2020 Draft Prospect Discussion

[Bolt4Knob]

I just don't think that LB's have as big an impact on the game as OT's. To predict that Simmons will be a bigger gift than James (82.5 pff) is a big order.

Even with his sophomore slump, Kyzir White had a pff score of 66.6. And Drue Tranquil scored a 66.6 as well. These are not great pff scores (I prefer 70+ scores) but much better than the OL scores: Pipkins (63.3), Lamp (59.3), Feeney (51.7), Pouncey (58.2), Quessenberry (58.4).

I think the upgrade at 1-tech with Joseph (71.2) from Mebane (48.7) will help several players. I think Joseph will demand more double teams. That will give Tillery (34.0) more one-on-one opportunities. I think that will better protect White, Tranquil, and Perryman at the 2nd level.

I understand everyone's fascination with Simmons athleticism, but I believe people are over-estimating a LB's impact when chosen that high. Here a list of highly drafted LB's from recent drafts: Devin White (#5 in 2019), Roquan Smith (#8 in 2018). Most of the high pick LB's are pass rushers, too (usually 3-4 systems). I believe we find a solid LB in the 2nd thru 4th round.

All true about linebackers as rookies and maybe this draft has some depth there.

Hence, why the idea of moving from 6 to 9 (maybe the Jags want to restart the rebuild if Tua is there) - allows the Chargers to still get OT but also more picks. Today though, if staying at 6 - my preference is; Simmons, OT, Brown, QB.

[Boltnut]

All true about linebackers as rookies and maybe this draft has some depth there.

Hence, why the idea of moving from 6 to 9 (maybe the Jags want to restart the rebuild if Tua is there) - allows the Chargers to still get OT but also more picks. Today though, if staying at 6 - my preference is; Simmons, OT, Brown, QB.

It all depends upon what happens in front of us. I suspect the Giants will be picking an OT @#4. Now you're down to 3 OT's worthy of #6-9 (let's assume MIA is going QB rather than a needed OT). Panthers and Cardinals sit @ #7 and @8. Both of those teams could pick OT's. Panthers could ignite a bidding war for the #7 pick with Browns (#10) and Jets (#11)... all of whom need an OT. Hell, even Jaguars could grab an OT (Minschew = 70.3 vs Cam Robinson = 54.8).

If I'm brave enough to move back, #9 is the farthest I'd go. A lot has to do with teams in front of us and behind us. Also depends on whether teams see the BIG 4 as both RT and LT prospects. It's risky. That's all I'm saying. The extra 3rd rounder would be nice. But, what if you really like one (Thomas) over the others...? I just might stay and pick Thomas @#6.

[beachcomber]

we don't have a need, we have desire @WIL.... we have four of 'em…. Drue, Vigil, Kyzir and Malik Jefferson, and most of those guys have or can play @least one of the other LB designations.

and guessin' that two of the four OTs will be off the board @6, as don't think Miami is going QB either.... hopefully Wills is one of the two off the board.... if Thomas is the other OT off the board, am obviously ok w/Wirfs, and as.... however much eye like him, think it would be a mistake to pass on an OT for WR, or any other position for that matter.

will repeat.... Tristan hedges our bets short term at three positions in question on the Oline…. LG, RT, LT, and long-term he gives us options @every position save for the OC.

or as I like to say.... you don't frost a burnt cake.

we can keep drafting frosting in the form of your fave wunderkid LB/S or the next great Chargers receiver, or.... we can get our chit together/take care of our biz and build the darn !ines.

….(every darn round

[chargerkdb]

Hurts and Tua are not faintly close, talent wise. There is a reason Hurts transferred and it's because he realized he wouldn't come close to sniffing the field as long as Tua was there. I would probably pass on Tua because of the injury fear but he might have challenged Burrow for the #1 pick if he hadn't gotten hurt. He did, so that has to be a huge factor but his ceiling, IF healthy, is way higher than Hurts.

Way better? No. We will have to agree to disagree on that. I watched them both and it was a coin flip whether to start Tua or Hurts. After Tua came in and bailed Bama out against GA he was a media darling. Positive press helps recruiting. When all else equal go with what’s best for the program. The fact that Tua’s younger brother was a potential recruit made it a little easier. Hurts was a good soldier. A good portion of Bama fans still believe they kept the wrong one.

[Charge!]

Much more informative than highlight films:


QB’s with average physical talent but have “it” mentally, which makes them consistently elite and why they will be great NFL QB’s:
(these 2 did this playing against the very best defenses in college football)

Tua:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58G7IQFzlQI

Burrow:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Dj7WuwwosM

OR...?



QB’s with great physical talent but are missing “it” mentally, which means they are consistently not elite and won’t be great NFL QB’s:
(they did this playing against average/weak competition)

Love:
(most likely a bust...even his seemingly great plays were result of bad decisions and just great athleticism)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOG1qvCbqsc

Hebert:
(Bust written all over him....been the same for 4 years so he is not changing)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Qj_TIx1FuA

If I were GM of Chargers I would do anything I can to acquire Burrow or Tua..... especially Tua who would be a perfect fit for they type of team that Chargers are trying to build.

If Teams refuse to trade or if CIN and WASH grab both of them or we get outbid, then so be it, then we have to forget about QB because there are zero great ones left and we instead should draft BPA..... such as Simmons, Brown, Okudah, or the best OT..... please don't waste a first round pick on a bust like Hebert or love..... Those kind of busts mean organization will wait 4+ years to realize they are busts so we can start looking for a great QB again..... by then the rest of team will also need a rebuild.....

[Boltjolt]

we don't have a need, we have desire @WIL.... we have four of 'em…. Drue, Vigil, Kyzir and Malik Jefferson, and most of those guys have or can play @least one of the other LB designations.

and guessin' that two of the four OTs will be off the board @6, as don't think Miami is going QB either.... hopefully Wills is one of the two off the board.... if Thomas is the other OT off the board, am obviously ok w/Wirfs, and as.... however much eye like him, think it would be a mistake to pass on an OT for WR, or any other position for that matter.

will repeat.... Tristan hedges our bets short term at three positions in question on the Oline…. LG, RT, LT, and long-term he gives us options @every position save for the OC.

or as I like to say.... you don't frost a burnt cake.

we can keep drafting frosting in the form of your fave wunderkid LB/S or the next great Chargers receiver, or.... we can get our chit together/take care of our biz and build the darn !ines.

….(every darn round

Can say the same thing about DT. Desire, not a need.

Of course you can say Brown might be better than all the ones we have except for Linval and I can say the same thing about Simmons and our LBs.....though I don't see him playing LB full time and will move around. And he will certainly be a huge upgrade to where Adrian Phillips played.

[blueman]

Way better? No. We will have to agree to disagree on that. I watched them both and it was a coin flip whether to start Tua or Hurts. After Tua came in and bailed Bama out against GA he was a media darling. Positive press helps recruiting. When all else equal go with what’s best for the program. The fact that Tua’s younger brother was a potential recruit made it a little easier. Hurts was a good soldier. A good portion of Bama fans still believe they kept the wrong one.

Never thought Tua and Hurts are interchangeable. Tua reminds me of a running QB, similar to Jackson: good arm, can scramble and make people miss when he takes off. Hurts has a very nice arm, some good touch there and over 4 years in college has shown he can develop as a passer. But when he runs, I don’t see a QB scrambling, I see a fucking tailback. What, 20 TDs on the ground last year, and another 32 with only 8 INTs, all that behind an average to way below average Oline? He’s the anti-Tua, gets hit a ton by guys who will have jobs in the NFL and bounces up and runs the next play. 4 years of it. Yeah, I’ll take 50+ TDs from a second round pick, make me write bad checks lol.

[like54ninjas]

I just don't think that LB's have as big an impact on the game as OT's. To predict that Simmons will be a bigger gift than James (82.5 pff) is a big order.

Even with his sophomore slump, Kyzir White had a pff score of 66.6. And Drue Tranquil scored a 66.6 as well. These are not great pff scores (I prefer 70+ scores) but much better than the OL scores: Pipkins (63.3), Lamp (59.3), Feeney (51.7), Pouncey (58.2), Quessenberry (58.4).

I think the upgrade at 1-tech with Joseph (71.2) from Mebane (48.7) will help several players. I think Joseph will demand more double teams. That will give Tillery (34.0) more one-on-one opportunities. I think that will better protect White, Tranquil, and Perryman at the 2nd level.

I understand everyone's fascination with Simmons athleticism, but I believe people are over-estimating a LB's impact when chosen that high. Here a list of highly drafted LB's from recent drafts: Devin White (#5 in 2019), Roquan Smith (#8 in 2018). Most of the high pick LB's are pass rushers, too (usually 3-4 systems). I believe we find a solid LB in the 2nd thru 4th round.

I concur with all you said. Simmons, however, is a higher rated prospect than either Smith or White. Andrew Thomas is a great fit as well. Simmons is my choice but if Thomas I’m still very happy.

Is Pip’s grade, a DII guy, that far off those power 5 guys. Not too shabby for his rook season in limited snaps.

[RageTheory]

Say none of the top OTs nor Derrick Brown have been taken by 1.6 (in this scenario Okudah, Simmons, and likely Tua or Herbert are taken).
At this point, I say you have a goldmine..at least five of the next seven badly need a stud DT (for three; CAR, CLE, and SF; it is their biggest need). CAR will likely not give up much, but should be easy to get either CLE or SF to throw in their 2nd to swap.

[like54ninjas]

we don't have a need, we have desire @WIL.... we have four of 'em…. Drue, Vigil, Kyzir and Malik Jefferson, and most of those guys have or can play @least one of the other LB designations.

and guessin' that two of the four OTs will be off the board @6, as don't think Miami is going QB either.... hopefully Wills is one of the two off the board.... if Thomas is the other OT off the board, am obviously ok w/Wirfs, and as.... however much eye like him, think it would be a mistake to pass on an OT for WR, or any other position for that matter.

will repeat.... Tristan hedges our bets short term at three positions in question on the Oline…. LG, RT, LT, and long-term he gives us options @every position save for the OC.

or as I like to say.... you don't frost a burnt cake.

we can keep drafting frosting in the form of your fave wunderkid LB/S or the next great Chargers receiver, or.... we can get our chit together/take care of our biz and build the darn !ines.

….(every darn round

Why do you put Kyzir or Malik at WILL? Is that their position or is Kyzir our SAM and Malik is a practice squad guy the organization thinks of as a developmental MIKE?

[like54ninjas]

Much more informative than highlight films:


QB’s with average physical talent but have “it” mentally, which makes them consistently elite and why they will be great NFL QB’s:
(these 2 did this playing against the very best defenses in college football)

Tua:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58G7IQFzlQI

Burrow:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Dj7WuwwosM

OR...?



QB’s with great physical talent but are missing “it” mentally, which means they are consistently not elite and won’t be great NFL QB’s:
(they did this playing against average/weak competition)

Love:
(most likely a bust...even his seemingly great plays were result of bad decisions and just great athleticism)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOG1qvCbqsc

Hebert:
(Bust written all over him....been the same for 4 years so he is not changing)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Qj_TIx1FuA

If I were GM of Chargers I would do anything I can to acquire Burrow or Tua..... especially Tua who would be a perfect fit for they type of team that Chargers are trying to build.

If Teams refuse to trade or if CIN and WASH grab both of them or we get outbid, then so be it, then we have to forget about QB because there are zero great ones left and we instead should draft BPA..... such as Simmons, Brown, Okudah, or the best OT..... please don't waste a first round pick on a bust like Hebert or love..... Those kind of busts mean organization will wait 4+ years to realize they are busts so we can start looking for a great QB again..... by then the rest of team will also need a rebuild.....

Fantastic knowing your are not!

[Boltjolt]

Never thought Tua and Hurts are interchangeable. Tua reminds me of a running QB, similar to Jackson: good arm, can scramble and make people miss when he takes off. Hurts has a very nice arm, some good touch there and over 4 years in college has shown he can develop as a passer. But when he runs, I don’t see a QB scrambling, I see a fucking tailback. What, 20 TDs on the ground last year, and another 32 with only 8 INTs, all that behind an average to way below average Oline? He’s the anti-Tua, gets hit a ton by guys who will have jobs in the NFL and bounces up and runs the next play. 4 years of it. Yeah, I’ll take 50+ TDs from a second round pick, make me write bad checks lol.

Oh no,......that isn't Tua. He isn't a running QB, but rather a QB that could run but I don't advise that now lol.
He never was close to a Lamar type runner.

You must have him confused with Hurts