POLL: Is It Time To Bench Rivers?

[Fleet]

[PMR9FAN]

Doesn’t sound like PhillyRiv is being benched anytime soon no matter how many ridiculous polls you toads put up.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/28092932/chargers-philip-rivers-evaluate-status-2019-season

[Critty]

Rivers kept us from being blown out....

Rivers is turning the ball over is not a result of his bad play, it is the result that our offense is impossibly inept without him. If he doesn't force the ball in those situations, we have no chance.

What?!?!?
The offense has been somewhat inept with him in half the games this year. He can play better even behind this o line. Some of those turnovers are completely Rivers fault.

The Lions scored 13pts.
6pts in 1st half & 7 in 2nd half.
The final throw was completely forced for no reason.....Chargers were at the Detroit 28 needing a FG to tie. It was 3rd down and the line gave Rivers all day to make a throw on that play...there was a wide open player underneath. Rivers force it to the endzone for game ending turnover. One of the worst decison ever.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

The Steelers scored 24 total. They score 14pts in 1st qtr off Rivers backward pass (terrible throw by Rivers) & then a interception.(Good play by Steelers)
Steelers scored 3pts entire 2nd half. Charger defense grabbed 2 takeaways in 4th qtr.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

The Bears only scored 16 the entire game.
9pts in 1st. And 7pts in the 2nd half.
In 4th qtr. Bosa got a sack and Ingram grabbed the fumble and set Chargers up at 26yd line. Rivers cashed in and Chargers took lead 17-16.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out? How.

Broncos game. Denver score 20 total.
Denver scored 3 the entire 2nd half.
Desmond King had TD return. The Charger offense only managed to score 2 FG all game. Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

Packers game. Scored 11 total.
Green Bay had only 3 pts after 3qtrs of football.
Tranquill block a punt that set up Chargers on 27yd line. Rivers cashed in to take 26-3 lead.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

Raiders game.
They entire team including Rivers made too many mistakes. Rivers sailed the 1st interception, just a bad throw. His fault. The next pick 6 was bad luck.
The defense held them to 16pts rest of game. 9pts in 2nd half. Chargers rushing game had a good day.
Rivers had a great drive to take lead.
Defense unable to hold Raiders from retaking lead.
Rivers with 3 timeouts and needing a FG to win lead an all time pathetic drive. Everyone on offense stunk on final drive, including Rivers.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

How much is Rivers credit/blame and how much is others credit/blame is debatable.
Certainly if o line played better it makes Rivers job easier......but thats the thing about being a franchise QB. Some days the o line has a great day. Some days the opponents is very disruptive. Some season the line stays healthy and others its next man up. The opponents is trying to disrupt and defeat the every play. They get paid too. Bottom line franchise QBs need to lead teams to wins in all kinds of difficult game day situations. If they can only do it from a cozy pocket where they have all day to throw, well they are NOT much of a franchise QB. Rivers has proved his entire career he can do good work behind suspect & sloppy o line play. But he also has proved he can make a few careless throws and hurt his team chance of winning. When the team is dominate he can get away with some carelessness and it likely won't cost the team. When the team is struggling....the franchise QB has to find a way to move the chains and carelessness adds gas to the fire.

Bashing Rivers is one thing. But it is legitmate to say Rivers needs to play better situational football and that he made some very questionable and careless decisions that contributed to a losing effort.

It is appropriate to put a larger share of credit/blame on HC and the franchise QB ability to lead and find ways to win games.

They all need to be better. It's starts with Lynn & Rivers having a no excuse mentality about finding ways to win....which they do. They both know every game is winnable. No excuses. They will play the rest of the season believing if they execute better they will win each and every game.

The team will have a chance to get hot because of Lynn & Rivers character and competitive nature.
No excuses.

[Topcat]

What?!?!?
The offense has been somewhat inept with him in half the games this year. He can play better even behind this o line. Some of those turnovers are completely Rivers fault.

The Lions scored 13pts.
6pts in 1st half & 7 in 2nd half.
The final throw was completely forced for no reason.....Chargers were at the Detroit 28 needing a FG to tie. It was 3rd down and the line gave Rivers all day to make a throw on that play...there was a wide open player underneath. Rivers force it to the endzone for game ending turnover. One of the worst decison ever.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

The Steelers scored 24 total. They score 14pts in 1st qtr off Rivers backward pass (terrible throw by Rivers) & then a interception.(Good play by Steelers)
Steelers scored 3pts entire 2nd half. Charger defense grabbed 2 takeaways in 4th qtr.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

The Bears only scored 16 the entire game.
9pts in 1st. And 7pts in the 2nd half.
In 4th qtr. Bosa got a sack and Ingram grabbed the fumble and set Chargers up at 26yd line. Rivers cashed in and Chargers took lead 17-16.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out? How.

Broncos game. Denver score 20 total.
Denver scored 3 the entire 2nd half.
Desmond King had TD return. The Charger offense only managed to score 2 FG all game. Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

Packers game. Scored 11 total.
Green Bay had only 3 pts after 3qtrs of football.
Tranquill block a punt that set up Chargers on 27yd line. Rivers cashed in to take 26-3 lead.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

Raiders game.
They entire team including Rivers made too many mistakes. Rivers sailed the 1st interception, just a bad throw. His fault. The next pick 6 was bad luck.
The defense held them to 16pts rest of game. 9pts in 2nd half. Chargers rushing game had a good day.
Rivers had a great drive to take lead.
Defense unable to hold Raiders from retaking lead.
Rivers with 3 timeouts and needing a FG to win lead an all time pathetic drive. Everyone on offense stunk on final drive, including Rivers.
Rivers kept us from getting blown out. How?

How much is Rivers credit/blame and how much is others credit/blame is debatable.
Certainly if o line played better it makes Rivers job easier......but thats the thing about being a franchise QB. Some days the o line has a great day. Some days the opponents is very disruptive. Some season the line stays healthy and others its next man up. The opponents is trying to disrupt and defeat the every play. They get paid too. Bottom line franchise QBs need to lead teams to wins in all kinds of difficult game day situations. If they can only do it from a cozy pocket where they have all day to throw, well they are NOT much of a franchise QB. Rivers has proved his entire career he can do good work behind suspect & sloppy o line play. But he also has proved he can make a few careless throws and hurt his team chance of winning. When the team is dominate he can get away with some carelessness and it likely won't cost the team. When the team is struggling....the franchise QB has to find a way to move the chains and carelessness adds gas to the fire.

Bashing Rivers is one thing. But it is legitmate to say Rivers needs to play better situational football and that he made some very questionable and careless decisions that contributed to a losing effort.

It is appropriate to put a larger share of credit/blame on HC and the franchise QB ability to lead and find ways to win games.

They all need to be better. It's starts with Lynn & Rivers having a no excuse mentality about finding ways to win....which they do. They both know every game is winnable. No excuses. They will play the rest of the season believing if they execute better they will win each and every game.

The team will have a chance to get hot because of Lynn & Rivers character and competitive nature.
No excuses.

Good summary of real facts there, Critty, instead of a lot of the arguments we hear on the other side, based on emotions and not facts. I've tried my best to lay out the facts here, like you. What's a real problem is that these types of miscues by PR have been going on for years, on and off. Some years worse than others. This year is, so far, one of the worst ones...

[Critty]

Good summary of real facts there, Critty, instead of a lot of the arguments we hear on the other side, based on emotions and not facts. I've tried my best to lay out the facts here, like you. What's a real problem is that these types of miscues by PR have been going on for years, on and off. Some years worse than others. This year is, so far, one of the worst ones...

I am guessing those who argue against your takes are not fans of the bench him take or the hero ball take. They believe Rivers is undermanned, which he is somewhat, and if he had more help then he would get it done. And I cant argue with that. Give any QB more help and it should lead to better results.

I would NOT bench Rivers. He is a great veteran. And he has a habit of getting hot late in the season. The Chargers need to finish 5-1 and I think Rivers at QB is their best and only chance of doing that. IMO, Taylor and Stick would have some chemistry issues with the starters to work through and the offense would be limited somewhat as I don't think either can make all the audibles or adjustments or the throws Rivers is capable of making. They would add some mobility, but for every good play, they would also likely take a sack. Taylor as the veteran would be able to manage games but he is there as insurance, not to start.

I dont think Rivers makes hero throws. At least not intentionally. I think he trusts his line and his receivers and knows he can make big time throws. I think he plays with a lot of belief that those around him will execute.
He can be too agressive in situational football, but again I think that is because he belives they can do it.
I do not think he is going for personal glory to be the hero when he makes some questionable throws.
Just think his trust in teammates is sometime misplaced....they are not playing well enough to trust, so he can just ball out....he has to limit his trust a little and think game manager. But it is Not his style.
So you get really good and then some good grief Rivers what the heck are you doing.
Like the final 3 drives vs Raiders.
Good drive to get FG. Hit deep pass to MW for 45yd.
Great drive takes lead. Hit deep pass to KA for 26yd.
Pathetic drive to end game.
Rivers did not change from good QB one drive to hero ball. He just trusted them each time. One time he hit Williams for a deep catch, next drive KA. Next drive he missed on all his deep throws and he went deep too much trying to push the ball into Raider territory.

I will say situationally, he needed to be aggressive to go get the lead. And they did. Credit Rivers. But on the final drive, situationally moving the chains and finding a way to at least get a FG try up was workable when the deep ball was not connecting, so Rivers did not have to stay so aggressive. Which is why Lynn mentioned there was underneath routes, we did not have to throw it deep damn near every play. Easier said than done when your not out there throwing it yourself, Lynn also mentioned this.

Rivers is not going to get an upgraded o line overnight so he has to make due with what he has.
And be a little better situationally to win some of these games. I expect great franchise QBs to manage difficult situations and find ways to win.

Problem that I agree with you is Rivers doesnt turtle up into game manager when that can lead to a win in situational football, he goes down swinging and believing in his teammates to a fault. And it backfires like the Lions game. Said he thought KA would get it or draw the PI or it would be incomplete. Thats too aggressive to throw into double coverage when you are already in FG range and only a turnover stops the opportunity to tie. He turned it over being too agressive when he did not need to, his fault. Thats what make it hard to trust Rivers in late game football, he can be too aggressive and throw it up for grabs into coverage.

[jamrock]

Our OL next season is gonna be dope and deep.

[Topcat]

I am guessing those who argue against your takes are not fans of the bench him take or the hero ball take. They believe Rivers is undermanned, which he is somewhat, and if he had more help then he would get it done. And I cant argue with that. Give any QB more help and it should lead to better results.

I would NOT bench Rivers. He is a great veteran. And he has a habit of getting hot late in the season. The Chargers need to finish 5-1 and I think Rivers at QB is their best and only chance of doing that. IMO, Taylor and Stick would have some chemistry issues with the starters to work through and the offense would be limited somewhat as I don't think either can make all the audibles or adjustments or the throws Rivers is capable of making. They would add some mobility, but for every good play, they would also likely take a sack. Taylor as the veteran would be able to manage games but he is there as insurance, not to start.

I dont think Rivers makes hero throws. At least not intentionally. I think he trusts his line and his receivers and knows he can make big time throws. I think he plays with a lot of belief that those around him will execute.
He can be too agressive in situational football, but again I think that is because he belives they can do it.
I do not think he is going for personal glory to be the hero when he makes some questionable throws.
Just think his trust in teammates is sometime misplaced....they are not playing well enough to trust, so he can just ball out....he has to limit his trust a little and think game manager. But it is Not his style.
So you get really good and then some good grief Rivers what the heck are you doing.
Like the final 3 drives vs Raiders.
Good drive to get FG. Hit deep pass to MW for 45yd.
Great drive takes lead. Hit deep pass to KA for 26yd.
Pathetic drive to end game.
Rivers did not change from good QB one drive to hero ball. He just trusted them each time. One time he hit Williams for a deep catch, next drive KA. Next drive he missed on all his deep throws and he went deep too much trying to push the ball into Raider territory.

I will say situationally, he needed to be aggressive to go get the lead. And they did. Credit Rivers. But on the final drive, situationally moving the chains and finding a way to at least get a FG try up was workable when the deep ball was not connecting, so Rivers did not have to stay so aggressive. Which is why Lynn mentioned there was underneath routes, we did not have to throw it deep damn near every play. Easier said than done when your not out there throwing it yourself, Lynn also mentioned this.

Rivers is not going to get an upgraded o line overnight so he has to make due with what he has.
And be a little better situationally to win some of these games. I expect great franchise QBs to manage difficult situations and find ways to win.

Problem that I agree with you is Rivers doesnt turtle up into game manager when that can lead to a win in situational football, he goes down swinging and believing in his teammates to a fault. And it backfires like the Lions game. Said he thought KA would get it or draw the PI or it would be incomplete. Thats too aggressive to throw into double coverage when you are already in FG range and only a turnover stops the opportunity to tie. He turned it over being too agressive when he did not need to, his fault. Thats what make it hard to trust Rivers in late game football, he can be too aggressive and throw it up for grabs into coverage.

Good points there, Critty. Up until that final drive, on the intermediate and long routes, KA and Mike Will were open more. On that final drive, the Raiders had the intermediate and long routes well covered, but, as the screen shots on at least #2 and #5 show, we had the short man WIDE open. So, Rivers needs to learn to take what the D gives you, because some of those short completions can turn into some big time YAC...

[Boltjolt]

I am guessing those who argue against your takes are not fans of the bench him take or the hero ball take. They believe Rivers is undermanned, which he is somewhat, and if he had more help then he would get it done. And I cant argue with that. Give any QB more help and it should lead to better results.

I would NOT bench Rivers. He is a great veteran. And he has a habit of getting hot late in the season. The Chargers need to finish 5-1 and I think Rivers at QB is their best and only chance of doing that. IMO, Taylor and Stick would have some chemistry issues with the starters to work through and the offense would be limited somewhat as I don't think either can make all the audibles or adjustments or the throws Rivers is capable of making. They would add some mobility, but for every good play, they would also likely take a sack. Taylor as the veteran would be able to manage games but he is there as insurance, not to start.

I dont think Rivers makes hero throws. At least not intentionally. I think he trusts his line and his receivers and knows he can make big time throws. I think he plays with a lot of belief that those around him will execute.
He can be too agressive in situational football, but again I think that is because he belives they can do it.
I do not think he is going for personal glory to be the hero when he makes some questionable throws.
Just think his trust in teammates is sometime misplaced....they are not playing well enough to trust, so he can just ball out....he has to limit his trust a little and think game manager. But it is Not his style.
So you get really good and then some good grief Rivers what the heck are you doing.
Like the final 3 drives vs Raiders.
Good drive to get FG. Hit deep pass to MW for 45yd.
Great drive takes lead. Hit deep pass to KA for 26yd.
Pathetic drive to end game.
Rivers did not change from good QB one drive to hero ball. He just trusted them each time. One time he hit Williams for a deep catch, next drive KA. Next drive he missed on all his deep throws and he went deep too much trying to push the ball into Raider territory.

I will say situationally, he needed to be aggressive to go get the lead. And they did. Credit Rivers. But on the final drive, situationally moving the chains and finding a way to at least get a FG try up was workable when the deep ball was not connecting, so Rivers did not have to stay so aggressive. Which is why Lynn mentioned there was underneath routes, we did not have to throw it deep damn near every play. Easier said than done when your not out there throwing it yourself, Lynn also mentioned this.

Rivers is not going to get an upgraded o line overnight so he has to make due with what he has.
And be a little better situationally to win some of these games. I expect great franchise QBs to manage difficult situations and find ways to win.

Problem that I agree with you is Rivers doesnt turtle up into game manager when that can lead to a win in situational football, he goes down swinging and believing in his teammates to a fault. And it backfires like the Lions game. Said he thought KA would get it or draw the PI or it would be incomplete. Thats too aggressive to throw into double coverage when you are already in FG range and only a turnover stops the opportunity to tie. He turned it over being too agressive when he did not need to, his fault. Thats what make it hard to trust Rivers in late game football, he can be too aggressive and throw it up for grabs into coverage.

Pretty good summary and one i do agree with.

I'm not into silly nicknames and when someone makes a bad pkay or has a bad game to give them names like Hero ball and Riverboat to me is lame. The only player I called something else was Suckhurst because he was so awful.

The guy is a HOFer and knows his personal. So why he is throwing to Patton on the last drive going deep,.... I'm not sure but he knows what he is doing a lot better than anyone here for sure.

But I still think he shoukd of been better at taking what the defense was giving with 3 timeouts. And the new OC let it be known.

Damn shame TT can't get him a good OL to work with.

[ChargingBolts]

People say Rivers isn't clutch, how short their memory is ... 2018 at Kansas City ... game winning drive ... 4th down conversion ... TD ... 2 point conversion ... so un-clutch ... 'nuff said

[NoMoreChillies]

People say Rivers isn't clutch, how short their memory is ... 2018 at Kansas City ... game winning drive ... 4th down conversion ... TD ... 2 point conversion ... so un-clutch ... 'nuff said

Wish we could have that Rivers in 2019

[wu-dai clan]

What I am reading is that Rivers will give serious thought to retiring at the end of this season.

We could be witness to Felipe Rios playing to extend his career Monday night.

Or it could be the beginning of him winding it down.

JMO.

[PMR9FAN]

What I am reading is that Rivers will give serious thought to retiring at the end of this season.

We could be witness to Felipe Rios playing to extend his career Monday night.

Or it could be the beginning of him winding it down.

JMO.

PR said he would give the topic serious thought for family and other reasons but that it’s still his intention to play in 2020.