Welcome Andre Roberts WR/KR

[Guest]

Lol ...boy Chain is grasping for anything now.
Guyton has 18 targets, Keenan has 58, MW has 56, Cook had 33. I think there were better players in the board at 77 bit I don't agree with Chains assessment of Palmer.

For one thing it's way too early and not every WR balls out as a rookie. Going off Vincent Jackson's rookie season and MW, they were busts according to Chain.

Consider the source.

How are you not seeing the difference between Jackson and Palmer? Jackson was a much better athlete than Palmer is. He had bankable traits (superior size, good speed, big vertical). Palmer's big claim to fame is that he is a polished route runner, which means he is not going to improve as much in that area as others would. Does Palmer has a single bankable physical trait or skill? More coaching is not going to make him bigger, faster, quicker or jump higher.

Good WRs flash even as a rookie. There are at least glimpses regarding why the hell the player was drafted. IMO, Palmer has made a few decent plays, but he has not flashed even once on any single play. So, we have a problem. We only have 5 WRs and one is a rookie project and another is a special teams only guy.

I thought Palmer's ceiling was as a #3 WR, but, honestly, he is not even close to that level of play so far. His play warrants being waived to the practice squad, but we probably shined too bright of a light on him by drafting him in the third round and then talking him up to get him to the practice squad.

Regarding Guyton, I am aware of the number of targets and that is a fair point. But my point remains true that nobody is complaining about the drops by Allen, Williams and Cook, which are more than Guyton's total drops and therefore, should be more noticeable. Any drop by Guyton is magnified. Any drop by any other receiver is basically ignored.

[Boltjolt]

How are you not seeing the difference between Jackson and Palmer? Jackson was a much better athlete than Palmer is. He had bankable traits (superior size, good speed, big vertical). Palmer's big claim to fame is that he is a polished route runner, which means he is not going to improve as much in that area as others would. Does Palmer has a single bankable physical trait or skill? More coaching is not going to make him bigger, faster, quicker or jump higher.

Good WRs flash even as a rookie. There are at least glimpses regarding why the hell the player was drafted. IMO, Palmer has made a few decent plays, but he has not flashed even once on any single play. So, we have a problem. We only have 5 WRs and one is a rookie project and another is a special teams only guy.

I thought Palmer's ceiling was as a #3 WR, but, honestly, he is not even close to that level of play so far. His play warrants being waived to the practice squad, but we probably shined too bright of a light on him by drafting him in the third round and then talking him up to get him to the practice squad.

Regarding Guyton, I am aware of the number of targets and that is a fair point. But my point remains true that nobody is complaining about the drops by Allen, Williams and Cook, which are more than Guyton's total drops and therefore, should be more noticeable. Any drop by Guyton is magnified. Any drop by any other receiver is basically ignored.

Bro, for you to even mention Keenan, MW drops compared to Guyton is just....like WTF?
Stevie Wonder knows those guys have much better hands than Guyton.
Keenan is the fastest player to 600 catches. Yeah, we should be complaining! But a few have noted it isn't like him and it isn't like him.

We aren't complaining because we know what they are capable of. Guyton.....not so much. He is a poor man's #3. Had a TD drop this year and had the dropsies last year. He has been inconsistent.

[blueman]

Guyton, like Tbilly, is a guy you look to replace. Is what it is.

[Guest]

Bro, for you to even mention Keenan, MW drops compared to Guyton is just....like WTF?
Stevie Wonder knows those guys have much better hands than Guyton.
Keenan is the fastest player to 600 catches. Yeah, we should be complaining! But a few have noted it isn't like him and it isn't like him.

We aren't complaining because we know what they are capable of. Guyton.....not so much. He is a poor man's #3. Had a TD drop this year and had the dropsies last year. He has been inconsistent.

The point is that Allen, Williams and Cook all have had more drops this season than Guyton. I understand your point about drop percentage and that is a valid point.

However, Allen's drop percentage was higher than Guyton's until recently when Guyton scored his second drop and nobody really said anything about Allen's drops. Heck, Allen was second in the league in drops for several weeks and nobody really said anything.

The only person that most on this forum focus on in terms of drops is Guyton even though several players have more drops. There is an inconsistency there.

There is a huge lack of objectivity when comparing Palmer to Guyton demonstrated by most on this forum. Palmer has 6 catches for 58 yards. That is not better than 9 catches for 128 yards, which is what Guyton has even though the team has basically refused to make any designed deep passes to Guyton, which is his greatest strength. There is no meaningful comparison to be had and yet some actually want to increase Palmer's role when he has basically been a waste of a jersey so far.

If the team used Guyton properly like they did last year, I strongly suspect that his production would be leaps and bounds better than Palmer's near non-production. But hey, no wonder they cut Johnson--maybe they knew that we were going to deliberately avoid deep passes even though that was the best part of the offense last year.

[richpjr]

If the team used Guyton properly like they did last year, I strongly suspect that his production would be leaps and bounds better than Palmer's near non-production. But hey, no wonder they cut Johnson--maybe they knew that we were going to deliberately avoid deep passes even though that was the best part of the offense last year.

You keep bringing up how the WR were used last year. That ship has sailed with a new offense and isn't coming back.

[Topcat]

The point is that Allen, Williams and Cook all have had more drops this season than Guyton. I understand your point about drop percentage and that is a valid point.

However, Allen's drop percentage was higher than Guyton's until recently when Guyton scored his second drop and nobody really said anything about Allen's drops. Heck, Allen was second in the league in drops for several weeks and nobody really said anything.

The only person that most on this forum focus on in terms of drops is Guyton even though several players have more drops. There is an inconsistency there.

There is a huge lack of objectivity when comparing Palmer to Guyton demonstrated by most on this forum. Palmer has 6 catches for 58 yards. That is not better than 9 catches for 128 yards, which is what Guyton has even though the team has basically refused to make any designed deep passes to Guyton, which is his greatest strength. There is no meaningful comparison to be had and yet some actually want to increase Palmer's role when he has basically been a waste of a jersey so far.

If the team used Guyton properly like they did last year, I strongly suspect that his production would be leaps and bounds better than Palmer's near non-production. But hey, no wonder they cut Johnson--maybe they knew that we were going to deliberately avoid deep passes even though that was the best part of the offense last year.

Crusher, I'm guessing u have T-Billy on your fantasy team...

[Guest]

You keep bringing up how the WR were used last year. That ship has sailed with a new offense and isn't coming back.

The deep passing game needs to come back. It is that simple.

[Guest]

Crusher, I'm guessing u have T-Billy on your fantasy team...

You would be wrong with that guess. I have Davante Adams and Tyreek Hill and usually play Deebo Samuel at my W/R position. (Obviously, drafting those first two tells you that I gambled with my RB choices.)

[OhioBolt]

With no disrespect intended, I disagree with just about everything that you have said in the above post.

Jenkins is significantly better than Adderley. Notwithstanding his concerted effort this year to be more physical, Adderley is really more of a finesse, FS only kind of player. Jenkins plays both FS and SS effectively. Jenkins is a much more physical player than Adderley, something we are sorely missing on defense this year. Also, Adderley has been made of glass so far in his career. Jenkins has a huge advantage in terms of durability. Jenkins is a tick faster than Adderley as well.

That said, I can understand the decision to keep Adderley and not re-sign Jenkins because of the large salary difference and the opportunity to pick up an extra comp pick. But there is no way that Adderley is better than Rashawn Jenkins.

Turning to Palmer, he has been pretty much useless this year given his lack of production. And beyond that, he has not demonstrated a hint of even a single trait that would tend to generate the belief that he would produce if given a larger role in the offense.

If we did not shine a light on him by taking him in the third round and talking him up in the preseason, waiving him and signing him to the practice squad would be a more appropriate option than expanding his role. I wouldn't mind seeing Jason Moore on the field for us instead of Palmer as the #4 WR (if we added Moore and cut at a position other than WR). Moore is not faster than Palmer, but he is a little bigger and has a couple of superior athletic traits (37" vertical leap and good agility). I think it might be time to look at him as Palmer could not give us much less than he has given us so far.

We are misusing Guyton and he still has more than double the receiving yards of Palmer. Palmer is not close to being as good as Guyton. The false narrative of Guyton's drops is ridiculously over the top on this forum. Allen, Williams and Cook all have more drops than Guyton and nobody says a thing about their drop issues.

Sadly, I have seen nothing that makes me believe that Palmer was a good choice by us at 3-77. No flashes, nothing.

,
Your assessments are your assessment and based on reading threads after yours with Jenkins Mr. Un-Elite and Adderly, and one pony Guyton compare to Palmer, I don't see any body agreeing with your points. If Jenkins is that dam good you sign him . Miss using Guyton is more about his route tree other than double move and deep ball he is limited.

[21&500]

Crusher, I'm guessing u have T-Billy on your fantasy team...

Strangely, 1 T-Billy poster was sold this season
haha

[Guest]

,
Your assessments are your assessment and based on reading threads after yours with Jenkins Mr. Un-Elite and Adderly, and one pony Guyton compare to Palmer, I don't see any body agreeing with your points. If Jenkins is that dam good you sign him . Miss using Guyton is more about his route tree other than double move and deep ball he is limited.

Jenkins has been better in every season in which both players have played. But the issue is that if you are only going to keep one of them, then do you want to pay $1.18M per season for Adderley or $8.75M per season for Jenkins, which is what each player is making on average per season per spotrac?

This year, with Adderley improving some, Jenkins is only slightly better and so Adderley probably represents the better deal. And that deal is even a better one if we secure a comp pick for not keeping Jenkins. With our team in particular, I could see where some of these extra mid/late round comp picks could be used to upgrade our special teams with maybe the occasionally lucky draft pick contributing in a bigger way on offense or defense.

As far as agreement goes, you appear to be the only one discussing Adderley/Jenkins, so I am just disagreeing with your take as to those two players. Until this season, Jenkins was a lot better than Adderley. This year, Jenkins is only slightly better than Adderley.

Regarding Guyton/Palmer, if Guyton is "one pony", then Palmer is "on foot" (i.e., no ponies). No production and no bankable traits just means that Palmer is not very good so far. And worse yet, because he may be more polished coming out of college than others, he may be a lot closer to his ceiling already than other younger WRs are. I do not get the love for Palmer on this board or by the team. The guy has done nothing for us and has not flashed at all so far. I do not see how that is reasonably debatable.

Guyton is the more explosive player and has outproduced Palmer even though we refuse to throw designed deep passes to Guyton.

[jamrock]

Regarding Guyton/Palmer, if Guyton is "one pony", then Palmer is "on foot" (i.e., no ponies). No production and no bankable traits just means that Palmer is not very good so far. And worse yet, because he may be more polished coming out of college than others, he may be a lot closer to his ceiling already than other younger WRs are. I do not get the love for Palmer on this board or by the team. The guy has done nothing for us and has not flashed at all so far. I do not see how that is reasonably debatable.

Guyton is the more explosive player and has outproduced Palmer even though we refuse to throw designed deep passes to Guyton.

Not sure I see love for Palmer. More like others are willing to be a bit patient to see how the guy develops.