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Get Mike Williams Signed To a New Contract Now

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  • Bolt-O
    replied
    Closed.

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  • chaincrusher
    replied
    Originally posted by Boltjolt View Post

    Because Chainy don't like him and didn't like the pick so he has his agenda.
    IMO Palmer was not drafted to replace Keenan or MW. He was just drafted as we needed a WR as I guess they didn't think too highly of Hill or TBilly though he did do pretty well for us. Reed is TBD.
    I did not care for the Palmer pick for two reasons.

    One was that Spencer Brown was on the board. The front office gets an absolute F if they could not foresee the risk of injury to Bulaga coming into this season. Brown would have been a great swing OT for us in case either Slater or Bulaga got injured as he can play both LT and RT.

    One big strike against Telesco has been his inability to build quality depth. I cannot identify with the thinking of "We have Bulaga and we are okay. And if he goes down, then we have Norton and Pipkins, so we are fine." We had to know that Bulaga was a major injury risk and that we would be moving on from him. We had to know that there was a strong possibility that neither Pipkins nor Norton were strong long term solutions. The perfect replacement candidate in Brown was just sitting there on the board, a player that would likely be the starter at RT in 2022 even if Bulaga had played this season. To me, that pick was just about as obvious as Slater was in the first round.

    I cannot imagine that even the biggest Palmer homer would deny that Brown (1 sack allowed in 726 snaps for Buffalo) would have worked out better for us this season than Palmer would have and we would not still have a major issue at RT going forward, which is a top 3 position of need right now.

    And, of course, the other issue is that Palmer was a reach for us at #77 overall. The consensus big board I looked back at today had him at #148 overall. IMO, Palmer would have been good value in that range as a solid reserve WR. So, if we really loved Palmer, there was a decent chance that he would still have been on the board at #97, #118 and maybe even at #159. We weren't going to replace Allen or Williams with Palmer and Telesco should have known that because the absence of elite traits screamed out when studying Palmer, so who cares if we did not get him if we drafted to help our weak OL instead of to help what was at the time our strongest position on the entire roster?

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  • Bolt-O
    replied
    This thread is not about the WR corps, it is about retaining Mike Williams. There is no need to discuss other WRs on this team replacing his role, as it has been discussed ad nauseam.

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  • chaincrusher
    replied
    Originally posted by Parcells View Post

    Why do we accept that Palmer is a career reserve? I genuinely think the plan is for him to replace Keenan Allen. And I’m really glad that he has a chance to learn under Allen. I’m not trying to push Allen out the door, but he’s about to be 30. They have very similar body types and size, neither is particularly fast, both have good hands (at least that used to be true of KA), and if you look at their production on a per target basis it’s strikingly similar.

    Palmer caught 33 passes on 49 targets for 353 yard.
    That’s a catch rate of 67.3%, 10.7 yards per reception, 7.2 yards per target.

    Allen caught 106 passes on 157 targets for 1138 yards.
    That’s a catch rate of 67.5%, 10.7 yards per reception, 7.2 yards per target.

    I’m not saying Palmer is ready to step in and replace KA and give us his full production, but I do think the makings of a solid starting WR are there with Palmer. I keep hearing how the guy is a really hard worker and always wanting to get extra time with Herbert.

    Now, this is the thread dedicated to the topic of resigning Mike Williams, so I will say that I don’t think Palmer has much impact on whether or not to resign Williams. I remain firmly in the camp of getting him resigned to a multi year deal unless he’s wanting 18+ a year and then we just franchise him.
    I appreciate the straightforward statistical argument concerning Palmer and Allen, but I think it misses that defenses have always committed more resources to stopping Allen.

    Palmer lacks the suddenness to get open immediately with regularity that makes Allen special.

    IMO, Palmer is a reserve on any team with good WRs. He has no special ability and does not in any way resemble a starter to me.

    Palmer is clearly more talented than a guy like K.J. HIll, but just as clearly not as talented as superior WRs like Allen and Williams.

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  • chaincrusher
    replied
    Originally posted by RollingThunder View Post


    No one should be comparing Palmer to MW at this point but he is already a much better and more relaible receiver than Jaylen Guyton and will only get better. For a rookie and a 3rd round pick, not bad.

    If we don't sign MW I would expect us to go after another receiver on the market. To those of you that say MW clicks with Herbert, I'd say Herbert can click with anyone and has shown it.

    Once again, I still have concerns with how often MW disappears completely from games. If that wasn't the case, I'd be 100% on board. The guy has all the talent in the world but he needs to bring it every game and I just haven't seen that.
    Guyton is a far more valuable WR for our team as the only speedy deep receiving threat than Palmer is. No other WR on our roster can duplicate what Guyton can do. Palmer is simply a reserve WR with no special abilities.

    Palmer is not a better and more reliable receiver than Guyton. That is nonsense. The two receivers produced very similar stats in terms of targets, receptions and TDs, but Guyton had a large advantage in receiving yards and yards per reception. If we had to cut one of the two, I would cut Palmer because Guyton offers us something that none of our other WRs provide for us.

    Williams should be re-signed, assuming Williams can be re-signed at a reasonable price that is in the $17M per season range or less. He makes big plays for us and his production is strong. That decision is easy. Offer him two years worth of guaranteed money on a four year deal. That way, we have an easier way out of the deal after two seasons if Williams' production unexpectedly falls off of a cliff.

    Palmer lacks the ability to replace Williams. That much is beyond obvious. Does anyone seriously believe to the contrary?

    We also must add at least one more speedy WR to the roster. If we re-sign Andre Roberts (he just turned 34) for one more season, kept/re-signed everyone else, and added a speedy WR, that would give us the 6 WRs that our rosters have typically featured over the years, which is a better roster allocation in my view.

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  • foreigner
    replied
    Originally posted by Bolt4Knob View Post

    The one thing about Bulaga - he is due a roster bonus on the 3rd day of the new football calendar in the amount of $2.5m

    So unless they push that back - he is likely to be released. He might even retire
    Telesco has faith on him...

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  • Velo
    replied
    Originally posted by chaincrusher View Post

    Williams was injured his entire rookie season and tried to play through it when he could, but was very limited, so the comparison you are making seems like a very bad one to me.

    Palmer is not a bust, but he is also nothing special as a WR. He has no elite traits to offer unlike Williams, who has a big body and is among the best at making contested catches.

    What I have read and heard strongly suggests that Palmer has a great work ethic, but a player cannot develop abilities that he just does not have. We need to accept that Palmer is a career reserve. On his best day, he will never be capable of fully replacing Williams.
    You must be Riverwalk too.

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  • blueman
    replied
    Originally posted by Boltjolt View Post

    I'm amazed everybody would rather just prop up the offense and don't give a shit about the defense.
    Our offense is good enough,our defense is horseshit
    Not an either or. Fix both as best as the team can. We have money + picks to really improve the team in so many problem areas.

    Leave a comment:


  • ghost
    replied
    The NFL's salary cap for 2022 will rise to $208.2 million, NFL Network's Tom Pelissero reported, expanding by $25.7 million compared to this season. That is the maximum amount agreed upon by the NFL and NFL Players Association in May.

    https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/los-ange.../market-value/

    Mike Will has a projection of $16.6M per year. By Spotrac's estimation.

    Those are the facts, now from a book-keeping stand-point - always the least exciting point - is there a better reason to do the deal in the new year, when the cap will rise by $25.7 million, even though the Chargers are in good financial shape, at the current moment. Reports vary as to the Chargers being #2 and #1 in the league in cap-shape.

    The point I am making is that perhaps that Ed McGuire has suggested that the best time to offer Mike Will a new deal is Fiscal Year 2022, and it is simply a financial decision in nature.

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  • Bolt4Knob
    replied
    Originally posted by Parcells View Post

    The point being, we should be looking to bring back MW. By the time he gets more expensive, we will be looking to renegotiate or move on from KA. And while some want to franchise him, remember that contracts are not guaranteed. Write the contract such that there is a decent sized roster bonus going into year 3. If he’s a complete bust after getting big money, cut ties. If he’s kicking ass and a top 10 WR, look to renegotiate KA or cut ties.
    exactly - when MW starts making bigger money; KA will probably start making lesser money

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  • Boltjolt
    replied
    Originally posted by Parcells View Post

    The point being, we should be looking to bring back MW. By the time he gets more expensive, we will be looking to renegotiate or move on from KA. And while some want to franchise him, remember that contracts are not guaranteed. Write the contract such that there is a decent sized roster bonus going into year 3. If he’s a complete bust after getting big money, cut ties. If he’s kicking ass and a top 10 WR, look to renegotiate KA or cut ties.
    He made 15.7 mil this year. Staley says MW is a hard worker and gives 100%
    We don't have to worry about that with him.

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  • Parcells
    replied
    Originally posted by Bolt4Knob View Post

    The franchise tag is pretty much 18m but signing to a long term deal creates more cap flexibility. I think the Chargers can keep KA, continue to allow Palmer to get better and sign MW to a long term deal. Maybe after the 2022 season, Allens contract is looked at to reduce because the Williams contract will increase.

    So right now for 2022
    Allen counts 19.2
    Palmer counts 1.1
    And lets say you get Williams signed long term but his cap hit is 10.7
    That is a total of $31m of cap space - forget AAV - just cap space

    So in 2023
    Palmer counts probably 1.5m
    Allen maybe takes a bit less - say he saves you $2m
    Williams gets a bit more - his cap increases by $4

    The combined cap hit might be 33.5 to 34m - but manageable

    This could be one way to work the cap for the three Wide Receivers if the Chargers decided to give me a call
    The point being, we should be looking to bring back MW. By the time he gets more expensive, we will be looking to renegotiate or move on from KA. And while some want to franchise him, remember that contracts are not guaranteed. Write the contract such that there is a decent sized roster bonus going into year 3. If he’s a complete bust after getting big money, cut ties. If he’s kicking ass and a top 10 WR, look to renegotiate KA or cut ties.

    Leave a comment:

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