2021 Roster Build

[beachcomber]

in terms of "identity of the Chargers," eye like to look at players historically, and perhaps gauge @least on an intangibles level, which future Chargers might jive w/the successful players we've had in the past ??

QB Brees, PR, Fouts, Hadl, Stan * Herbert
RB LT *
RB Butts, Natrone, Muncie, Turner *
RB Sproles, Harmon, Woodhead * Ekeler
FB Lo Neal, Tolbert *
WR Danario, Floyd, VJ * MW
WR Alworth, Joiner * Keenan
WR JJ, Chandler *
TE Winslow, Gates *
TE Sievers, Holohan * HH
OT McNeill, Roman Oben *
OG Dielman, Goff, Walt Sweeney, Ed White, Doug Wilkerson * Forrest
OC Hardwick *

NT Jamal, Aubrayo, Norman Hand *
DT Louie Kelcher, Liuget, Castillo, Parella *
DE Gary Johnson, Fred Dean, Deacon Jones, Leslie O'Neal * Bosa
LEO Merriman *
OTTO Plummer, Billy Ray *
MIKE Takeo, Jr. * Denzel
WIL Donnie Edwards *
SS Rodney * Derwin
FS Weddle *
CB Cro, Verrett *
CB Jammer, Desmond *

so we could use a feature back, a fourth quarter, short yardage/goal line bruiser, a receiving TE, a coupla few linemen of note, a coverage LB, and a DB or two....

[beachcomber]

so in my case, I ain't reachin' for need, as am gonna let the draft come to me, and over the next coupla few years, and fill the holes in FA until the roster gets to my likin'....

Trey Smith/Marcus McNeill
Eric Stokes/Cromartie
Josh Myers/Hardwick
Daniel Faalele/Roman Oben
Palaei Gaoteote/Jr.

and just as a reminder, am not comparing these guys skills or talent wise, as much as their intangibles and in the spirit of what they might bring as a future Chargers.

[beachcomber]

also, can't help myself in going over Telesco's drafting record, and to see just really how much you've grown to dislike his drafts and strategy therein....

2020 * he did better than good w/Justin, and despite our glaring needs on the lines, passed on multiple bona fide all pro tackles for what many thought would be a very risky choice in hopes of making Herbert our franchise QB, and.... pretty darn good pick for team Tommy John there.

we traded up for Murray, and if you were the Saints, you prolly woulda taken OC Cesar Ruiz there.... we arguably passed up on multiple talents @LEO, RB, WR, CB and DE.... in the second round, albeit not sure you can say the same for round three, which is the pick we gave up in the trade up.

so far peoples are not so happy w/RB Joshua Kelly and WR KJ Hill, altho speaking for myself, not ready to close the book/door on them, as think both are talents that maybe didn't get their best shake to date here ?? plenty of peoples would give the same benefit of the doubt to Joe Reed, and while many others don't see much if any reason to complain 'bout Alohi neither, albeit another team did take S Jordan Fuller after him, and if you're perennial playoff contenders like Green Bay in round six, you didn't take one lineman, you didn't take two, you took three lineman in round six, and most all of 'em are panning out to some degree to date, 'specially Jon Runyan.

so overall we gave up a pick and went into the second round with just four picks left for the last six rounds.... not a good longterm strategy, as depth and talent will suffer over the long haul w/that penchant for trading up, for your "must get" player of choice, and as will mention again that my suspicion is that the better drafting teams have rather a penchant for stockpiling picks and go into the draft w/picks in the double figures for the most part.... not us, and not yet we don't.

2019 * the Golden Domer tendency has not paid off, and yes he's a lineman, and 'twas a need according to most, and.... there were no less than 5 OTs taken not long after him, many of them doing pretty darn well to date, and.... you can give Telesco a mulligan (does he have any left), but his job is to pick out talent and hit on his picks.... AJ Brown was in the neighborhood as well.

round two plenty of us liked Nasir Adderley, who was a bit of draftnik darling, and thought by many to be good value late in round two, and.... the names of Taylor Rapp and Juan Thornhill must be volunteered here. did you like Pips or Yodny Cajuste better ?? will Pips ever pan out.... odds are not in his, nor Telesco's favor atm, and.... GMin' ain't easy, as for myself woulda been keen on Bryce Love there if not Cajuste, and ditto for Drue who was taken in lieu of my much coveted Jarrett Stidham in round five, and where Telesco also opted to go coverage LB instead of IDL w/Greg Gaines, so philosophy or strategy, and just an overzealous hankering for the Golden Domers, dunno.... and not really serving our best interests to date, and.... then there was Easton Stick, who Telesco took instead of Gardner Minshew (who some here liked some), and left Olineman David Edwards on the board as well, and so.... skill positions over linemen/front seven ??

[beachcomber]

2018 * everybody loves Derwin, albeit again shoulda we gone lineman instead, and like some teams in front of us who perhaps have a philosophy/scheme that values other positions more dearly/highly than safety ?? Isaiah Wynn was there along w/Frank Ragnow, and then again so were guys like Billy Price and Taven Bryan.... GMin' ain't easy. Austin Corbett also got overdrafted and early, or did you (secretly) want Lamar there ??

Nwosu was a questionable pick, and personally question whether he will ever pay dividends equivalent to his slotting here, and Justin Jones.... Orlando Brown went right before him and Michael Gallup a bit afterwards. Kyzir was next, and before Dorance Armstrong and Mo Hurst, not obvious nor universal picks according to most/many. Qberry or Tyrell Crosby ?? would you take the injury risk there ?? Justin Jackson has been an exciting pick/player a time or coupla few.... not bad for round seven.

so again, do you go w/the safer/more popular pick w/your all world safety, or do you build this thing from inside out and from the trenches up ?? was Isaiah Wynn or Frank Ragnow a Charger in waiting, or was Derwin the obvious Charger going forward ??

2017 * MW has alotta supporters in these ranks, and he might not be lumped into the Jacob Hester category, but he has def fallen in line to some degree of an overdrafted, but capable player, or.... do you prefer an inefficient, unable to separate, slower than most but oversized wideout as opposed to a Ryan Ramcyzk, if you're a good/lucky GM, or if not so lucky/good, maybe you went w/Malik McDowell instead ?? and not to mention, and like @least a coupla few fellow GMs, we passed on Mahomes and DeShaun.

most peoples applauded the Lamp/Feeney selections, albeit not sure that either were universal in their appeals.... we coulda but didn't go skill position here, as there were options like Joe Mixon and Chris Godwin, along w/Kareem Hunt.... the depth/day three picks were getting better here w/Rayshawn, Desmond, Tevi and Rochell.... no busts to speak of, and which is pretty much the name of the game.

[beachcomber]

2016 * perhaps not as easy as it seemed drafting Joey B. as Dallas certainly wasn't expecting us to go Bosa, and again there was the proverbial franchise in theory LT on the board there, and he was in fact from Notre Dame, and by most accounts, team Tommy John made the correct selection, or did you (really) like Laremy Tunsil or knew that Taylor Decker would turn out better than many suspected ??

HH was a need pick in round two and in front of my two faves/guys in A'Shawn Robinson and Jason Spriggs (a Green Bay super bust by some accounts), and.... not sure this isn't an example of drafting for need rather than going for bpa, as Chris Jones was sittin' there pretty, and of whom the oft despised PFF had rated seven overall on their board (but what do they know, really....)

Max Tuerk was a poor follow up to Chris Watt, and in which Telesco couldn't get out of his own way, and unfortunately added to his legacy of missing out on Olinemen.... Telesco then deflected/deferred the credit to his staff for the Jatavis pick, and had a minor hit w/Derek Watt as well.

like most GMs, and like AJ before him, team Tommy John drafts better w/a higher draft slotting, hence the good fortune to some if not a large degree, re: the both of Bosa and Hunter.... otherwise 4/7, and another pretty much avg draft haul.

2015 * we traded up for Melvin, for Mr. Impact, of which had its ebbs and flows, but overall don't think you can be overly excited 'bout trading up for this guy, and given like most drafts, there were other "difference makers" available later in the draft @RB.... if Telesco keeps trading up it could cost him his job, even if it is in the interest of your HC.... you're the GM and @the end of the day the talent on the team is your responsibility.... fewer picks mean fewer players, let alone players w/real talent.... we need to learn how to stockpile picks like many other successful drafting teams.

and full disclosure, as not sure how you felt 'bout the way the Philip to Tennessee trade rumors were handled, but this armchair GM was all about the MM swap for PR, and also eye had an eye out for Cam Erving.... none of which was ever acknowledged, let alone let play out by team Tommy John.... they held serve on that one.

personally thought Denzel was a home run pick and didn't foresee the injuries that would plague him, as dearly love him as a Charger, and.... like it or not, you don't just get a pass w/injuries as a GM, as they are all part of the process, and some might dismiss them as random or by happenchance, but personally am not so sure, and suspect that a player's mindset is a factor in how susceptible to injury they might be ??

Mager was forgettable and Kyle Emanuel only a bit better than that.... Darius Philon played some snaps, and.... we didn't blink an eye over missing out on WR Dorial Green Beckham.

[beachcomber]

2014 * Verrett was so darn good, and yet as a real GM you gotta think that you wouldn't take that risk, as his durability was a real ? before the draft, and.... not sure how much there was to work w/with our slotting @25 ?? Attaochu was again another poor follow up to Telesco's Te'o reach the year before, and there were WRs and OL to be had, and by the likes of Morgan Moses and Gabe Jackson.

Chris Watt was next and who ironically went just ahead of Michael Schofield and Trai Turner, and.... personally was a big fan of the both of Ryan Carrethers and Marion Grice, and neither were as bad as Tevin Reese, but that's really not saying anything and prolly not so fair of me.... like I said, dudes need a little more sand in their pants, and to hold tight instead of trading up.

2013 * dude unfortunately got off on the wrong foot, as surprised we didn't lose Ron w/a heart attack after team Tommy John took the pass on Star Lotulelei.... like eye said, philosophy, strategy and scheme are one thing, but you gotta hit on your picks, and.... not get sentimental or get sucked into how great a guy some player might be, @least in your short term estimation.

next round was pretty much just as bad, as Te'o was our first introduction to their hankerin' for the Golden Domers, not to mention we had to cough up our fourth rounder for him, and of which wouldn't be the last time we did such a thing.

Keenan has (pretty much) defied the injury bug odds and Tom had his first draft coup, and even tho he missed out on OT Terron Armstead one pick earlier.

[beachcomber]

so now whattya do now ?? the question was: what is the Chargers' identity, and what about Tom Telesco's "roster failures" ??

do you say aw shux and give the both of Tom and Anthony Ray another go 'round here, thinkin' that injuries and better luck next time will make a difference next year ??

or do you think Tom has made the same roster mistakes year in and year out, has failed to build the lines, and while not providing his coaching staff w/enough depth, and he needs to go ??

or is AL the fall guy, coz you think this is a talented roster, and that our coaching staff should be getting more outta our guys ??

in my estimation, Telesco is a (very) avg GM in terms of talent evaluation, and what he's (really) good at is public relations, media and his good guy vibe, and most importantly, it does seem like he meshes marvelously w/young Spanos.... what he has failed to do by my take is to hold court in the face of his HC and staff, let alone in tandem w/young John, and been mostly acquiescent in delivering a draft and personnel haul that hardly have his initials on it, and so.... if a defacto GM is good by you, and you know/think that in reality that this is a John Spanos run personnel op, and that we are still lapping up the boy howdy goodness that is Tom Telesco post AJ, then maybe he gets more time after running the franchise QB table w/Herbert, and in doing everything asked of him by the Spanos family ??

or do you prefer someone (HC or GM) that is gonna come in here and have 20/20 laser vision as to what a Chargers roster best looks like and how to implement a personnel program and strategy that will pay SB dividends down the road ?? easier said than done, and w/some politics in the equation as well, me thinx.... ??

[Critty]

beachcomber

have always championed three things when it came to the draft.... don't trade up, draft linemen early and often, and heavily consider durability.

I agree with the above a lot.

Although a trade up is fine if you are doing it to get a Mahomes. For instance if Chargers were at #16 last year and traded up for Herbert. Franchise QBs are that important. Or say a trade up to get Bosa. But both are trade ups into top 10 of 1st rd. So more than likely it's a better bet. You are getting a top 10. Also if your philosophy of added draft capital is occurring then you have some things to work with. But would agree its probably better to just pick player because of the hit or miss factor. Just take the extra swings.

basically it comes down to one thing, and it's not even so much philosophy or strategy related, as it is as simple as hitting on your picks.... which is not so simple.

Agree. It really comes down to this.
I would add that if you take a big picture look at the past 2 decades of draft......
The 1st rd prospects on average have the longer and better careers and contribute more. And it gets progressively worse as you move through each rd.
If your a GM for a decade. You need be great in rd 1 success. And damn good in rd 2 too. Rd 3 can be a 50/50 deal. After that it's really slim pickings on hitting any special. So I would think a strategy finding ways to take advantage of others teams who will give up picks to move up a few spots can put you in position to get as many top 100 picks.

I know I'm always offering picks up.
But it is very specific. I'm moving to the very top of draft.
Or I'm getting the best FG kicker in the league. Or I'm trying to pry away a dominant player from another team. I'm not trading up in the 2nd rd and after. I'm not trading up a spot for Gordon. I'd rather be the team trading back a few spots after rd 1 over to get more draft capital.

When Jalen Ramsey wanted out of Jax. Im thinking shutdown corners don't grow on trees. Very hard to find.
Now let's say a different GM doesn't draft Williams but instead Watson or Mahomes. Then you already have your future QB. You already have Bosa. You already have Derwin even though injured. You give up the picks to add Ramsey at that point. That's a lot of dogs. And in my view worth it.
I'd look at Colbert parting with a picks for Minkah. If you get a dog you spent wisely. If you get a mouse your wasting picks. Dominate Lock Down Corner and Dominant Pass Rushers should be very high on list of things to buy. Franchise QB and O-Line. Right at the top as well.

[Critty]

Of these free agent who gets resigned.
Henry, Tevi, Lamp, Feeney, Jenkins, Perryman, Davis, Pouncey, Ingram, Green

The next year which of these gets resigned Hayward, Joseph, Williams, Harris, Jones, White, Nwosu, Turner

going to be a very different roster depending on who stays and goes this next couple off seasons.

Herbert, Allen, Ekeler
Bosa, Murray
Is that all we can really count on. Will Derwin join them.

Can we get a Gilmore or Ramsey type CB.

What will Herbert o-line be next year?
Can Bulaga bounce back

FG Kicker?

[beachcomber]

Of these free agent who gets resigned.
Henry, Tevi, Lamp, Feeney, Jenkins, Perryman, Davis, Pouncey, Ingram, Green

The next year which of these gets resigned Hayward, Joseph, Williams, Harris, Jones, White, Nwosu, Turner

going to be a very different roster depending on who stays and goes this next couple off seasons.

Herbert, Allen, Ekeler
Bosa, Murray
Is that all we can really count on. Will Derwin join them.

Can we get a Gilmore or Ramsey type CB.

What will Herbert o-line be next year?
Can Bulaga bounce back

FG Kicker?

think the bold are resigned.... HH, Sam, Forrest, Denzel, Virgil, Mike D.

and think the all of.... Hayward, MW, Harris, Kyzir and Trai Turner are all let go THIS offseason, w/Joseph the only one resigned for 2022, and w/the both of Justin and Uchenna NOT being resigned for 2022.

and yes, Derwin bounces back ala Keenan and shakes off the injury bug that has derailed him early in his NFL career.

and yes to CB, as think we'll get someone in the draft.... later in the first after a trade eye hope.

and think the Oline still has Bulaga, Lamp and Tevi in tow and adds a FA Olineman, and two draft picks to put in the mix of our starting five there.

and sorry bro.... do like and think the Money Badger comes back for another year.

what's your plan going forward ??

[like54ninjas]

Of these free agent who gets resigned.
Henry, Tevi, Lamp, Feeney, Jenkins, Perryman, Davis, Pouncey, Ingram, Green

The next year which of these gets resigned Hayward, Joseph, Williams, Harris, Jones, White, Nwosu, Turner

going to be a very different roster depending on who stays and goes this next couple off seasons.

Herbert, Allen, Ekeler
Bosa, Murray
Is that all we can really count on. Will Derwin join them.

Can we get a Gilmore or Ramsey type CB.

What will Herbert o-line be next year?
Can Bulaga bounce back

FG Kicker?

2 of 3 out of Feeney, Lamp, or Tevi.
Davis, Henry, Jenkins.

Jones, Kyzir, Nwosu.

I’d cut Hayward and Turner this offseason.

At worst we need to bring in 2 more kickers to compete with MB this offseason.

[Critty]

think the bold are resigned.... HH, Sam, Forrest, Denzel, Virgil, Mike D.

and think the all of.... Hayward, MW, Harris, Kyzir and Trai Turner are all let go THIS offseason, w/Joseph the only one resigned for 2022, and w/the both of Justin and Uchenna NOT being resigned for 2022.

and yes, Derwin bounces back ala Keenan and shakes off the injury bug that has derailed him early in his NFL career.

and yes to CB, as think we'll get someone in the draft.... later in the first after a trade eye hope.

and think the Oline still has Bulaga, Lamp and Tevi in tow and adds a FA Olineman, and two draft picks to put in the mix of our starting five there.

and sorry bro.... do like and think the Money Badger comes back for another year.

what's your plan going forward ??

I'm thinking very basic.
QB Driven League. Points Scored. Points Allowed.

So. I need a franchise QB. And I need to protect that man.
Then I want to make life really difficult for the opponent QB.
And I need a reliable FG kicker. I want each point I can get.

We have Herbert and Bosa that fit that plan.
As much as I like everyone else on the roster. They are not as important to me as lockdown cornerback and pass rusher opposite Bosa. They are not as important as dominant offensive line. I also prefer a veteran roster. I don't want a lot of players on the field who are still learning to be professionals in the NFL.

I have targets. But I know that I may not get a chance to draft or sign a target. But I'm going to keep trying to bring in targets.

2022, Gilmore, Lattimore are set to be UFA unless they get locked up or franchise tag. I'm going after them both. Trying to land one of them. Both Hayward and Harris are also UFA in 2022.

I don't pay M.Williams. I don't pay Henry. As much as I'd like them. I need that money for lockdown corners pass rusher and offensive line. And FG kicker.

If in 2021 draft I am able to draft Sewell-OT with 1st rd pick then I'm feeling good. If he is gone. I'm trying my best to trade the 1st rd pick for 2022 1st rd pick. I have a target that will be very hard to acquire if I'm not picking high in 2022 or have draft capital to go get him. That target is Stingley-CB
If I'm able to aquire a target CB for my secondary build.
Then I have Gilmore, Lattimore or Stingley as my shutdown corner and I keep James and Jenkins as my safeties.

I feel a lot better about my defense if I add Gilmore/Lattimore or Stingley to Bosa, Murray, James.