Coach Staley Discussion - Fired

[sonorajim]

Sure, and the Chiefs got lucky yesterday too. Sometimes teams make their own luck.

They all try. Sometimes they get it right. Reid had a pretty good avg. Not perfect but better than most.
Andy is 2-1 vs Staley by a slim margin. We always play close. Even it up with an LAC W on Nov 20.

[Guest]

From Peter King FMIA:

I knew that it was almost two yards to go on the 4th down and confirmed that when I re-watched the game yesterday. That means all of the 4th down and 1 analytics are inapplicable.

King correctly points to the problem with just blindly following the analytics without considering which players are involved by noting that with a punt, we are talking about Brissett driving the ball down the field with very little time. It matters who the opponent is in that situation. That cannot be ignored, which makes it problematic when we hear Staley say the things he says about committing to the approach. I have no issue with him using the approach, but with adjusted values based upon who the opponent is.

Also, King correctly notes Lombardi's play calling weakness in tipping off the Browns that the play was a passing play. Last year against CLE, we ran the ball on 4th down from deep in our own end. Lining Herbert up under center would have been so much smarter because then the defense could not disregard the possibility of the run.

There was also talk about having Williams up against a marginal defender, but that thinking represents a failure to comprehend who Williams is--a receiver that usually does not gain much separation. That is not where you want the ball to go on a play with no disguise as Williams is easier to cover.

Even worse, the play called did not appear to scheme anyone open. There was no rub, no fake, no play action, no anything--not even the Lombardi three-yard sideline out special, which would have been an okay call if we had schemed Carter open by using Williams to create a rub so that the quicker and speedier Carter could gain quick early separation to the outside. Naturally, the one time that Lombardi did not call a three-yard out pass was the one time that it might have actually had some value as a play.

As I have said before, Lombardi has absolutely zero feel for play calling. He is Norv Turner 2.0 in that respect.

[Kellyb72601]

I’m not on the fire Staley train yet, but it won’t surprise me if he does get fired…and it wont be because of some odd personnel decisions, mysterious benchings, or 4rth down decisions…it’ll be because his defenses have been bad…scheme is over complicated when even accomplished veterans like JC jackson and SJD look like scrubs playing in his scheme…his defenses have been my biggest issue with staley…and you can’t say it’s from a lack of talent anymore, his scheme creates running opportunities for offenses and other teams have taken notice of this…even teams not known for running have run it down our throats and I for one am getting completely fed up with that bullshit…

This has been true & I think the scheme is gonna have to evolve. We do have problems at linebacker but there's enough talent out on the field the rushing D shouldn't be this bad. Serious question: Does anyone recall a Vic Fangio defense getting consistently shredded on the ground? IIRC he always had a ton of front 7 talent in chicago and denver, but if he did have a bad rushing D at any point I'd like to go back and see if there are any similarities.

[JOJAX85]

My 2 cents is Staley will be fine. His players love him for his belief in them. If Allen is on the field and not at home with a phone in his hand, he would have been ok with it too. Hopefully, however, his sphincter muscles are sore enough from trying to hold his shit in his pants that he learned from that and won't do it again.

[CanadianBoltFan]

My 2 cents is Staley will be fine. His players love him for his belief in them. If Allen is on the field and not at home with a phone in his hand, he would have been ok with it too. Hopefully, however, his sphincter muscles are sore enough from trying to hold his shit in his pants that he learned from that and won't do it again.

No such luck

Staley, even thought he was lucky as shit, and despite that most decent NFL kickers make that 4 of 5 times, was as defiant as ever and said he will make that same call every time

FFS at least excercise a better play call.

[BlazingBolt]

I did not like the 4th down call. I felt punting was the move there.

Strike against Staley in my book even though we won. Browns make that kick we are melting down right now. The FG attempt to beat you was practically handed to them because you didn't trust your defense.....I don't care if Staley says he believed we would get a stop if we didn't make it.....if your so sure your going to get a stop on a short field then punt and let your defense have an even better chance to get a stop!

IMO Staley is basically flat out lying when he says he believed in his defense getting the stop and it was part of his decision to go for it. Clearly he was scared of Cleveland's offense because he had not been able to figure out how to slow it down most of the day and he probably felt Gillman's INT that bailed them out was an unforced error they could not count on happening again. Clearly Staley was scared to give Jacoby the ball back even though he wouldn't have the running game to help him anymore. There is no way the defense can feel Staley showed confidence in them even though he lied out both sides of his mouth to try to.

[richpjr]

I did not like the 4th down call. I felt punting was the move there.

Strike against Staley in my book even though we won. Browns make that kick we are melting down right now. The FG attempt to beat you was practically handed to them because you didn't trust your defense.....I don't care if Staley says he believed we would get a stop if we didn't make it.....if your so sure your going to get a stop on a short field then punt and let your defense have an even better chance to get a stop!

IMO Staley is basically flat out lying when he says he believed in his defense getting the stop and it was part of his decision to go for it. Clearly he was scared of Cleveland's offense because he had not been able to figure out how to slow it down most of the day and he probably felt Gillman's INT that bailed them out was an unforced error they could not count on happening again. Clearly Staley was scared to give Jacoby the ball back even though he wouldn't have the running game to help him anymore. There is no way the defense can feel Staley showed confidence in them even though he lied out both sides of his mouth to try to.

We did hold the Browns to 7 points and Chubb to 37 yards rushing in the second half, so while I agree he trusted the O more than the D there, are you really surprised a coach engaged in coach-speak?

[21&500]

I did not like the 4th down call. I felt punting was the move there.

Strike against Staley in my book even though we won. Browns make that kick we are melting down right now. The FG attempt to beat you was practically handed to them because you didn't trust your defense.....I don't care if Staley says he believed we would get a stop if we didn't make it.....if your so sure your going to get a stop on a short field then punt and let your defense have an even better chance to get a stop!

IMO Staley is basically flat out lying when he says he believed in his defense getting the stop and it was part of his decision to go for it. Clearly he was scared of Cleveland's offense because he had not been able to figure out how to slow it down most of the day and he probably felt Gillman's INT that bailed them out was an unforced error they could not count on happening again. Clearly Staley was scared to give Jacoby the ball back even though he wouldn't have the running game to help him anymore. There is no way the defense can feel Staley showed confidence in them even though he lied out both sides of his mouth to try to.

Exactly. And I'd argue, would be the more appropriate response to our performance.
credit to Lambo as others have pointed out, but we still didn't win this, the Browns lost this and that's not okay.

[chargeroo]

BlazingBolt and 21&500
We spotted them 14 points at their own place and came back and got the W. Some fans are actually happy about it. Try and join in.

[SuperCharged]

I still am on the Staley bandwagon. But that took a huge chunk out of my support. They should have punted without a doubt.

That being said.... I'll take W on the road in the NFL every time.

[Xenos]

[northerner]

BlazingBolt and 21&500
We spotted them 14 points at their own place and came back and got the W. Some fans are actually happy about it. Try and join in.

this was a quality win and coming back from 14 down is huge, but we almost threw it all away with that 4th down call. both things happened.

i was thinking the game was over after we got some first downs and made them burn their time outs, and suddenly they were 10 yards away from FG range. I was in shock.