Chargers Defensive Coordinator Renaldo Hill

[wu-dai clan]

Awesome Steve.
Bullshit.
Stiffy.
This is football.
None of that candy-assed nonsense.
But isn't Staley's PREFERRED at least defense this 3-4 we saw with LAR ?
Bosa can lean up or put on 10 lbs
and move around.
Joey gonna love it.
SDE. PRS. 3TECH. 4i. 4TECH. Wide 9.
I would think all of that but no 1TECH or 5TECH or Rush LB.

[21&500]

The key personnel are at the bottom of the screen, John Johnson III (43) and Taylor Rapp (24). They must read and wrap up. Rayshawn can only give us a little of that. Nasir Adderley can give us none of that. He is a gusD Single High player. Move him to Nickel. He can jump routes like crazy, with short area explosive tackling.

At least we have Derwin James, but he should often be at STAR, closer to the LOS or ala Kenny Young (41) although Drue Tranquill can really help there. Kenneth Murray is our Micah Kiser (59).

Joey Bosa is our Aaron Donald (99). Linval Joseph is much more than our Sebastian Joseph-Day (69). We need a Michael Brockers (90), as it is doubtful JustinJones/ Jerry Tillery can give us what we need there long term. They are gusD 3TECHs. I need more anchor. I need more cowbell.

Now the EDGE. Strong side. SOLB. Leonard Floyd's (54) skinny ass is replaced by Nwosu. Set the EDGE, blitz, Zone coverage.

Weak side WOLB. Kyzir White/Emeke Egbule are our Justin Hollins (58). Run and chase. Blitz. Set. Zone/MAN on TEs.

In Staley concepts, there is nothing fancy required on the EDGE. Know your role. Production comes from assignment football and disguised blitzing.

Michael Davis is our poor man's version of Jalen Ramsey. I hope we retain him. Hey there is upside and this did not involve coughing up a bunch of round 1's.

Casey Hayward/Chris Harris/Nasir Adderley (maybe) equals Troy Hill Darious Williams. They have to read, tackle, jump routes, all kinds of good stuff that vets can do. There is disguised Two High help, instead of Nasir flying around, expected to do too much.

PON (high needs) 4i and versatile DB/Safety type. Go get some OL and weapons. Maybe score defensive depth with value picks. That's all folks. tl;dr. Tweak it to your heart's desire.

Great stuff Wood
Could/would JJ Watt play that 4i?
it looks like we have most of the personnel that can mimic the Rams first place D with minimal offseason investments
if not, why would we need a defensive genius?

[Topcat]

Again, Bullshit.

Historically, 43 teams are much better at rushing the QB. A few 34 teams have been able to overcome the natural schematic disadvantages that are part of the 34, but that is the exception rather than the rule. You bring 5 man pressures in the 43 by rushing a SAM or WILL LB off the edge like they were an edge player. Again, in our current scheme, align the OTTO over the TE or the OT
, and simply rush 5. As far as zone dogs, (and traditional dogs and stunts), what is stopping a regular 43 team from doing any of that? I would point back to the host of 43 teams who have run bltizing schemes. There is nothing stopping anyone from doing any of that.

Gus didn't do that because that is not his philosophy. However, that doesn't mean that even that SCHEME can't do it. The year the 49ers beat us in the SB, the 49ers used our scheme and guy named Lee Woodall, a SS sized wide 9 OLB for the 49ers had a big impact on a few well timed blitzes in the end of the season and playoffs that year.

34 teams are historically better at being able to disguise their rushes, but what that may work for a bit, once there is enough film on teams to pick it up, it comes down to how well they can get guys in position to CONSISTENTLY rush the QB.

IF you go back and WATCH the RAMS this season, one thing that shows up is they are NOT a great pass rushing team. They get a lot of sacks off of pass coverage. They are not a bad rush team, but many of Floyd and Donalds sacks are simply due to QB not being able to go to their 1st or 2nd reads. The QB holds the ball, going through the progression and the Rams, are covering EVERYONE on O, so that the QB either has to dump it off to his outlet (quickly), throw it away or take the sack.

Again, there is no coverage or front that a team can put in their 34 alignment that a 43 team cannot. I don't doubt that we will be playing something CALLED a 34 next year, but again if you CALLED Ingram an OLB instead of a DE, like many teams that have played EXACTLY the same scheme have done before, then we were 34 team last season. As pointed before, we won't really be either a 43 or 34 team, as Staley was playing his base set something like 12-16% of the time (I keep seeing different numbers), so does that even matter? Most of his alignments are common to both the 34 and 43, so you are simply hung up on semantics.

And looking at Bosa skill set, I don't see him as the next Donald, but on the next Floyd. Bosa does have some ability to line up inside and to rush as a zero or 3 technique player, but he lacks the stunning quickness inside that Donald has. However, Bosa has more long speed and is better in space than Donald, who did spend a lot more time rushing as one of their wide 5, 7 and 9 technique players this season.

As far as getting the stiffy over the double Eagle front, I don't get it.

The double Eagle was a big deal for the Rams, but let's remember that EVERY D in the NFL uses it, and has used it more or less since the 1950's. There is nothing new there. It was big part of Bradley D back in Seattle, and it is a alignment that we have been using the entire time that Bradley was our DC. Pagano, Manusky, Wade Phillips, .... go back as far as you want, Bill Arnsparger .... have all used single and double Eagle fronts for our D.

As someone else in this, or another thread pointed out that we really need to get better nickel, dime and other specialty package guys ... which is interesting to note, since we played our best D under Gus in our dime package ... until we were unable to do it because of injuries the last 2 season. We have LB who are developing and are not very accomplished, but LB are role players in today's NFL. We need more guys like Derwin James, Adrian Phillips and Reshawn Jenkins going forward in our D.

That makes me think Staley wants a couple of solid cover corners out of the draft and/or FA...

[wu-dai clan]

Great stuff Wood
Could/would JJ Watt play that 4i?
it looks like we have most of the personnel that can mimic the Rams first place D with minimal offseason investments
if not, why would we need a defensive genius?

Yes. It is easy to picture Watt at 4i. The cost would be a factor.

LAR spent hugely on Donald and Ramsey. The rest of their D is moderately priced.

[Heatmiser]

I think a heady player like Adrian Philips would thrive in the Staley defense. From the little bit of cut ups I watched, the safeties are super important to the overall defense's success and it is not the pure physical skills they are looking for but rather the ability to properly read and execute. I saw a few examples where Johnson single handedly took away multiple options via diagnosing, disguising and reacting. I don't know we have a safety like that on the roster? James is a physical phenom but he has missed so much time, can he do the mental processing yet?

And Steve is right about the pass rush/pressure. Even with Donald and Brockers (out a lot) and the pretty solid complimentary players, the Rams did not have a fearsome or dominant pass rush most of the time. The Packers game is a very recent example of that but there were plenty of others, too.

TG

[ghost]

There's plenty for you to disagree with.

But here's my working model,
and my current view of what Staley is all about.

We will likely mostly be Hybrid,
based on accommodating existing personnel.

I loved this take, bro. Agree completely on the safeties. The safeties have to be competent and physical tacklers, first & foremost, in Vic's system. Rayshawn & Nasir ain't long for this franchise.

Predominate Cover Two play in 2021, and the players at S to play it.

[Steve]

I think a heady player like Adrian Philips would thrive in the Staley defense. From the little bit of cut ups I watched, the safeties are super important to the overall defense's success and it is not the pure physical skills they are looking for but rather the ability to properly read and execute. I saw a few examples where Johnson single handedly took away multiple options via diagnosing, disguising and reacting. I don't know we have a safety like that on the roster? James is a physical phenom but he has missed so much time, can he do the mental processing yet?

And Steve is right about the pass rush/pressure. Even with Donald and Brockers (out a lot) and the pretty solid complimentary players, the Rams did not have a fearsome or dominant pass rush most of the time. The Packers game is a very recent example of that but there were plenty of others, too.

TG

When you look at really domiant pass rush teams they can do some of both. Quick passing teams can get rid of the ball and neutralize ANY pass rush. You have to give your rushers a chance to get to the ball.

Last year, with players who have been successful rushers in the past, we got little accomplished. The coverage really sucked. A few years ago, we had a pretty good rush, but the coverage was much better. Many of the same players (outside rushers anyway).

The big thing will be how he uses Bosa. Bosa is NOT going to be plugged in EXACTLY like the RAMS did Donald. Both are great players who can line up inside and outside, but they are not even close to being similar players, although their size is similar (except for Bosa being a lot taller).

Donald is an inside quickness guy and Bosa is a outside technique and effort guy. Staley is probably looking at old film now in what he wants to do. We play a lot of 34 elements in our Gus Bradley/Pete Carroll/George Siefert D. Wade Phillips got a lot of mileage out of JJ Watt and Bruce Smith as 43 DE in the 34 D. Pagano played the Wade Phillips 34 and we got a lot out of Bosa in that scheme, so there is plenty for tape for Staley to find room to see how he can be used and evolve from there.

I think the big thing a guy like Staley brings is not the scheme. As I keep pointing out, everything has been done before. There are only so many combinations and permutations you can do, and those were all used up long ago. Staley can go dust some old things off, and mix and match some, but even a lot of that had all been done before.

It is how does a coach package the players and make a scheme that works to gets strengths. It is easy to use a 43 DE in a 34 D, but how do you keep getting the best out of the other 10 guys on D. The Rams had a lot of guys who were good, not necessarily great guys all having big (career) years at the same time. That is where I see Staley's strength.

However, a smart guy like Staley can probably reshuffle the deck and come up with a new packages with elements that fit different guys. He will have to, he can't just steal the Rams D personnel.

[Steve]

Yes. It is easy to picture Watt at 4i. The cost would be a factor.

LAR spent hugely on Donald and Ramsey. The rest of their D is moderately priced.

Why would we spend a huge amount of money on Watt to line up and be an inside player when the vast majority of his career he has been used as an edge rusher?

Can he play a 3 tech (most double eagle teams play two 3 techs) or 4i tech? Yes. So can Bosa. But is that really getting the best out of either?

I would imagine that we are likely to see a lot more single eagle (only 1 player in the 3 or 4i alignment) with Bosa lining up wide (wide 5 or 7). Bosa was very effective lining up like that as a rookie in Pagano's 34.

Maybe even see Bosa lining up as an OLB. I wouldn't think it is likely, but he is kinda a high energy guy and he runs faster than his 40 suggests with little wasted movement.

[gzubeck]

Why would we spend a huge amount of money on Watt to line up and be an inside player when the vast majority of his career he has been used as an edge rusher?

Can he play a 3 tech (most double eagle teams play two 3 techs) or 4i tech? Yes. So can Bosa. But is that really getting the best out of either?

I would imagine that we are likely to see a lot more single eagle (only 1 player in the 3 or 4i alignment) with Bosa lining up wide (wide 5 or 7). Bosa was very effective lining up like that as a rookie in Pagano's 34.

Maybe even see Bosa lining up as an OLB. I wouldn't think it is likely, but he is kinda a high energy guy and he runs faster than his 40 suggests with little wasted movement.

Define Huge...Some people think he can be had for $10 mil on a high probability team for playoffs and superbowl run. By getting a competent QB and Now a seemingly competent coach we are starting to attract players! This is a good thing!

:cheers:

[wu-dai clan]

Why would we spend a huge amount of money on Watt to line up and be an inside player when the vast majority of his career he has been used as an edge rusher?

Can he play a 3 tech (most double eagle teams play two 3 techs) or 4i tech? Yes. So can Bosa. But is that really getting the best out of either?

I would imagine that we are likely to see a lot more single eagle (only 1 player in the 3 or 4i alignment) with Bosa lining up wide (wide 5 or 7). Bosa was very effective lining up like that as a rookie in Pagano's 34.

Maybe even see Bosa lining up as an OLB. I wouldn't think it is likely, but he is kinda a high energy guy and he runs faster than his 40 suggests with little wasted movement.

Ok. Fine. 5TECH/7TECH for Joey. I am not crazy about OLB. My question for you (just an inquiry) is what skills would a 4i in single eagle have ? Would he be mostly an anchor ? I see Tillery and JJones as penetrating 1 gap 3TECHs almost exclusively.

The only 4i guys I am liking in this draft are Jay Tufele/Christian Barmore rd2, Bobby Brown rd 5 or Naquon Jones/ Kyree Campbell rd7.

It would be a good thing to give Kenneth Murray some clean looks.
Right on about Bosa.

[ghost]

PFB.jpg

[wu-dai clan]

Hella headline.