Future With Lynn?

[Guest]

So the Bills are #4 in pass block win rate and #2 pass rush win rate

Chargers are #32 in pass block win rate and #21 pass rush win rate

They give Allen time and pressure opponent well. Chargers not so much.
When Ford went out. They moved Williams over who was a veteran with 41 starts to replace him.
When Bulaga doesnt play, Charger replace him with Pipkins or Storm.

When you have the #32 pass blocking and a rookie QB, it might be a good idea to use the run game, screen game to slow up pass rush.
Oh wait they are doing that and the fans hate that terrible game planning. They say open it up early. Let Justin Pass.

But that is all Lynn fault we suck and are #32 pass blocking team, and all McDerrmott genius that they are #4 pass blocking team.
It all coaching fellas. Talent doesnt matter. Ask Chainy, he knows.

:cartman:

And the result of that pass block and pass rush win rate difference, which you want to make out to be so great is that Allen gets sacked once every 21.88 pass attempts and Herbert gets sacked once every 19.44 pass attempts. This means that Herbert gets sacked once more than Allen per every 174 pass attempts. That is not a huge difference, notwithstanding your misleading statistical citation.

Like I said, I agree that BUF has a better OL than we do, but it is important not to overstate the difference.

And we definitely should not be running the ball more when we are ranked 30th in YPC, a clear indication that we suck at running the ball. And this is especially so on early downs as our poor running game consistently puts Herbert behind the sticks, which allows the defense to...get a better pass rush. Our early down run heavy tendencies are actually a significant contributing factor to our OL's poor pass block and pass rush win rates.

If we were to throw more on early downs, our pass protection win rates would improve.

And yes, the negative results are due to Lynn's poorly conceived early down run heavy game plans.

[Randall Turner]

Even with the worst pass blocking oline in the game, the Chargers still have the 6th best passing attack in yards And 10th in TDs. Imagine how good it would be if they could block it better.

It is amazing we’re in the top 10 passing with our OL. (Aside - bear in mind our OL’s injury issues, we didn’t start the year dead last.. but yeah, we didn’t start good either.)

I think most of the credit has to go to that trainer who deflated Taylor’s lung, though. :whistlin:If it were left to Anthony, Tyrod would probably still be our starter.

I could forgive that.

Being unsure whether Herbert should remain as starter after Taylor healed? Umm.. Critty, c’mon man, the guy’s an idiot. It took me *one series*. Not rocket science.

(I need to go back and read posts from that time period, still figuring the forum out.)

[Guest]

they always know what Chargers are doing? If they knew Chargers would be getting shut out in almost every game

And here is the spin.
Even with the worst pass blocking oline in the game, the Chargers still have the 6th best passing attack in yards And 10th in TDs. Imagine how good it would be if they could block it better. Any credit to coaching for getting more out of this than than should.

Imagine how better defense would be if they had two healthy pass rushers.

This is a 2-13 team based on its offensive trench play and ability to pressure the opponent QB. But it is 6-9 because of the mitigation with run and screen game to slow down pass rush and make life a bit easier for the rookie QB.

The coaches are so many more levels better in their football IQ and game planning than fans like Chain. It actually quite absurd.
If I'm going to bet on any fans in this forum ideas on this team and it's roster and coaching. I'm betting on TPB people like Chargeroo and Ninja and Chilles and Boltjolt and Wud-dai. I'm ignoring all of Chainy advice because he would get my franchise QB wrecked.

Your analysis is BS. Your ability to cite stats and not understand why the stats are as they are is legendary.

The ineffective early down running puts Herbert behind the sticks, which makes the pass rush against us more effective.

The running plays and screens for no gain have been killing us. Where we have been spectacular is when Herbert is throwing intermediate and deep balls. Herbert has elite skills at doing that, but our head idiot will not design a game plan that features Herbert's strengths.

Imagine how good our passing offense would be if our head idiot actually used it correctly and did not set it up to fail every single week.

By your "logic", we should play Taylor at QB because any additional passing attempts pose an unwarranted risk of injury to Herbert because all QBs will somehow get injured like Burrow did even though 20 have attempted more passes than Burrow without having season ending injuries.

And it is definitely sad when fans of a team can see so clearly what a colossal screwup the head coach is. The multitude of mistakes that Lynn had made this season are not in any way subtle and that is why the vast majority agree with me that Lynn has to go.

[Boltjolt]

And the result of that pass block and pass rush win rate difference, which you want to make out to be so great is that Allen gets sacked once every 21.88 pass attempts and Herbert gets sacked once every 19.44 pass attempts. This means that Herbert gets sacked once more than Allen per every 174 pass attempts. That is not a huge difference, notwithstanding your misleading statistical citation.

Like I said, I agree that BUF has a better OL than we do, but it is important not to overstate the difference.

And we definitely should not be running the ball more when we are ranked 30th in YPC, a clear indication that we suck at running the ball. And this is especially so on early downs as our poor running game consistently puts Herbert behind the sticks, which allows the defense to...get a better pass rush. Our early down run heavy tendencies are actually a significant contributing factor to our OL's poor pass block and pass rush win rates.

If we were to throw more on early downs, our pass protection win rates would improve.

And yes, the negative results are due to Lynn's poorly conceived early down run heavy game plans.

Herbert gets sacked an average of 2.1 times per game and Burrow got sacked 3.2 times per game when you were trying to say he wasnt getting hit for weeks prior to his injury when in fact he got sacked 4 times the week before lol.

There were two games all year that he didnt get sacked but im sure he got hit in every one of them.

[Randall Turner]

Yeah, but mostly everything he says here’s accurate. Aside from characterizing Buf’s OL as only marginally better, that is.

btw, should use pressures vs. actual sacks. Herbert’s excellent at avoiding the sack.

[Boltjolt]

Yeah, but mostly everything he says here’s accurate. Aside from characterizing Buf’s OL as only marginally better, that is.

btw, should use pressures vs. actual sacks. Herbert’s excellent at avoiding the sack.

Sure if we could find data for that.

[Critty]

There is pass block win rate.
It uses 2.5 seconds as it's marker.

How often is a QB under pressure inside 2.5 seconds after snap.
You know. One thousand and one.... one thousand and two...one thousand.....

Bills are #4 best in allowing more time to throw before pressure arrives and Chargers are dead last #32 in allowing that type of pressure to arrive in QBs lap.

[Critty]

With the piss poor online play. The terrible RB and TE depth and all the injury to stars on defense.
Going 7-9 is a miracle with a rookie QB that someone from PFF said can not play QB at a professional level. And Chainy said was not worth drafting and it would be better to stick with old man Rivers.

I think I'm going credit Lynn. As Justin said he is in the QB room telling him how he wants things done.
Seems like Lynn knew the run game and screen game were very important to slow down the pass rush and balance things out so Herbert was not under fire each and every snap he drop back to pass. It appears to have worked. JH10 behind worst pass blocking line in league ends up OROY.

Lynn2021
:salute:

Chaincrusher - Fired!

:anchorjump: Happy New Year!!!!

[Randall Turner]

Sure if we could find data for that.

There’s a number of good articles on Football Outsiders about pressure rate that calculate it for past years, latest being 2019. I thought they (FO) had the stat in their data, but I can’t find it there. I’ll look around for an up-to-the-week tabulation.

[Bolt4Knob]

With the piss poor online play. The terrible RB and TE depth and all the injury to stars on defense.
Going 7-9 is a miracle with a rookie QB that someone from PFF said can not play QB at a professional level. And Chainy said was not worth drafting and it would be better to stick with old man Rivers.

I think I'm going credit Lynn. As Justin said he is in the QB room telling him how he wants things done.
Seems like Lynn knew the run game and screen game were very important to slow down the pass rush and balance things out so Herbert was not under fire each and every snap he drop back to pass. It appears to have worked. JH10 behind worst pass blocking line in league ends up OROY.

Lynn2021
:salute:

Chaincrusher - Fired!

:anchorjump: Happy New Year!!!!

Lynn deserves credit for how Herbert has come along - no question

The OL problems - thats more on Telesco in picking the players

Special Teams =- - thats on Telesco for not bringing in veterans and its also on Lynn for not firing Stewart and hiring a REAL ST coach

So, yes, Badgely missed the FG against the SAints but the Chargers had a big lead; Kelley fumbled against the Bucs but that should have been three kneel downs with the clock and timeouts Tampa had left (they had two so if you kneel three times, halftime and my guess, if the Chargers knelt once, BA was going straight in and not using his time outs) The Panthers game - well yes, the lateral would have been nice but the team came out flat

Denver - no excuses - coaching, taking foot off gas and just leaving too many seconds on the clock at critical times
KC - the Herbert INT was bad but have to give Butker credit - two huge kicks, one down 17-6 and one to win in OT> That one down 17-6 was ove r50 yards

So yes some on players, some on Telesco but that doesn't absolve Lynn of his coaching style during games
And I don't see that getting better

I also don't think TT knows how to build an OL - so thats why I am firing both!

[Randall Turner]

There is pass block win rate.
It uses 2.5 seconds as it's marker.

How often is a QB under pressure inside 2.5 seconds after snap.
You know. One thousand and one.... one thousand and two...one thousand.....

Bills are #4 best in allowing more time to throw before pressure arrives and Chargers are dead last #32 in allowing that type of pressure to arrive in QBs lap.

Yes, read it when you posted it, and yes, that is analogous to pressure rate. So use that, not sacks. (Which you did.)

But if you’re going to credit Lynn for Herbert’s performance, he should be Coach of the Year. I don’t think so.

Aside - I’m rewatching our September game against Chiefs, and reading the old game thread. This site (among many others) has all our old games, sans commercials...

https://nflfullhd.com/2020/09/21/kansas-city-chiefs-vs-los-angeles-chargers-20-sep-2020-replay-full-game/

[Critty]

It is amazing we’re in the top 10 passing with our OL. (Aside - bear in mind our OL’s injury issues, we didn’t start the year dead last.. but yeah, we didn’t start good either.)

I think most of the credit has to go to that trainer who deflated Taylor’s lung, though. :whistlin:If it were left to Anthony, Tyrod would probably still be our starter.

I could forgive that.

Being unsure whether Herbert should remain as starter after Taylor healed? Umm.. Critty, c’mon man, the guy’s an idiot. It took me *one series*. Not rocket science.

(I need to go back and read posts from that time period, still figuring the forum out.)

Wait. Before Justin was even drafted we all knew he had better arm talent than Tyrod. We all knew Tyrod was just a placeholder for whoever next franchise QB would be. And we all heard Lynn say in pre-season Justin would compete for the starter job. And then there was no pre season. So that change how it would play out. I'm confident if there is pre season and no Tyrod injury. Justin wins the job and starts.

Also Lynn comments are often typical coach speak.
There are many levels here. Yes Justin is more talented. Lynn knew that. But he isn't as familiar or experienced in regard to the playbook and the NFL game. He doesn't have the same level of knowledge and experience in the system as Tyrod.
And there is also Lynn not wanting to tip his hand to opponent of his intentions. Coaches do that all the time. And there is Lynn wanting to see JH10 continue to play well and show progress on gameday before the final sign off.

Let say for example. After that first Chiefs game which you knew was obvious. Again we all know who has better arm talent.
But let's say
Herbert started to really struggle to adjust. Was turning it over a lot. And playing like a rookie over his head.
Then going back to Tyrod would make sense. Which is why I think Lynn was a bit non committal after Justin started.
Lynn let it play out organically. He said the whole time, he wasn't going to put a date on it. It could be right away from game 1 or it could be a year or two. But he wasn't going to force Justin into the starter role. Whenever his time came, is when he would start. Well it played out and Justin became the starter.

I'm sorry. whether it's Lynn or any HC, I just cannot buy this idea that an HC should start his new QB right away because it's obvious they are more talented than the other guy. That not what coaches do. They say I've got a 5th year senior and a freshman. And I wanted them to compete in pre season and we canceled.pre season. So I'm starting my 5th year senior. And then we senior gets hurt and freshman comes in and plays well game 1. And media ask HC, any HC at any level about the freshman starting for rest of season. That HC will often be non committal at that point. It senseable and very common to not want to put that much pressure on a freshman after an emergency start.

So, IMO..this Tyrod and Herbert thing is non sense. Nothing to see here. Just a complaint with holes in it that holds no water about the HC.