Justin Herbert - Bolts Franchise QB Official Discussion

[CanadianBoltFan]

The Eagles receivers are not better than ours if MW is healthy. Who TF is Davonta Smith scaring?
Niners have Aiyuk and Deebo ..that's it. Jennings/ McCloud,....eh.

Just listen to the commentary, MW gets praised all the time.
Just Monday might they pointed out if MW was healthy they could do different things that you can't do with QJ and Palmer taking away that element from Herbert.
MW is not Keenan but he is very undervalued by this board.

He has had well more than one good game. Saying that is lame. He took several 40+ yards even with Lombo as OC in 2021. He tied for first with Tyreek that season. He has one this year in the game he got injured.

I'll give ya he is injured too much but he is good when he isn't.
And again, if Keenan were a Giant, Jet , Packer, Cowboy. ..he would be getting tons more accolades.
Being a Charger holds him down.
He set a record for 600 catches in least games over Antonio Brown who got tons of accolades being a Steeler before he went crazy.

Being a Charger held Rivers recognition down, it's holding Herbert down. Seau got more PR talk as a Patriot. I see him in a Patriot uniform as much as a Chargers uniform in pics.

AJ Brown is a beast and can be unstoppable at times. He can take any catch to the house in a way no Charger receiver can. Chargers have no weapon like this. Eagles also have a top level TE who can catch and block not just a bunch of guys. Devonta is better than you think.

Aiyuk is ascending and will be better than Williams. I like big Mike but he is over rated and over paid in LA. He has TWO 1000 yard seasons in 7 years for 20 million. 49ers have a stud TE. the 49ers have abundant YAC. We have none. Weak armed Purdy can just get his receivers the ball and they do the rest. Chargers have to plod down the field in long perfect drives and Herbert has to be perfect, threading the ball into tight spaces.

[Velo]

We don’t have the coaching. That’s become obvious. People are overly infatuated with speed. It’s the Miami effect. The Coryell Chargers didn’t have speed demons. Charlie Joiner, Kellen Winslow were t fast. JJ and Wes were faster but not Cliff Branch fast. It’s creativity that we lack on offense. Hate to see it but they’ve become dull and plodding. And then even when Keenan was wide open on 2 deep balls against the Cowboys, Herbert just missed him.

To underscore that further:

The Chiefs won the Super Bowl after trading the league's fastest player.

The Rams won the Super Bowl the previous season with a record-setting WR, who as the Super Bowl MVP, who was everything but fast (4.62 at 2016 Combine).

The Buccaneers won the Super Bowl the season before that with Mike Evans (4.53) and Chris Godwin (4.2) as Brady's top two WRs.

[Bolt4Knob]

We don’t have the coaching. That’s become obvious. People are overly infatuated with speed. It’s the Miami effect. The Coryell Chargers didn’t have speed demons. Charlie Joiner, Kellen Winslow were t fast. JJ and Wes were faster but not Cliff Branch fast. It’s creativity that we lack on offense. Hate to see it but they’ve become dull and plodding. And then even when Keenan was wide open on 2 deep balls against the Cowboys, Herbert just missed him.

Well the problem is - there is nobody on the roster who is close to Kellen Winslow at TE. Hell, maybe Kelce is the closest in the NFL at TE

I compare Joiner and Allen - both possession receivers

As far as JJ and Wes - well they were uniquely talented players. Two best WRs I have seen where a Chargers uniform and its not close. I never saw Bambi or even Gary Garrison.

I guess I shouldn't use the word speed- I should use the term playmaker and the Chargers, do not have a playmaker on their roster. Kittle is a playmaker at TE. Deebo, Tyreek. Evena guy like Diggs can be an explosive playmaker.

[jamrock]

Well the problem is - there is nobody on the roster who is close to Kellen Winslow at TE. Hell, maybe Kelce is the closest in the NFL at TE

I compare Joiner and Allen - both possession receivers

As far as JJ and Wes - well they were uniquely talented players. Two best WRs I have seen where a Chargers uniform and its not close. I never saw Bambi or even Gary Garrison.

I guess I shouldn't use the word speed- I should use the term playmaker and the Chargers, do not have a playmaker on their roster. Kittle is a playmaker at TE. Deebo, Tyreek. Evena guy like Diggs can be an explosive playmaker.

Bambi was a level above any receiver we’ve had since. Not even close. Garrison was more in the Joiner mold. And I am a big fan of JJ and Wes.

I take your point in playmakers. I thought that was why we drafted QJ.

[Boltjolt]

AJ Brown is a beast and can be unstoppable at times. He can take any catch to the house in a way no Charger receiver can. Chargers have no weapon like this. Eagles also have a top level TE who can catch and block not just a bunch of guys. Devonta is better than you think.

Aiyuk is ascending and will be better than Williams. I like big Mike but he is over rated and over paid in LA. He has TWO 1000 yard seasons in 7 years for 20 million. 49ers have a stud TE. the 49ers have abundant YAC. We have none. Weak armed Purdy can just get his receivers the ball and they do the rest. Chargers have to plod down the field in long perfect drives and Herbert has to be perfect, threading the ball into tight spaces.

No he cant and he doesnt. Davonta Smith is a 170 lb, less version of Keenan Allen. He has little YAC ability. Goedert is above average. Is he really better than Hunter Henry? Not sure he is and his stats dont reflect he is.
Ill go as far to say that if Hurts didnt run 130 times a season, their offense isnt that great. That element is there and is a factor in the offense.

Aiyuk is assending.....but looks right there as you are implying he ISNT better than MW now. I agree.

Tell you what....if we release Keenan and MW, they would be signed in a NY minute. When after last season it was implied by most Chargers fans on Twitter that they should let him go, numerous fans from other teams were wanting to sign him.
I agree it would be nice to have some speed....and we drafted some speed. Get the kid in the game a handful of times a week. Hec Palmer showed some speed on his catch and run that was called back by penalty.

AJ Brown is not a speed demon either. He ran a 4.49 to Palmers 4.52.
At his proday MW ran a 4.53 and a 4.51. Our recievers arent slow, they just arent burners. Tyreek Hill is arguably the best YAC reciever in the NFL and just happens to have 4.3 speed to go with it. That is a rare combo.

When our slowest reciever is open by 10 yards and the QB misses him, ....thats a problem! Keenan perhaps takes that last one to the house as stated on the broadcast. Tua isnt missing those throws for Miami.

[Bolt4Knob]

Bambi was a level above any receiver we’ve had since. Not even close. Garrison was more in the Joiner mold. And I am a big fan of JJ and Wes.

I take your point in playmakers. I thought that was why we drafted QJ.

Like I said, never saw Bambi. I started watching the Bolts basically Jeffersons rookie year. He was amazing.

And yes, being a playmaker is I thought why they drafted QJ. I hope tomorrow - they give him a chance. End arounds, bubble screens - something to use his ability with the ball in his hands

[Boltjolt]

To underscore that further:

The Chiefs won the Super Bowl after trading the league's fastest player.

The Rams won the Super Bowl the previous season with a record-setting WR, who as the Super Bowl MVP, who was everything but fast (4.62 at 2016 Combine).

The Buccaneers won the Super Bowl the season before that with Mike Evans (4.53) and Chris Godwin (4.2) as Brady's top two WRs.

Thank you!

I also have stated this a handful of times. Godwin ran a 4.42, not a 4.2 https://www.nfl.com/prospects/chris-...c-24189dd66641

[Velo]

Thank you!

I also have stated this a handful of times. Godwin ran a 4.42, not a 4.2 https://www.nfl.com/prospects/chris-...c-24189dd66641

I left out a 4

[CanadianBoltFan]

No he cant and he doesnt. Davonta Smith is a 170 lb, less version of Keenan Allen. He has little YAC ability. Goedert is above average. Is he really better than Hunter Henry? Not sure he is and his stats dont reflect he is.
Ill go as far to say that if Hurts didnt run 130 times a season, their offense isnt that great. That element is there and is a factor in the offense.

Aiyuk is assending.....but looks right there as you are implying he ISNT better than MW now. I agree.

Tell you what....if we release Keenan and MW, they would be signed in a NY minute. When after last season it was implied by most Chargers fans on Twitter that they should let him go, numerous fans from other teams were wanting to sign him.
I agree it would be nice to have some speed....and we drafted some speed. Get the kid in the game a handful of times a week. Hec Palmer showed some speed on his catch and run that was called back by penalty.

AJ Brown is not a speed demon either. He ran a 4.49 to Palmers 4.52.
At his proday MW ran a 4.53 and a 4.51. Our recievers arent slow, they just arent burners. Tyreek Hill is arguably the best YAC reciever in the NFL and just happens to have 4.3 speed to go with it. That is a rare combo.

When our slowest reciever is open by 10 yards and the QB misses him, ....thats a problem! Keenan perhaps takes that last one to the house as stated on the broadcast. Tua isnt missing those throws for Miami.

Please. There isn't a GM in the NFL that would not take AJ Brown over any Charger receiver. Last year he had 88 catches for 1500 yards and 11 TDs...for a 17 yard per catch average. Brown is the definition of a big play receiver. Miles better in the open field than Keenan or Mike.He will have 4 1000 yard seasons in his first 5 years even playing the first 3 in the Titan passing attack. Mike Williams has 2 1000 yard seasons in 7 years.

Aiyuk is on a fine trajectory, every bit as good as Williams in his first few seasons and he has never had 2 HOF level QBs throwing him the ball. He is averaging 18.2 yards a catch this year.

These are 2 big play receivers we lack. We have no TE like these offenses.

Sorry I have to take the homer glasses off and be objective about our players. Keenan is fantastic for what he does, no question there. He also consistently shows up. But some of the other Chargers that are called elite players on this board I am taking a step back on.

Too many games they just don't get it done. They never win anything, they never step up and win the big games against good teams.. year after year after year.

[21&500]

[Bolt4Knob]

Please. There isn't a GM in the NFL that would not take AJ Brown over any Charger receiver. Last year he had 88 catches for 1500 yards and 11 TDs...for a 17 yard per catch average. Brown is the definition of a big play receiver. Miles better in the open field than Keenan or Mike.He will have 4 1000 yard seasons in his first 5 years even playing the first 3 in the Titan passing attack. Mike Williams has 2 1000 yard seasons in 7 years.

Aiyuk is on a fine trajectory, every bit as good as Williams in his first few seasons and he has never had 2 HOF level QBs throwing him the ball. He is averaging 18.2 yards a catch this year.

These are 2 big play receivers we lack. We have no TE like these offenses.

Sorry I have to take the homer glasses off and be objective about our players. Keenan is fantastic for what he does, no question there. He also consistently shows up. But some of the other Chargers that are called elite players on this board I am taking a step back on.

Too many games they just don't get it done. They never win anything, they never step up and win the big games against good teams.. year after year after year.

I totally agree. Allen is a fine player - but as he ages, his skillset is now more the possession receiver - and he is very good at that. But Williams opposite him - even healthy, doesn't get open enough,. Palmer. Too station to station

The hope was that QJ would that player that helps the offense - for whatever reason, hasn't happened yet. The Chargers TEs - just not very good, McKitty was a bad draft pick -

And yes, elite in name only. If they lose tomorrow, the Spanii should be telling Telesco to trade Bosa and Mack. Maybe Ek and Davis. They never will because they will think "if we beat the Bears we are 3-4 and followed by the Jets. So the trade deadline is too early to make any moves."

That would be their excuse...

[DerwinBosa]

Not sure how you can truly say he has enough weapons on offense
No speed
no running game
No YAC
No players that can get deep

Williams Palmer and Allen are very duplicative - more possession then explosive
Hell Williams isn't even on the field half the time

No running game
Offensive line can't run and in critical moments can't pass block

This is a 100% indictment of Telesco and Staley

I'm talking strictly about what Herbert has to throw to, which is more than good enough to win a Super Bowl with. The running game sucks, and I've argued since I started posting here that it should be the main focus of improvement on the offense (and several have argued against that because they're worried it will waste Herbert).

Do other quarterbacks currently have better weapons? Yes, with Tua and Burrow standing out. But let's not act like Herbert is deprived and has nothing to work with. Keenan is getting up there, and his contract is going to be a problem next season, but he's still a top 15 receiver. Joshua Palmer is playing pretty well. Gerald Everett is a decent tight end. Austin Ekeler is one of the best receivers out of the backfield. Quenttin Johnston is a first-round pick with only five games under his belt. Derius Davis should be utilized on screens and reverses, kind of like how Doug Pederson used Jamal Agnew against the Saints this past Thursday night.

I really don't see what the problem is among the pass-catchers. There are other areas of this team that need a lot more improvement, starting with the coaching staff.