his senior season. Muti plays like a second-rounder but injuries have kept him to a handful of games in recent years -- he was a very worthwhile pick in the sixth round. Tuszka was a value edge rusher pick late in the seventh round.

Kansas City Chiefs

Draft picks: LSU RB Clyde Edwards-Helaire, Mississippi State LB Willie Gay (No. 63), TCU OT Lucas Niang (No. 96), Louisiana Tech S L'Jarius Sneed (No. 138), Michigan DE Michael Danna (No. 177), Tulane CB Thakarius Keyes (No. 237)
Day 1 grade: A-
Day 2 grade: B
Day 3 grade: B
Overall grade: B+
Draft analysis: Coach Andy Reid found his all-purpose back in the first round (Edwards-Helaire), then took a chance on a couple of talented players with character (Gay) and/or injury (Niang) issues with great upsides on Friday night. Sneed is an outside corner who played safety as a senior to help his team. Not too surprised to see the Chiefs add Danna on Day 3 since they already have another former Wolverine (and similarly built edge rusher) in Frank Clark on the roster. Kansas City should be able to find interior offensive linemen to provide depth after the draft.


Las Vegas Raiders


Draft picks: Alabama WR Henry Ruggs (No. 12 overall), Ohio State CB Damon Arnette (No. 19), Kentucky RB Lynn Bowden (No. 80), South Carolina WR Bryan Edwards (No. 81), Clemson LB Tanner Muse (No. 100), Clemson OG John Simpson(No. 109), Louisiana Tech CB Amik Robertson (No. 139)
Day 1 grade: C-
Day 2 grade: A
Day 3 grade: A
Overall grade: B
Draft analysis: The Raiders spent three of their five premium picks on targets for quarterback Derek Carr (Ruggs III, Bowden, Edwards), and used the other two to improve the back seven (Arnette, Muse). Simpson offers power on the offensive line, though was inconsistent. I'm guessing we'll continue to see more of the quickness he put on display during Senior Bowl practices. Robertson is an outstanding football player who happens to be 5-foot-8 and coming off injury. He'll be a beast for the Raiders in the slot, and I wouldn't count him out at any other spot in the secondary.


Los Angeles Chargers


Draft picks: Oregon QB Justin Herbert (No. 6 overall), Oklahoma LB Kenneth Murray(No. 23), UCLA RB Joshua Kelley (No. 112), Virginia WR Joe Reed (No. 151), Notre Dame S Alohi Gilman (No. 186), Ohio State WR K.J. Hill (No. 220)
Day 1 grade: A
Day 2 grade: N/A
Day 3 grade: A
Overall grade: A
Draft analysis: The Chargers found leaders on offense (Herbert) and defense (Murray) in the first round, which should certainly please Bolts fans. Kelley's Senior Bowl performance made him an early fourth-round pick. Not because of his talent, but because he showed that his full explosiveness was back after playing through injury as a senior. Reed is known for his return work, and rightly so. But I think he'll be a nice No. 3 receiver as well. Gilman's a solid player who should become a good special teams contributor. Hill was such a strong performer for the Buckeyes, but lacks great athleticism; he could also serve as a solid No. 3 for L.A. It will be interesting to see how the Chargers further improve their offensive line after not investing a single pick up front

[Berserker76]

From PFF
LOS ANGELES CHARGERS


Round 1 (6): QB Justin Herbert, Oregon
Round 1 (23): LB Kenneth Murray, Oklahoma
Round 4 (112): RB Joshua Kelley, UCLA
Round 5 (151): WR Joe Reed, Virginia
Round 6 (186): S Alohi Gilman, Notre Dame
Round 7 (220): WR KJ Hill, Ohio State

Day 1: Justin Herbert has all the arm talent in the world, but the mental aspects of the quarterback position still look like a work in progress. The “off” games against top competition are scary. He has shown elite play in the past, but it’s worth questioning why he didn’t take many steps forward after his sophomore season.

“Justin Herbert is not it. That is not solving your problems… I can’t get on board with this draft strategy whatsoever.” — PFF’s Mike Renner

The Chargers traded picks No. 37 and 71 to the Patriots for pick No. 23 and the opportunity to draft former Oklahoma off-ball linebacker Kenneth Murray. His success at the next level is going to rely heavily on usage. He's not Mr. Do-it-all. He's a hunter in the middle of the field who will limit YAC and make plays in the opposing backfield. LSU’s Patrick Queen was the better off-ball linebacker available at pick No. 23. Murray ranked fourth at off-ball linebacker and 62nd overall on PFF’s board. It will be difficult for Murray to offer more value than the two players who could have been picked at Nos. 37 and 71.

Day 2: As mentioned above, Los Angeles traded picks No. 37 and 71 to the Patriots for pick No. 23 and the opportunity to draft Murray.

Day 3: Hill could end up being one of the steals of the 2020 NFL Draft. The former Ohio State receiver is a forgettable athlete, but he is a technician with a great release package and a knack for creating separation against better athletes. He dominated the competition at the Senior Bowl in the one-on-ones despite seeing very few reps against press with the Buckeyes.

“The player comparison in the PFF Draft Guide for Hill is Cooper Kupp, and I like that comp. Hill isn’t going to be a game-changing top option for an NFL team, but that doesn’t mean he is without value. There are plenty of matchups to exploit and first downs to be had from the slot, and Hill has the skill set to step into that role and take advantage of them from Day 1.” — PFF’s Ben Linsey


Draft Grade: C-

Mike and Ben will be eating crow come the end of the season. Just sayin...

[mecho]

Round 1 (6): QB Justin Herbert, Oregon
Round 1 (23): LB Kenneth Murray, Oklahoma
Round 4 (112): RB Joshua Kelley, UCLA
Round 5 (151): WR Joe Reed, Virginia
Round 6 (186): S Alohi Gilman, Notre Dame
Round 7 (220): WR KJ Hill, Ohio State

B+ from me for Chargers draft (I don't include UDFA's in my analysis).

Day 1

Herbert may be disappointing for some but, i don't mind him and we needed a future QB hopefully he proves his doubters wrong and goes onto by a solid qb after some work on his fundamentals.
Murray is a nice pickup also and fills another need at linebacker. We could have drafted two players but, i think his talent and impact will justify the low trade cost we paid for him.

Day 3

Outside of the somewhat head scratcher in the 6th round i can only assume it was because of his stellar special teams play to cover our recent losses on special teams. Really solid group of pickups. Kelley gives us the thumper we have long desired as chargers fans, and unlike Melvin Gordon he will get those third and ones and fight for yards after contact. Reed gives us a kickoff gunner and nice receiver. KJ Hill will quite possibly be our third receiver, solid route runner, sells the double move really well, and more than able to hold onto those contested catches.

So in terms of filling our needs, we have running back sorted now. We also have hedging on our receivers as it is likely one of Keenan Allen or Mike Williams will not return after next season. Linebacker is now somewhat addressed and also we have our future quarterback.

That leaves us with two main positions of need which are Offensive Tackle and Cornerback. I believe we will probably deal with these next off season. There is also the potential need of edge rusher next season and possibly TE depending on how Henry and those already on the depth chart fair. Final thoughts are a reasonably solid draft by Telesco.

[like54ninjas]

Round 1 (6): QB Justin Herbert, Oregon
Round 1 (23): LB Kenneth Murray, Oklahoma
Round 4 (112): RB Joshua Kelley, UCLA
Round 5 (151): WR Joe Reed, Virginia
Round 6 (186): S Alohi Gilman, Notre Dame
Round 7 (220): WR KJ Hill, Ohio State

B+ from me for Chargers draft (I don't include UDFA's in my analysis).

Day 1

Herbert may be disappointing for some but, i don't mind him and we needed a future QB hopefully he proves his doubters wrong and goes onto by a solid qb after some work on his fundamentals.
Murray is a nice pickup also and fills another need at linebacker. We could have drafted two players but, i think his talent and impact will justify the low trade cost we paid for him.

Day 3

Outside of the somewhat head scratcher in the 6th round i can only assume it was because of his stellar special teams play to cover our recent losses on special teams. Really solid group of pickups. Kelley gives us the thumper we have long desired as chargers fans, and unlike Melvin Gordon he will get those third and ones and fight for yards after contact. Reed gives us a kickoff gunner and nice receiver. KJ Hill will quite possibly be our third receiver, solid route runner, sells the double move really well, and more than able to hold onto those contested catches.

So in terms of filling our needs, we have running back sorted now. We also have hedging on our receivers as it is likely one of Keenan Allen or Mike Williams will not return after next season. Linebacker is now somewhat addressed and also we have our future quarterback.

That leaves us with two main positions of need which are Offensive Tackle and Cornerback. I believe we will probably deal with these next off season. There is also the potential need of edge rusher next season and possibly TE depending on how Henry and those already on the depth chart fair. Final thoughts are a reasonably solid draft by Telesco.

Good, solid, fair, and astute draft breakdown.

[wu-dai clan]

We play Cover 3 what is it, 60-70% of the time. CB play is not as prioritized as one might expect. Cover 3 is notorious for having holes over the middle.

Alohi was specifically mentioned as someone who reminds AL of Adrian Phillips. Him and Teamer may end up pushing King back to Slot for snaps, and Harris to Boundary, in spite of promises. Snaps are snaps.

OLT. With regards to the 2020 draft and going forward, it was our short term fate that a franchise QB was there, and needed to be prioritized over the big four OTs. Plus, Trencher favorite Andrew Thomas was gone.

Jim Lachey. Before Lachey, long, long ago, there was James FitzPatrick a round 1 bust OT. I remember how pissed I was when Chargers GM Steve Ortmayer, "Ort the Raider," traded Jim Lachey to the Raiders for bust OT John Clay and Napoleon McCallum. Lachey was pretty good, and did ok as a Raider and Redskin.

Long term, Lachey would have been stabilizing for the Chargers, as were, say, Russ Washington and Ed White and Roman Oben and King Dunlap, and a couple more Olinemen, over the years.

It is all so serendipitous. Even DJ Fluker performed ok at OLT for exactly one game. Lane Johnson. Ryan Ramczyk. Ronnie Stanley. I will never give up.

My guess of the day is that Bulaga is stabilizing, meaning he is another particular addition, who takes us from inadequate to functional.

My next guess is that Lamp over Tevi & Pipkins at OLT will be our outcome. With the other 4 positions somewhat steady, we can chip and help over there.

Trenchers, consider historical context realistically, and know that TT, AL and Campen talked about all possible draft scenarios before decision time two days ago.

Sorry.

tl;dr.

[wu-dai clan]

A year ago Renner was talking up a storm about how perfect Tillery + Adderley was for us.

Now him and his PFF draft crew will have us believe that Drew Lock is a superior plan to Justin Herbert, or that the Raiders are not greatly improved, or that KC will be improved by adding a great CEH.

Keep throwing the superlatives around, Mike, with your stats n film study. Do you really understand football ?

PFF. Subscribe. Must read. But always with a grain of salt. The danger of over reliance on analytics.

[WindsorUK]

Interesting how just about every team gets an A or B for their drafts, nearly every year. Kind of a silly practice in absurdity really.
Every team has needs going into the draft. I guess the more players chosen that fill those needs, the higher the grade. Unfortunately, as we are well aware, just because a guy lines up behind the center, doesn't make him a good quarterback.
As has been mentioned by others, only time will tell. 3 years does seem a good reference.
Maybe someone can start a thread on TT's previous drafts? I can't imagine there'll be much football to talk about over the next few months, could give us a good topic to discuss and debate.

[mecho]

Good, solid, fair, and astute draft breakdown.

Thanks Ninja that's kinda what I was going for haha.

[Chargers33]

After all said and done I land at B+. Was A- but not sure on the 6th round s******** unless special teams are worth that pick entirely. Nothing of note on the OL which is interesting, maybe Lamp is finally healthy, also think we may look around for a vet to add. I do think TT did some solid work in the 4th, 5th and 7th rounds for sure!!

At the end of the day this draft class score will be determined by how Herbert does. If we got our future QB without mortgaging the future it will be an A, if he does not pan out the grade will be a bad one for sure...

[Lone Bolt]

I agree with some that you can't grade a draft like this...it will be years before we have a true evaluation...but I can offer a grade with my satisfaction level.

A-.

-We are picking #6, hopefully won't be again for a long time, so if there is a worthy QB, you should take him, and we did. My grade also reflects that I am a fan, to be fair.

-Kenneth "Meat" Murray is a beast. Fits the mold of the modern inside LB with speed and range to cover...but enough thump to remind you of some old school dudes...and the blitzing! Him and James...I can hardly wait. One more thing...I almost forgot...we got the 5th year option on this guy!! Another mitigating factor in giving up that #71.

-Kelley was the missing piece for our committee of RBs...I liked a few other prospects a bit better, but he will do nicely...and I was a bit surprised by his power AND speed.

-Reed was a nice pick. I wanted Duvernay, but this kid was a nice consolation prize, and may well be a better returner, which we sorely need, along with his speed.

-Alohi Gilman...I hate these picks, like I hate the greens that come with your Steak and Taters, but your body needs the greens...and the team needs these kinda guys for depth and special teams.

-The cherry on top. KJ Hill. I believe it was BoltJolt who compared him to Wes Welker...physically, not exactly, but role wise? Spot on. Watched some film last night...route running and savy gets him seperation...just has a feel for how to get open...and catches the ball nicely. Catch radius? He isn't gonna be going for 50/50 balls...that's Williams job. Great add, and value wise, easily our biggest steal this draft.

One more thing. I said shortly before the draft that I was very open minded about which direction that we went, and that I wasn't so much worried about who we picked, but that TT and Lynn had a plan, and that they successfully implemented it and got their guys. Listening to Lynn talk about the first 2 picks...I would say that is exactly what happened. Bravo.

Edit: About the oline...I was disappointed we passed on some of the guys I liked...but Campen just got here. They may be doing 2 things...

1. Letting Campen see what he can get out of the youngins we already payed for
2. We may yet add a vet LT in FA, while Campen works and evals Pipkens/Tevi

[wu-dai clan]

I agree with some that you can't grade a draft like this...it will be years before we have a true evaluation...but I can offer a grade with my satisfaction level.

A-. A. Think in terms of big picture, where we are and team building.

-We are picking #6, hopefully won't be again for a long time, so if there is a worthy QB, you should take him, and we did. My grade also reflects that I am a fan, to be fair. Eye grade on an unfair curve.

-Kenneth "Meat" Murray is a beast. Fits the mold of the modern inside LB with speed and range to cover...but enough thump to remind you of some old school dudes...and the blitzing! Him and James...I can hardly wait. One more thing...I almost forgot...we got the 5th year option on this guy!! Another mitigating factor in giving up that #71. It is also #23 vs #37. :biggrin:

-Kelley was the missing piece for our committee of RBs...I liked a few other prospects a bit better, but he will do nicely...and I was a bit surprised by his power AND speed. I am shocked at Kelley's receiving skills. All these dudes are Steady Freddies, with good hands. We will combat the AFCW etc with ball control

-Reed was a nice pick. I wanted Duvernay, but this kid was a nice consolation prize, and may well be a better returner, which we sorely need, along with his speed. Great versatility and athleticism. ninja special.

-Alohi Gilman...I hate these picks, like I hate the greens that come with your Steak and Taters, but your body needs the greens...and the team needs these kinda guys for depth and special teams. This isn't Sling Blade. Creamed spinach and mushrooms with steak. Hold my taters. Also AL says Alohi is Adrian Phillips and this explains the DB situation.

-The cherry on top. KJ Hill. I believe it was BoltJolt who compared him to Wes Welker...physically, not exactly, but role wise? Spot on. Watched some film last night...route running and savy gets him seperation...just has a feel for how to get open...and catches the ball nicely. Catch radius? He isn't gonna be going for 50/50 balls...that's Williams job. Great add, and value wise, easily our biggest steal this draft. Thievery. TT showing his kids the thug life. KJ you are awesome. Lucky to have you. This round 7 shit was only because of the generational talent @ WR in the '20 Draft.

One more thing. I said shortly before the draft that I was very open minded about which direction that we went, and that I wasn't so much worried about who we picked, but that TT and Lynn had a plan, and that they successfully implemented it and got their guys. Listening to Lynn talk about the first 2 picks...I would say that is exactly what happened. Bravo.
Leadership. From the WILL position. And Herbert will learn fast too.

Edit: About the oline...I was disappointed we passed on some of the guys I liked...but Campen just got here. They may be doing 2 things...

1. Letting Campen see what he can get out of the youngins we already payed for
2. We may yet add a vet LT in FA, while Campen works and evals Pipkens/Tevi
3. Campen: "Got all we need."

Corrections in gold. j/k. Enjoyed doin' the draft witchya LB ! And Jolt ! And ninja ! And everyone !

GREAT POST Lone Bolt.