Joe Lombardi Discussion

[chargeroo]

That Johnson had chemistry with Herbert is conclusively established by the fact that Johnson produced the highest passer rating for any qualifying receiver (at any position--WR, TE, RB) when targeted in the entire NFL in 2020.

Again, to make the point that much more obvious, for anyone thinking Joshua Palmer had an okay or better rookie season, Palmer produced 353 yards on 49 targets. Johnson produced 398 yards on only 26 targets.

And for those wanting to respond by stating that, of course, Johnson had more yards because he ran deeper routes, it is also the case that Johnson's reception percentage per target was significantly higher than Palmer's (76.9% versus 67.3%) despite Johnson running deeper, less likely to be completed routes.

Finally, Johnson accomplished what he did in only 12 games in 2020 versus 17 games for Palmer in 2021.

So, anyone claiming that Johnson was not all that good for us is guilty of some pretty inconsistent analysis if that same person also contends that Joshua Palmer is somehow a better WR. The stats prove otherwise and show that any such claims are pure horse manure.

I admit that I was shocked when they cut Johnson. I still don't understand it. BUT, it's way past time to let it go.

I still hate that we traded JJ to GB but I don't see the point in bringing it up several times a year.

[Guest]

I admit that I was shocked when they cut Johnson. I still don't understand it. BUT, it's way past time to let it go.

I still hate that we traded JJ to GB but I don't see the point in bringing it up several times a year.

One point of discussing Johnson is that the team had the opportunity to preserve speed and should have foreseen that Guyton, as the only seedy WR on the roster, could get injured, leaving us without any speed at all.

And, unfortunately, this gives Lombardi an excuse not to throw deep, which he was already failing to do, which is a very problematic as it allows defenses to roll up on us, limiting the short passing game and the ground game at the same time. The saturation of the short passing area has created a situation in which Herbert is in the bottom 6 in intended air yards per pass, but in the top 6 in aggressive throws, which are defined as throws made when a defender is within one yard of the intended receiver when the ball arrives.

That means that Herbert is making riskier throws than most QBs, but he is doing so for smaller gains than most QBs. Play calling that produces such results is obviously not desirable as it presents the worst of both worlds--increased risk and lesser gains. The failure to keep Johnson has contributed to Lombardi's lame play calling, which is why it is relevant in 2022 and even more so after the injury to Guyton.

Also, part of the discussion of Johnson is made by me to correct some misrepresentations made about him as some on this forum want to minimize Johnson, but praise Palmer at the same time. And there is no world of consistent analysis where such assertions would be warranted as Johnson (in 2020) clearly outperformed Palmer (in 2021). That is not even reasonably debatable.

[richpjr]

Popper has an interesting take that he has brought up several times about Herbert and the ball control passing. He thinks Herbert is generally risk adverse and processes stuff so fast that at times he has moved off his receivers as being covered and ends up checking down, where someone who takes longer to process allows the receivers more time to get open. Not sure how much I buy into that but he has brought it up multiple times - for whatever that is worth.

[gzubeck]

Popper has an interesting take that he has brought up several times about Herbert and the ball control passing. He thinks Herbert is generally risk adverse and processes stuff so fast that at times he has moved off his receivers as being covered and ends up checking down, where someone who takes longer to process allows the receivers more time to get open. Not sure how much I buy into that but he has brought it up multiple times - for whatever that is worth.

I wonder if getting rid of the exploding pineapple has something to do with this. Herbert has the ribs to prove this as well due to wonderful protection from our oft injured oline.

[Riverwalk]

Popper has an interesting take that he has brought up several times about Herbert and the ball control passing. He thinks Herbert is generally risk adverse and processes stuff so fast that at times he has moved off his receivers as being covered and ends up checking down, where someone who takes longer to process allows the receivers more time to get open. Not sure how much I buy into that but he has brought it up multiple times - for whatever that is worth.

Out of three games Lombardi has already said two of the sub par offense performances were his fault.

The Raider game where he called the second half too conservatively and the Jags game where he purposely handcuffed Herbert.

Blaming this shit on Herbert where he’s played injured half of the season to date defies the facts Lombardi has admitted to.

[richpjr]

Out of three games Lombardi has already said two of the sub par offense performances were his fault.

The Raider game where he called the second half too conservatively and the Jags game where he purposely handcuffed Herbert.

Blaming this shit on Herbert where he’s played injured half of the season to date defies the facts Lombardi has admitted to.

The same people complaining about Lombardi this year also complained about him last year when Herbert was not hurt.

[chargeroo]

The same people complaining about Lombardi this year also complained about him last year when Herbert was not hurt.

That's because we have several members that know a lot more about running an NFL offense than anyone on the coaching staff knows.

[sonorajim]

The same people complaining about Lombardi this year also complained about him last year when Herbert was not hurt.

Herbert had a great year on a team with not much defense or STs in 2021. Lombardi's O was top 4 ypg, 5 ppg. Not too shabby.

[gzubeck]

The same people complaining about Lombardi this year also complained about him last year when Herbert was not hurt.

Another 3 games like we had this year and we won't have to worry about complaining about Lombardi in the future.

[Topcat]

"It is clear by now that he is a B-level offensive coordinator..."

Lombo and the Bolts are the laughingstock of the league now...this is getting painful...

[Topcat]

The same people complaining about Lombardi this year also complained about him last year when Herbert was not hurt.

Whether Herbie is hurt or not is immaterial. Lombo's offensive scheming did hold us back from winning at least some games last season. For example, the Vikes game was winnable, but Lombo kept playing Lomboball vs. a stacked box:

vikes stack box 1.JPG

[Topcat]

Popper has an interesting take that he has brought up several times about Herbert and the ball control passing. He thinks Herbert is generally risk adverse and processes stuff so fast that at times he has moved off his receivers as being covered and ends up checking down, where someone who takes longer to process allows the receivers more time to get open. Not sure how much I buy into that but he has brought it up multiple times - for whatever that is worth.

I have a bit of a different take on this. Because Lombo's offense is based mostly on the ground game and short passes, Herbie needs to check down fast, because the heat is coming from frequent blitzes and stacked boxes. In Herbie's first year when Stitch was dialing up a lot more long passes to T-Billy and Guyton, Herbie often had the bomb as his primary read, and both of these receivers generally had good separation fairly early. Plus, we didn't see as many stacked boxes. So, long ball, primary read, he's open, BOOM! TD! But with all this short stuff Lombo is dialing up, defenses are stacking the box and teeing off on Herbie, so he has even LESS time to process his reads, than if we were running a more balanced offense, with a combination of short, intermediate and long plays, to reduce the frequency of blitzes...